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Formula 1 2019 - General Discussion Thread

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Comments

  • #1082
    mickdw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,256 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    It has often happened down the years that a chassis was just a pig.
    It can be as simple as incorrectly laid down carbon fibre layers not giving the specified rigidity.
    A rushed car built by a team with poor funding can have this result.
    The car is probably way overweight too which again can be a result of rushed underfunded team.


  • #1083
    Vic_08
    Registered Users Posts: 3,041 ✭✭✭Vic_08


    chicorytip wrote: »
    Contracts can be broken. I think he needs to improve his race, as opposed to qualifying, performance. He finished sixteen seconds behind Russell despite having one less pitstop on Sunday. The method he has developed for turning the steering wheel is effective up to a point but he must be losing a lot of time through the corners and chicanes in comparison to his fully able bodied competitors. Williams are not going to keep him on if he remains so far adrift in the latter stages of the season.

    Are you completely incapable of reading and understanding facts?

    It has already been posted on this thread that Kubica's chassis is badly performing in comparison to Russell's, comparing them to each other in this situation is meaningless.


  • #1084
    Jordan 199
    Registered Users Posts: 11,619 ✭✭✭✭Jordan 199


    Peyton Lively Tiller wrote: »

    Paddy Lowe & Claire Williams have a lot to answer for, I just hope that Patrick Head can at least do something to ease the damage, the season was a write off before it even began.

    As soon as Patrick gets familiar with the technical regulations, we will see if he can help improve the car.

    As for Lowe, I wonder if he will ever work in F1 again.


  • #1085
    chicorytip
    Registered Users Posts: 4,081 ✭✭✭chicorytip


    Vic_08 wrote:
    It has already been posted on this thread that Kubica's chassis is badly performing in comparison to Russell's, comparing them to each other in this situation is meaningless.

    Vic_08 wrote:
    Are you completely incapable of reading and understanding facts?


    An 8% differential, if it in fact exists, should not lead to such a disparity in performance. The cars are identical in every way. Once a car has been designed and built there are no changes a driver can then make to alter it's characteristics. Kubica has been complaining about not being able to acheive the right "set up". This is gibberish. You just drive the wheels off whatever you are given even if it means, in Williams case, racing your own teammate a lap or two behind the leaders.


  • #1086
    ayux4rj6zql2ph
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,001 ✭✭✭ayux4rj6zql2ph


    chicorytip wrote: »
    An 8% differential, if it in fact exists, should not lead to such a disparity in performance. The cars are identical in every way. Once a car has been designed and built there are no changes a driver can then make to alter it's characteristics. Kubica has been complaining about not being able to acheive the right "set up". This is gibberish. You just drive the wheels off whatever you are given even if it means, in Williams case, racing your own teammate a lap or two behind the leaders.

    I recall during Hockenheim 2001 both Minardi's caught fire on the grid, Alonso was given the spare car, Tarso Marques got Alonso's car, not much time for setup changes there. The car is just a pig end of, Russell got a chance to show that he was 2 seconds faster around Bahrain in the Mercedes compared to the Williams during the recent test, were Kubica afforded the same opportunity maybe then the critics could lambaste. I don't think that even Hamilton himself could score a point in a Williams.


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  • #1087
    ayux4rj6zql2ph
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,001 ✭✭✭ayux4rj6zql2ph


    Jordan 199 wrote: »
    As soon as Patrick gets familiar with the technical regulations, we will see if he can help improve the car.

    As for Lowe, I wonder if he will ever work in F1 again.

    The season is already a write-off.


  • #1088
    mickdw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,256 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    chicorytip wrote: »
    Vic_08 wrote:
    It has already been posted on this thread that Kubica's chassis is badly performing in comparison to Russell's, comparing them to each other in this situation is meaningless.

    Vic_08 wrote:
    Are you completely incapable of reading and understanding facts?


    An 8% differential, if it in fact exists, should not lead to such a disparity in performance. The cars are identical in every way. Once a car has been designed and built there are no changes a driver can then make to alter it's characteristics. Kubica has been complaining about not being able to acheive the right "set up". This is gibberish. You just drive the wheels off whatever you are given even if it means, in Williams case, racing your own teammate a lap or two behind the leaders.

    Either you have no understanding of anything to do with F1 cars or you are simply taking the piss.


  • #1089
    Vic_08
    Registered Users Posts: 3,041 ✭✭✭Vic_08


    chicorytip wrote: »
    An 8% differential, if it in fact exists, should not lead to such a disparity in performance.

    That does not even make sense in any way.

    In the context of F1 8% is the difference between pole position and not being allowed to take part in a race. It would be a vast difference, 8% off pole would be more than halfway to an F2 car.

    For the record Williams are around 3.5% slower than Merc/Ferrari.
    chicorytip wrote: »
    The cars are identical in every way.

    The cars are not identical, they should be but are not, Russell has driven both and said so, Kubica's is far less stable in the corners.
    chicorytip wrote: »
    Once a car has been designed and built there are no changes a driver can then make to alter it's characteristics. Kubica has been complaining about not being able to acheive the right "set up". This is gibberish. You just drive the wheels off whatever you are given even if it means, in Williams case, racing your own teammate a lap or two behind the leaders.

    That is just stupid, I am not even going to waste my time in explaining all the ways it is stupid, there is just too much stupidity to bother.

    Honestly you need to just stop posting your opinions here, you are just proving Mark Twain correct.


  • #1090
    pjohnson
    Registered Users Posts: 23,095 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    mickdw wrote: »
    Either you have no understanding of anything to do with F1 cars or you are simply taking the piss.

    It made more sense when he claimed Grosjean deserved the Ferrari seat ahead of Leclerc. Just ignoring an 8% difference in a sport where hundreths of a second can be crucial.


  • #1091
    Rossi IRL
    Registered Users Posts: 8,369 ✭✭✭Rossi IRL


    Another case of daddy wanting a team for his son to drive in.

    Guy trying to take over Williams

    https://twitter.com/RobChinchero/status/1118485601915932672?s=19


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  • #1092
    chicorytip
    Registered Users Posts: 4,081 ✭✭✭chicorytip


    mickdw wrote:
    Either you have no understanding of anything to do with F1 cars or you are simply taking the piss.

    Vic_08 wrote:
    In the context of F1 8% is the difference between pole position and not being allowed to take part in a race. It would be a vast difference, 8% off pole would be more than halfway to an F2 car.

    Vic_08 wrote:
    The cars are not identical, they should be but are not, Russell has driven both and said so, Kubica's is far less stable in the corners.

    Vic_08 wrote:
    That is just stupid, I am not even going to waste my time in explaining all the ways it is stupid, there is just too much stupidity to bother.


    I simply pose the question - how can two cars that are designed and manufactured to the exact same specifications and powered by the exact same power unit be then described as "different" to one another? It's almost as if you are attributing human characteristics to a machine. The only apparent "difference" is the unique driving style of the Polish pilot. It does not require a masters degree in mechanical engineering to comprehend this simple reality.


  • #1093
    donspeekinglesh
    Registered Users Posts: 1,861 ✭✭✭donspeekinglesh


    chicorytip wrote: »
    I simply pose the question - how can two cars that are designed and manufactured to the exact same specifications and powered by the exact same power unit be then described as "different" to one another? It's almost as if you are attributing human characteristics to a machine. The only apparent "difference" is the unique driving style of the Polish pilot. It does not require a masters degree in mechanical engineering to comprehend this simple reality.

    If there's a difference in torsional rigidity between the tubs then they weren't manufactured to the exact same specs.


  • #1094
    pjohnson
    Registered Users Posts: 23,095 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    chicorytip wrote: »
    I simply pose the question - how can two cars that are designed and manufactured to the exact same specifications and powered by the exact same power unit be then described as "different" to one another? It's almost as if you are attributing human characteristics to a machine. The only apparent "difference" is the unique driving style of the Polish pilot. It does not require a masters degree in mechanical engineering to comprehend this simple reality.

    Answer this question then how come Russell when driving Kubica's (what you claim to be identical) car set a slower time than what Kubica managed later that same day?


  • #1095
    chicorytip
    Registered Users Posts: 4,081 ✭✭✭chicorytip


    pjohnson wrote:
    Answer this question then how come Russell when driving Kubica's (what you claim to be identical) car set a slower time than what Kubica managed later that same day?


    He just happened to be slower on that particular occasion.The time difference was minimal, less than three tenths, which is not remarkable in any team.


  • #1096
    mickdw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,256 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    chicorytip wrote: »
    mickdw wrote:
    Either you have no understanding of anything to do with F1 cars or you are simply taking the piss.

    Vic_08 wrote:
    In the context of F1 8% is the difference between pole position and not being allowed to take part in a race. It would be a vast difference, 8% off pole would be more than halfway to an F2 car.

    Vic_08 wrote:
    The cars are not identical, they should be but are not, Russell has driven both and said so, Kubica's is far less stable in the corners.

    Vic_08 wrote:
    That is just stupid, I am not even going to waste my time in explaining all the ways it is stupid, there is just too much stupidity to bother.


    I simply pose the question - how can two cars that are designed and manufactured to the exact same specifications and powered by the exact same power unit be then described as "different" to one another? It's almost as if you are attributing human characteristics to a machine. The only apparent "difference" is the unique driving style of the Polish pilot. It does not require a masters degree in mechanical engineering to comprehend this simple reality.
    Going back to the late 80s, the earlier days of carbon tubs and there were serious differences from car to car, mostly down to the carbon layering.
    It is only in more recent times that you would have heard drivers praise the team for building up a new tub after a big smash and it feeling the same as the crashed car. It is therefore easy to see how a team under pressure to get a car on the grid could produce 2 cars with some differing characteristics.
    This is all silly stuff though. The real issue is Williams inability to provide him with a new chassis.


  • #1097
    pjohnson
    Registered Users Posts: 23,095 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    chicorytip wrote: »
    He just happened to be slower on that particular occasion.The time difference was minimal, less than three tenths, which is not remarkable in any team.

    Yeah you are just at it again a la your Old Man Kimi fetish. Pointless.


  • #1098
    chicorytip
    Registered Users Posts: 4,081 ✭✭✭chicorytip


    pjohnson wrote:
    Yeah you are just at it again a la your Old Man Kimi fetish. Pointless.


    I actually like and respect the guy as I do Kimi. Had he not suffered the injury he could well have become world champion. I hope he will at least be able to match the performance of his team mate. Baku and Monaco will prove challenging for him.


  • #1099
    Harika
    Registered Users Posts: 4,403 ✭✭✭Harika


    Besides the obvious failure of Williams. I am very disappointed by Giovanazzi and Gasly, both are absolutely destroyed by their team mates.


  • #1100
    Jordan 199
    Registered Users Posts: 11,619 ✭✭✭✭Jordan 199


    Kimi has had a great start to the season at Alfa Romeo. Scored points in all three races so far.


  • #1101
    chicorytip
    Registered Users Posts: 4,081 ✭✭✭chicorytip


    Harika wrote:
    Besides the obvious failure of Williams. I am very disappointed by Giovanazzi and Gasly, both are absolutely destroyed by their team mates.

    Jordan 199 wrote:
    Kimi has had a great start to the season at Alfa Romeo. Scored points in all three races so far.


    I think Giovannzzi and, in particular, Gasly will improve considerably as the season progresses.


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  • #1102
    ayux4rj6zql2ph
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,001 ✭✭✭ayux4rj6zql2ph


    Harika wrote: »
    Besides the obvious failure of Williams. I am very disappointed by Giovanazzi and Gasly, both are absolutely destroyed by their team mates.

    Red Bull will act fast if Gasly doesn’t improve. If he’s jettisoned back to TR will Kvyat or Albon get the gig.


  • #1103
    AMKC
    Registered Users Posts: 15,512 ✭✭✭✭AMKC
    Ms


    Jordan 199 wrote: »
    Kimi has had a great start to the season at Alfa Romeo. Scored points in all three races so far.

    Yes he has done great so far and surprised some people to I would say. I would also say as long as it keeps going like that I think Kimi will be very happy and who knows maybe he will get on the podium some time this season too which would be great for Alfa.

    As for Williams I just think it very sad the state that team is in and maybe there is some billionaire out there that might buy it and get them back on the right track again. It has been 7 years since they won last.

    Live long and Prosper

    Peace and long life.



  • #1104
    ayux4rj6zql2ph
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,001 ✭✭✭ayux4rj6zql2ph


    AMKC wrote: »
    It has been 7 years since they won last.

    What’s more harrowing is that 2012 victory remains the only one since Interlagos in October 2004, the same year Williams had the Walrus style nose on the car.


  • #1105
    chicorytip
    Registered Users Posts: 4,081 ✭✭✭chicorytip


    AMKC wrote:
    Yes he has done great so far and surprised some people to I would say. I would also say as long as it keeps going like that I think Kimi will be very happy and who knows maybe he will get on the podium some time this season too which would be great for Alfa.


    I would say his performances have been of average standard. You would expect Alfa to be scoring these points anyway. His qualifying times and race performances are only very slightly improved compared to Leclerc's first three races last year. That's what you get from Kimi these days. He may be feeling relaxed and Alfa seem pleased with him but he's certainly not getting any quicker as he nears the forty mark.


  • #1106
    AMKC
    Registered Users Posts: 15,512 ✭✭✭✭AMKC
    Ms


    chicorytip wrote: »
    I would say his performances have been of average standard. You would expect Alfa to be scoring these points anyway. His qualifying times and race performances are only very slightly improved compared to Leclerc's first three races last year. That's what you get from Kimi these days. He may be feeling relaxed and Alfa seem pleased with him but he's certainly not getting any quicker as he nears the forty mark.

    You my be right but he also brings a lot of experience and knowledge that the Alfa team are happy to have at the moment while they rebuild.

    Live long and Prosper

    Peace and long life.



  • #1107
    mickdw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,256 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    Peyton Lively Tiller wrote: »
    AMKC wrote: »
    It has been 7 years since they won last.

    What’s more harrowing is that 2012 victory remains the only one since Interlagos in October 2004, the same year Williams had the Walrus style nose on the car.
    What's more harrowing is that I believe that 2012 victory was not legit.
    Bernie might just have hijacked a batch of Pirelli tyres and swapped in some different ones as a 70th birthday present for Frank.


  • #1108
    ayux4rj6zql2ph
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,001 ✭✭✭ayux4rj6zql2ph


    mickdw wrote: »
    What's more harrowing is that I believe that 2012 victory was not legit.
    Bernie might just have hijacked a batch of Pirelli tyres and swapped in some different ones as a 70th birthday present for Frank.

    Could the same not be said for Damon Hill’s Near miss at Hungary 1997 in the Arrows? The Bridgestone’s on his car were at another level that day.

    Had McLaren not short fueled Hamilton in Spain for qualifying and he started from pole instead of dead last, it is possible he could have gone on to win instead of starting at the back and finishing 8th.


  • #1109
    Harika
    Registered Users Posts: 4,403 ✭✭✭Harika


    Williams up for sale https://www.racefans.net/2019/04/18/mazepin-not-in-talks-to-buy-williams-says-company/
    I know the article states different but that just means the opposite in F1


  • #1110
    mickdw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,256 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    Peyton Lively Tiller wrote: »
    mickdw wrote: »
    What's more harrowing is that I believe that 2012 victory was not legit.
    Bernie might just have hijacked a batch of Pirelli tyres and swapped in some different ones as a 70th birthday present for Frank.

    Could the same not be said for Damon Hill’s Near miss at Hungary 1997 in the Arrows? The Bridgestone’s on his car were at another level that day.

    Had McLaren not short fueled Hamilton in Spain for qualifying and he started from pole instead of dead last, it is possible he could have gone on to win instead of starting at the back and finishing 8th.
    I don't see a valid comparison at all.
    If the Bridgestone on hills arrows were the tyre to be one, so be it. They were a new tyre company into the sport. That's a lot different to the possibility of a controlled standard tyre being issues to a team with a differing compound to everyone else.


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  • #1111
    ayux4rj6zql2ph
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,001 ✭✭✭ayux4rj6zql2ph


    mickdw wrote: »
    I don't see a valid comparison at all.
    If the Bridgestone on hills arrows were the tyre to be one, so be it. They were a new tyre company into the sport. That's a lot different to the possibility of a controlled standard tyre being issues to a team with a differing compound to everyone else.

    It was he only car that was competitive on those tyres. The next best was Nakano in the Prost who finished 6th only after taking Irvine out on the final lap.

    Villeneuve, Herbert,both Schumachers, Irvine and Frentzen, who was leading until his fuel cap fell off were all on Goodyear’s.


This discussion has been closed.
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