Healthy alternatives to butter?

Alf Veedersane · 30-10-2019 7:59pm

Social Medium wrote: »

Wall of text

For everyone's sake, just link the page you copied and pasted all that from.

igCorcaigh · 30-10-2019 7:59pm

Social Medium wrote: »

I generally follow the advice of Mark Sisson and Chris Kesser when it comes to nutrition. They reference studies when discussing the health properties of foods. I first learned about the health benefits of grass fed butter from Tim Ferris, when he discussed the work of Weston A Price.

Yeah, I know some of the names.
And the emphasis on grass fed seems to be an American thing. We're lucky here to have livestock eating grass, at least during the summer months.

AllForIt · 30-10-2019 8:01pm

I gave up buttered bread a few months ago (cause low starchy carb diet) but I put butter on my veg every day for dinner. I can't think of a better way to make any farmhouse vegetable taste better more economically, more easily, more healthily, than a good knob of full fat butter. I often wonder especially when it comes to teenagers how anyone can say they don't like vegetables. Any vegetables. Except chips of course which is a vegetable with added fat. I can understand if they are presented with them plain but with added butter I find them all totally delicious. I think adding butter is a fantastic way to accustomed one's pallet to the taste of vegetables where in time you get to like the pure taste of the vegetable on on it's own with a minimum of butter on them.

igCorcaigh · 30-10-2019 8:03pm

Very true, although I prefer olive oil and a bit of vinegar to balance the earthiness of some veg.

emaherx · 30-10-2019 8:15pm

igCorcaigh wrote: »

We're lucky here to have livestock eating grass, at least during the summer months.

And Spring and Autumn and even in Winter in the form of hay/silage, so pretty much all year round.

igCorcaigh · 30-10-2019 8:17pm

emaherx wrote: »

And Spring and Autumn and even in Winter in the form of hay/silage, so pretty much all year round.

The Europeans here love our butter.
All the rain has its benefits!

Tar.Aldarion · 31-10-2019 10:47am

AllForIt wrote: »

I gave up buttered bread a few months ago (cause low starchy carb diet) but I put butter on my veg every day for dinner. I can't think of a better way to make any farmhouse vegetable taste better more economically, more easily, more healthily, than a good knob of full fat butter. I often wonder especially when it comes to teenagers how anyone can say they don't like vegetables. Any vegetables. Except chips of course which is a vegetable with added fat. I can understand if they are presented with them plain but with added butter I find them all totally delicious. I think adding butter is a fantastic way to accustomed one's pallet to the taste of vegetables where in time you get to like the pure taste of the vegetable on on it's own with a minimum of butter on them.

There are evolutionary/physical reasons that younger people don't like vegetables. They avoid bitter foods (associated with poison) and have more taste receptors - they taste things more strongly. Also vegetables in Ireland tend to be cooked terribly, on average. Spices are a better option than adding butter to every single vegetable you eat, spices are very healthy and well, taste good. If somebody doesn't just like the plain old veg, that will help immensely. I've had a lot of people tell me they hate cauliflower, brought them to a restaurant where a roast cauliflower was the dish they had and they were amazed.

AllForIt · 31-10-2019 4:39pm

I don't think the reason why kids don't like veg is particularly relevant. We know/agree they don't like them. Some adults don't like veg either. One sure fire way to prevent kids from ever liking veg is never to feed them to them at all. I love lettuce but even as an adult I find it to be bitter if completely plain. Adding a small bit of mayo i.e. fat completely transforms them. I don't see how spices are better rather just another good alternative. I'd use both in fact. Worcester sauce I discovered recently is delicious on them. Roasting cauliflower is just the same thing - putting fat on veg. I agree though, add fat to the veg to make them delicious. Use oil or butter or both - what difference does it make. The amount of butter I'd put on my daily veg wouldn't be much more one would but on a single sandwich so calorie wise it's negligible and the benefits of eating all that veg is significant.

Macy0161 · 31-10-2019 4:56pm

Tar.Aldarion wrote: »

There are evolutionary/physical reasons that younger people don't like vegetables. They avoid bitter foods (associated with poison) and have more taste receptors - they taste things more strongly. Also vegetables in Ireland tend to be cooked terribly, on average.

I can't decide whether it means my children are evolutionary outliers, or me and the missus are great cooks, but we've never had an issue with ours eating veg!

They weren't really given much choice, as they were just presented as the norm from the get go. I guess we did give them homemade stuff from a young age - just blitzed up veg that we were eating. One of ours will eat raw carrot sticks or raw mangetout over a piece of fruit. Texture is more an issue with fruit, which I totally get personally!

Taste evolves. I think there is evidence that repeated tastings grows a taste for stuff, in children and adults. I used to need a sauce/ dressing and cheese with salads, but I normally just go meat and leaves at this stage!

wakka12 · 31-10-2019 6:26pm

I dont think veg tastes 'bad' just a lot worse than most processed foods we and most children today are presented with as alternatives. Children dont care about their health,calories,the cost, or how easy it is to prepare so why would they choose vegetables when they know how much better other things taste and if taste is the only characteristic of food taken into consideration when choosing what to eat

You can grow to like nearly anything. Im sure most of us are regular drinkers of wine and coffee and beer but hated the taste at first

iguana · 01-11-2019 11:30am

Macy0161 wrote: »

I can't decide whether it means my children are evolutionary outliers, or me and the missus are great cooks, but we've never had an issue with ours eating veg!

Yeah, the conversation has taken a weird turn for me too. My nearly 7 year old lives for vegetables. They are his favourite food by far. I have videos of him as a baby of 8-9 months going wild at a table full of lettuce and tomatoes from the garden. He was sick for a lot of the school term so far and his teacher sent him home a red pepper from the school garden as a treat and he was ecstatic. He came home last night looked at his trick-or-treating haul and asked if he could have a salad first. He's so excited now that Christmas is coming as the sprouts are nearly ready. Recently we stopped at a motorway service station and he looked past the Burger King and the Subway and asked if I could order him a big plate of vegetables.

He's not a total weirdo, and has a sweet tooth but he self-limits on treats to the point that I have 6 untouched Easter eggs on the kitchen counter and had to throw out some of last years Halloween stuff recently. I don't think kids have any sort of evolutionary aversion to vegetables. Yes, babies are hardwired to enjoy sweet and breastmilk is naturally very sugary. But breastmilk is actually full of highly complex flavours and has a darkness and bitterness to it too. Kind of like sprouts.

Macy0161 · 01-11-2019 11:48am

Ours wouldn't be quite like that, and they'd happily skip the veg (no way they'd walk past BK!), but once it's on the plate they'll eat it!

r93kaey5p2izun · 01-11-2019 4:27pm

I use it purely because I hate butter, and not sure if it could be considered healthy by the stringent standards of many posters here, but I find Philadelphia a good alternative for sandwiches, toast, potatoes and many other foods.

mathie · 01-11-2019 5:46pm

A lot of positivity for butter here so I'll shine a light on the other side

“There is good evidence that a high intake of saturated fat increases your risk of heart disease. We need to think about where the sources of saturated fat are and how we can reduce them. The largest contributions are dairy products, including butter, and meat and meat products.”

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2018/oct/30/butter-nonsense-the-rise-of-the-cholesterol-deniers

"Butter has a high amount of saturated fat and some trans fat. That raises LDL (bad) cholesterol and contributes to atherosclerosis. But many hard margarines have a high amount of trans fat as well as saturated fat. That’s still bad."

https://www.heart.org/en/health-topics/cholesterol/about-cholesterol/common-misconceptions-about-cholesterol

"Moderate intake of butter resulted in increases in total cholesterol and LDL cholesterol compared with the effects of olive oil intake and a habitual diet (run-in period). Furthermore, moderate butter intake was also followed by an increase in HDL cholesterol compared with the habitual diet. We conclude that hypercholesterolemic people should keep their consumption of butter to a minimum, whereas moderate butter intake may be considered part of the diet in the normocholesterolemic population. "

https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/102/2/309/4564657

Didititian · 05-11-2019 6:56pm

mathie wrote: »

A lot of positivity for butter here so I'll shine a light on the other side

“There is good evidence that a high intake of saturated fat increases your risk of heart disease. We need to think about where the sources of saturated fat are and how we can reduce them. The largest contributions are dairy products, including butter, and meat and meat products.”

"Butter has a high amount of saturated fat and some trans fat. That raises LDL (bad) cholesterol and contributes to atherosclerosis. But many hard margarines have a high amount of trans fat as well as saturated fat. That’s still bad."

"Moderate intake of butter resulted in increases in total cholesterol and LDL cholesterol compared with the effects of olive oil intake and a habitual diet (run-in period). Furthermore, moderate butter intake was also followed by an increase in HDL cholesterol compared with the habitual diet. We conclude that hypercholesterolemic people should keep their consumption of butter to a minimum, whereas moderate butter intake may be considered part of the diet in the normocholesterolemic population. "

I would strongly agree with this slant of light on butter. There is strong evidence to suggest that replacing saturated fat with mono/poly unsaturated fats in our diet can improve cardiovascular health.

So to put that into food-based context, some suitable options to replace butter on our bread (depending on the s'wich contents of course) with an unsaturated fat would be:
Hummus (often contains olive oil)
Tahini (sesame paste)
Nut butters such as peanut butter/almond butter etc
Small amount of olive oil (great if eating bread to accompany a hearty dish)
Mayonaise (often made with vegetable oil!)

However, the suggestions of choosing naturally moist s'wich fillers is a great way to reduce the need for a spread in the first place! This way you are able to reduce your kcal intake altogether!

Hope that helps,
Didi de Zwarte - Registered Dietitian

igCorcaigh · 05-11-2019 7:11pm

I'm so confused at this stage about which fats are healthy or not.

My way of settling on this issue is to use olive oil for most lowish heat cooking like sautéing onions etc to make a sauce. Or on salads, veg. It's my go to oil.

I avoid veg oil, the industrial process of extracting the oil is new and, well, industrial, so no. I just don't trust it. Cheap for a reason.

I rarely stir fry or use high heat, but when I do I use coconut oil or ghee.

I eat a good amount of oily fish to balance out the omega 6 in my diet which I get from nuts, seeds, tahini, peanut butter etc. Also. I love all these foods.

I do consume a fair bit of dairy in the form of milk daily and sometimes cheese. I've read that dairy fats are good for you, or at least a certain amount.

I don't worry about it though. I really think it's only a small part of a bigger picture. We'll all be dead soon.

wakka12 · 05-11-2019 10:14pm

igCorcaigh wrote: »

I'm so confused at this stage about which fats are healthy or not.

My way of settling on this issue is to use olive oil for most lowish heat cooking like sautéing onions etc to make a sauce. Or on salads, veg. It's my go to oil.

I avoid veg oil, the industrial process of extracting the oil is new and, well, industrial, so no. I just don't trust it. Cheap for a reason.

I rarely stir fry or use high heat, but when I do I use coconut oil or ghee.

I eat a good amount of oily fish to balance out the omega 6 in my diet which I get from nuts, seeds, tahini, peanut butter etc. Also. I love all these foods.

I do consume a fair bit of dairy in the form of milk daily and sometimes cheese. I've read that dairy fats are good for you, or at least a certain amount.

I don't worry about it though. I really think it's only a small part of a bigger picture. We'll all be dead soon.

I think people way over think healthy eating. Eat plenty of veg and fruit, cooked and raw, some fish, some nuts and seeds daily, some legumes, and an otherwise rounded mixed diet with emphasis on nutrient rich with plenty of fibre and low in salt and sugar and youre well ahead of the pack. You and most of us probably dont eat enough oil/fatty spread that it has a huge impact so whether its a teaspoon of butter or olive oil on your daily sandwich probably doesnt matter too much

Healthy alternatives to butter?

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