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Woman Loses Job for Holding Gender Critical Opinions.

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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭RasTa


    ^ That's your problem then, looking at Twitter.


  • Registered Users Posts: 531 ✭✭✭Candamir


    Augme wrote: »
    Well, if it's on Twitter....

    It’s in real life too, but I’m not a transphobic, ‘not into dick’ lesbian, so it’s not directed at me.

    Anyways, if Twitter doesn’t count, I guess Martina Navratilova can have her job back.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,194 ✭✭✭Zorya


    People need to decide whether they want to be in politics or work in the private sector. .

    And what happens when it spreads to the private sector? When it is enshrined in legislation that everyone must accept and recite feelings over biology in all circumstances?


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    El_Bee wrote: »
    It should be in some cases, in many ways free speech was a mistake.


    Because it doesn't conform to yours ?

    Freedom of Speech and Freedom of opinion.

    If you do not like it, move to a dictatorship and see how you get on.

    In my opinion there is too much shíte talk about this whole subject for what is a minuscule issue. She is very likely to win her case.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,435 ✭✭✭✭EmmetSpiceland


    Zorya wrote: »
    And what happens when it spreads to the private sector? When it is enshrined in legislation that everyone must accept and recite feelings over biology in all circumstances?

    You work under the guidelines the employer sets out for you. If you don’t like them you don’t have to work there.

    There are currently a large number of teachers working in catholic schools teaching religion to kids, the ones who don’t have a problem with that carry on, the ones who do teach in a non-denominational.

    The tide is turning…



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,010 ✭✭✭Augme


    Candamir wrote: »
    It’s in real life too, but I’m not a transphobic, ‘not into dick’ lesbian, so it’s not directed at me.

    Anyways, if Twitter doesn’t count, I guess Martina Navratilova can have her job back.

    Ive never seen or heard of a situation where a lesbian has had to have sex with someone who has a penis because "society" told her to.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 34 Elmer Jones


    You work under the guidelines the employer sets out for you. If you don’t like them you don’t have to work there.

    There are currently a large number of teachers working in catholic schools teaching religion to kids, the ones who don’t have a problem with that carry on, the ones who do teach in a non-denominational.

    She didn't express those opinions in work.

    Your employer should have no control over opinions you express outside of work.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,194 ✭✭✭Zorya


    STB. wrote: »
    Because it doesn't conform to yours ?

    Freedom of Speech and Freedom of opinion.

    If you do not like it, move to a dictatorship and see how you get on.

    In my opinion there is too much shíte talk about this whole subject for what is a minuscule issue. She is very likely to win her case.

    There is a lot of ****e talk and maybe it is a fringe issue but it has much wider implications that will only grow in time - there is now compulsory speech, but eventually there will be compulsory thought.
    Essentially what one is asked to believe and say is that a human being changes their sex according to their inner feelings. This is not possible.
    I am not saying that people should not be allowed to feel like whatever sex they want, that's fine and it has no implications in most of ordinary life - but when it comes to certain important and pragmatic issues like prisons, domestic violence refuges, rape crises shelters, hospitals, sports scholarships, showering facilities in secondary schools and so on - these are open to abuse, even by messers and also by people with bad intentions.


  • Site Banned Posts: 51 ✭✭Brendan Delaney


    Once again, a person was allowed an opinion and faced the consequences of having that opinion.

    Saying things have consequences!

    I'm free to call my boss all manners of names to their face, however the consequence would be that I'd probably get sacked.

    I don't get how people have forgotten that consequences are actual things!

    'People should aspire to be submissive bootlickers who never question anything'.


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus




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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,167 ✭✭✭Fr_Dougal


    Will somebody wake me up when all of this is over and tell me what I should think, please. It seems that none of us are allowed to have our own views on certain subjects anymore.

    I’ll draw the line at calling myself ‘cis’, isn’t it gas that the same people who want us to accept all LBGTQ+ terms, are the very ones who want us to change how straight people refer to themselves.

    Let the double standards continue until they eat themselves.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,435 ✭✭✭✭EmmetSpiceland


    She didn't express those opinions in work.

    Your employer should have no control over opinions you express outside of work.

    When you become “world renowned” for your work I think the waters get muddied.

    A junior employee who no one knows where they are employed is probably fine to spout nonsense but when you’re further up the food chain you’re going to face potential consequences, whether right or wrong.

    The tide is turning…



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,010 ✭✭✭Augme


    She didn't express those opinions in work.

    Your employer should have no control over opinions you express outside of work.


    Employers can never control what an employee says outside work. However an employer should have the right to decide if they want to no longer employ someone based on opinions they have expressed outside of work.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,482 ✭✭✭Gimme A Pound


    Once again, a person was allowed an opinion and faced the consequences of having that opinion.

    Saying things have consequences!

    I'm free to call my boss all manners of names to their face, however the consequence would be that I'd probably get sacked.

    I don't get how people have forgotten that consequences are actual things!
    And in this case the consequences are ridiculously harsh, which is what's being discussed. Anyone can see that if they're honest.

    She didn't call her boss anything.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,194 ✭✭✭Zorya



    I read that article once last year SC, please don't make me read it again :p


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    You work under the guidelines the employer sets out for you. If you don’t like them you don’t have to work there.

    There are currently a large number of teachers working in catholic schools teaching religion to kids, the ones who don’t have a problem with that carry on, the ones who do teach in a non-denominational.


    Yes but she wasn't a religion teacher working in a catholic school.


    She was working in a tink tank. She was fired on the grounds that she used ''offensive and exclusionary language'' and that she is ''fear-mongering''.


    They will not be able to prove any of that. The gobshíte employers made a massive mistake tackling the issue with dismissal, and are on a hiding to nothing. The fact that they are a Tink Tank makes it all the worse.


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,880 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    STB. wrote: »
    Because it doesn't conform to yours ?

    Freedom of Speech and Freedom of opinion.

    If you do not like it, move to a dictatorship and see how you get on.

    In my opinion there is too much shíte talk about this whole subject for what is a minuscule issue. She is very likely to win her case.

    Different things. Everyone has freedom of opionin, not everyone has freedom of speech.
    You work under the guidelines the employer sets out for you. If you don’t like them you don’t have to work there.

    There are currently a large number of teachers working in catholic schools teaching religion to kids, the ones who don’t have a problem with that carry on, the ones who do teach in a non-denominational.

    BUt does the employer have a right to dictate to you hoe you express yourself outside of the workplace?

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,070 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn


    Once again, a person was allowed an opinion and faced the consequences of having that opinion.

    Saying things have consequences!

    I'm free to call my boss all manners of names to their face, however the consequence would be that I'd probably get sacked.

    I don't get how people have forgotten that consequences are actual things!

    If people get fired for fairly moderate opinions then we hardly live in a free society. I don’t buy the only governments can censor ideology.


  • Registered Users Posts: 531 ✭✭✭Candamir


    Augme wrote: »
    Ive never seen or heard of a situation where a lesbian has had to have sex with someone who has a penis because "society" told her to.



    So it’s ok so long as nobody is actually forced to have sex against their will.

    Do you think the bullying that these lesbians get is ok?
    Would it be ok if it were young heterosexual women who were being bullied on twitter for not ‘putting out’ ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,134 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    El_Bee wrote: »
    in many ways free speech was a mistake.

    Never, ever get into a position of power.

    Fcuk Putin. Glory to Ukraine!



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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,194 ✭✭✭Zorya


    When you become “world renowned” for your work I think the waters get muddied.

    A junior employee who no one knows where they are employed is probably fine to spout nonsense but when you’re further up the food chain you’re going to face potential consequences, whether right or wrong.

    I can see the point in what you are saying. But it is a dangerous road to go down. Say I work for a big corporation but on my free time I write about flat earth or reincarnation or vaccinations or reptilian overlords or religious perspectives or pro-life issues or solar influence on climate change or Russian non-collusion etc etc (topics picked randomly, people!). Where does it stop? Who defines what anyone can say? What you or I think now on multiple issues may be unacceptable, if not now then at some other time?
    And especially on matters of gender ideology - this should be WHOLLY open to question and transparent debate.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,010 ✭✭✭Augme


    Candamir wrote: »
    So it’s ok so long as nobody is actually forced to have sex against their will.

    Do you think the bullying that these lesbians get is ok?
    Would it be ok if it were young heterosexual women who were being bullied on twitter for not ‘putting out’ ?


    I've never seen this bullying. Can you link to a Twitter thread on it? Is there an article about it even?


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,076 ✭✭✭✭How Soon Is Now


    Fr_Dougal wrote: »
    Will somebody wake me up when all of this is over and tell me what I should think, please. It seems that none of us are allowed to have our own views on certain subjects anymore.

    I’ll draw the line at calling myself ‘cis’, isn’t it gas that the same people who want us to accept all LBGTQ+ terms, are the very ones who want us to change how straight people refer to themselves.

    Let the double standards continue until they eat themselves.

    The very reason why I refuse to get involved in anything to do with supporting them.

    They only want our views and support when they need it. Otherwise shut up your wrong!


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    Different things. Everyone has freedom of opionin, not everyone has freedom of speech.


    I know that they are two different things. I was stating that to the poster I was replying to who doesn't seem to recognise either, when a differing opinion is described as "ILLEGAL".


    This whole trans area gets too much attention. In terms of the article, I thought it was reasoned.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,994 ✭✭✭c.p.w.g.w


    Zorya wrote: »
    I read that article once last year SC, please don't make me read it again :p

    I got to point 2 and just lol'd absolutely absorbed carry on


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,758 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    Augme wrote: »
    Employers can never control what an employee says outside work. However an employer should have the right to decide if they want to no longer employ someone based on opinions they have expressed outside of work.

    If I say, I believe that people with a penis are men and people with a vagina are women, can my employer sack me - legally?

    If so, what next..............

    I say I don't like cheese outside of work, can my employer decide they no longer want to employ me? Can they sack me - legally?


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,102 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Zorya wrote: »
    Maya Forstater is a internationally renowned researcher on Tax Avoidance, who worked until recently at the London office of the Centre for Global Development (CGD) think tank.

    In March she wrote an article calling for open debate about the consequences of Gender Self ID, particularly with respect to the implications for women. She says womanhood is defined by biological fact not by feeling.

    This is the article.
    https://medium.com/@MForstater/international-development-lets-talk-about-sex-eb9de927c787

    She has been fired from her position on the grounds that she used ''offensive and exclusionary language'' and that she is ''fear-mongering''.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/tax-expert-fired-for-saying-trans-women-aren-t-women-tpqgnm9vj





    She is taking her employer to court to argue that ...



    https://www.crowdjustice.com/case/fired-maya/

    When people are so gleeful about certain opinions being censored on internet platfroms, remember that censorship can extend exponentially. Their opinions censored today, yours tomorrow. Their job today, yours tomorrow.

    Biological facts are now a reason for censorship and job loss.

    Example 6743 of there is a growing anti science, cultist fanatic mindset in the modern Left, in the more prominent activists at that.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,181 ✭✭✭Charles Ingles


    That it have come full circle.
    Women have fought for year's for equality we finally achieve it .
    Then a woman is sacked because she doesn't agree that a man In a dress is a woman.
    Women suffer the most from the trans agenda


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,194 ✭✭✭Zorya


    BattleCorp wrote: »
    If I say, I believe that people with a penis are men and people with a vagina are women, can my employer sack me - legally?

    No, because this is true.

    However you may be compelled to say that people with a penis are women and people with a vagina are men.
    Not transwomen or transmen, but simply women or men.
    That is where you cannot be allowed to have divergent thought, it appears.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,676 ✭✭✭strandroad


    When you become “world renowned” for your work I think the waters get muddied.

    A junior employee who no one knows where they are employed is probably fine to spout nonsense but when you’re further up the food chain you’re going to face potential consequences, whether right or wrong.

    Yes it's exactly like the Israel Folau situation. They were posting as their named and employer-affiliated selves. He was saying that gays go to hell, she was saying that you can only be what you are born as and no provisions should be made to accommodate you otherwise because you're a threat = the content stigmatised a particular group potentially present among the employers staff and most certainly present among their customer base. They received warnings but continued regardless.


This discussion has been closed.
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