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Water charges for excessive usage

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Comments

  • #122
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    BarryD2 wrote:
    It's only when the public water supply fails or partially fails to greater Dublin, will the public wake up to this basic fact.

    I don't live in Dublin. ;-)


  • #123
    Seanachai
    Registered Users Posts: 2,536 ✭✭✭Seanachai


    Hows this going to work in a building split into flats like the one I live in? There's only one meter.


  • #124
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 39,485 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    I seem to remember over a billion being invested in the set up of IW including the metering programme. Cart before the horse and all that. I billion would have fixed alot of pipes.

    2 billion by the end of 2016.


  • #125
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 39,485 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    punisher5112 wrote: »
    Will those that are unemployed and contribute nothing have to pay???

    Will the travelling community have to pay???

    As their bins etc are done already at no cost...

    Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!!!


  • #126
    daheff
    Registered Users Posts: 5,833 ✭✭✭daheff


    is_that_so wrote: »
    You do realise that this proposal is for excess usage and not general water charges?

    How soon does excessive usage drop so that everyday use becomes excess? How soon does the usage fee increase to be sky high and that we end up pay as you go?

    In Germany at the moment. Town I’m in has just had a 5k per home bill sent out to every dwelling in the town just to pay for necessary works on their water supply.


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  • #127
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Boggles wrote: »
    Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!!!

    What's this the water peeing out the pipes....


  • #128
    atticu
    Registered Users Posts: 691 ✭✭✭atticu


    Boggles wrote: »
    2 billion by the end of 2016.

    Cool claim can you back it up with any data?


  • #129
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 21,303 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    punisher5112 wrote: »
    Will those that are unemployed and contribute nothing have to pay???

    Will the travelling community have to pay???

    As their bins etc are done already at no cost...
    No and No


    Travelling community? You should see the ones near my industrial estate in dublin 15. Not only are there piles of rubbish inside the site (fine, let them live in their own filth) but it's starting outside the site too.... until some poor sod (paid by the taxpayer) is sent to clean it up.


    Sure it's their culture boss.


  • #130
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭[Deleted User]


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    Normally to conserve there's a carrot. Your suggestion is all stick.

    How about the carrot being a clean, healthy water supply? And if they don't pay for it the relevant forces of this state turn off that water *service* to all the layabout parasites who want that *service* for free? Let them collect rainwater or spend thousands to drill a well on their own property. Galling sense of entitlement from these spongers.


  • #131
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Fuaranach wrote:
    How about the carrot being a clean, healthy water supply? And if they don't pay for it the relevant forces of this state turn off that water *service* to all the layabout parasites who want that *service* for free? Let them collect rainwater or spend thousands to drill a well on their own property. Galling sense of entitlement from these spongers.

    Boring same old stupid response so reminiscent of the old water threads.


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  • #132
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Paulzx wrote: »
    Slight problem though. The people who didn't make a fuss about getting their water meter installed can now have their water usage individually monitored.

    On the other hand the people who intimidated contractors, defied court orders, abused and heckled Gardai and made sure that water meters were not installed in their areas will be unable to have their usage checked.

    How is that going to work?

    ....saw the con job for what it was, (sitserv deal for Dinny still under investigation) and rightly wouldn't wear it.

    It all sounds like 'the environment' again, which seems great on the surface but will the leakage, (still 50%?) be deducted from usage? The meters won't measure that. Will some bright spark in FG, after the next crash, decide to increase the charge while lowering the limit? I'm sure we can trust 'not'.... :rolleyes:


  • #133
    Berserker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,046 ✭✭✭Berserker


    NIMAN wrote: »
    Are those on social welfare going to be exempt and allowed to waste as much water as they want?

    Most definitely. That'll limit the number of protesters and political figures who'll get involved.
    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    The logical thing would have been to fix the mains first and then embark on a charging regime. I even remember Enda saying as much.

    Why can't they charge people while they are fixing the issues with mains?


  • #134
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭[Deleted User]


    Delta2113 wrote: »
    "The scrotes in underclass areas" - this is very offensive.

    In fairness, why didn't you find the balancing reference, in that very same sentence, to "the scrotes in the professional and business classes who were eager to leech at the trough of all the "free money" which they were hoping Irish Water would give them." equally "very offensive"?


  • #135
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Berserker wrote:
    Why can't they charge people while they are fixing the issues with mains?


    Why are you asking me? We were told several years ago the leaks would be fixed first. Then again that was only the start of the lies around IW.


  • #136
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 39,485 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    atticu wrote: »
    Cool claim can you back it up with any data?

    Not my claim, Fine Gaels.


  • #137
    Benedict
    Registered Users Posts: 684 ✭✭✭Benedict


    Flats won't be metered so a wealthy person in a 3 bed luxury flat in Dublin 4 with ensuites and power-showers in every bathroom will not have to pay for excessive usage - and that is OFFICIAL. Someone in a small 2 bed terrace house in a rundown area will have to pay if they go over the limit and that, too, is OFFICIAL.

    In a democracy, you can't have one rule for some and another rule for others and that's OFFICIAL too.

    People must stand up for themselves. It's a rule for everyone, or for no-one.

    End of story.


  • #138
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭[Deleted User]


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    Boring same old stupid response so reminiscent of the old water threads.

    It's far from a "stupid response"; rather, it's a fair and just response to cut off the water service for people who refuse to pay for that service. The unfairness would be to provide them with a service for free that everybody else must pay for.


  • #139
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Fuaranach wrote:
    It's far from a "stupid response"; rather, it's a fair and just response to cut off the water service for people who refuse to pay for that service. The unfairness would be to provide them with a service for free that everybody else must pay for.


    First of all it is stupid, secondly water has always being paid for through direct and indirect taxation. Nothing is free and it is hilarious to suggest otherwise. IW was nothing more than a robbery writ dressed up as a utility.


  • #140
    atticu
    Registered Users Posts: 691 ✭✭✭atticu


    Boggles wrote: »
    Not my claim.

    Yet you posted it.

    Go figure.


  • #141
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    Why are you asking me? We were told several years ago the leaks would be fixed first. Then again that was only the start of the lies around IW.

    They lost interest when the con job was revealed. No money in it, no point. Like social housing and the HSE.

    ******

    Lads, the con was revealed, nobody would wear it, no point in discussing it like the missed opportunity it never was.


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  • #142
    K.Flyer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,565 ✭✭✭K.Flyer


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    It's far from a "stupid response"; rather, it's a fair and just response to cut off the water service for people who refuse to pay for that service. The unfairness would be to provide them with a service for free that everybody else must pay for.

    They threatened people with that the last time around and never followed through with it.
    I.W. and the government's plans regarding same has Zero Credibility.
    They have proven themselves to be incompetent and just another financial jobs for the boys money pit quango.
    I, like many others, saw it for what it was and still is, a shambles from the beginning.
    After the absolute debacle of incompetence with the hospital finances, this could be the final straw to bring this government down if they try to push it through.


  • #143
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 39,485 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    atticu wrote: »
    Yet you posted it.

    Go figure.

    Yeah, point remains, ain't my claim.

    Fine Gaels.

    Irish Water has cost State €2bn
    Irish Water will have cost the State over €2bn by the end of the year (2016), according to government projections


  • #144
    Snow Garden
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,126 ✭✭✭Snow Garden


    I am in favour of charging for excessive water usage

    ....but I am not in favour of creating a superquango to do. A corrupt and wasteful superquango that was set up to feather the nests of FG friends.

    Irish Water is another HSE. What is the betting that they split it up regionally in 10 years? :D

    We are being led very very very badly.


  • #145
    atticu
    Registered Users Posts: 691 ✭✭✭atticu


    Boggles wrote: »
    Yeah, point remains, ain't my claim.

    Fine Gaels.

    Irish Water has cost State €2bn

    I love newspapers.
    You can rely on them to tell the truth.


  • #146
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭[Deleted User]


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    First of all it is stupid, secondly water has always being paid for through direct and indirect taxation. Nothing is free and it is hilarious to suggest otherwise. IW was nothing more than a robbery writ dressed up as a utility.

    You could argue the same about the introduction of motor tax; it was possible to drive a vehicle on public roads before it so why should it be paid? That that tax on vehicles has contributed to the general tax pot that has allowed Irish roads to now be among the best per capita in Europe is called progress. Similarly our water system needs to be modernised and it is only fair that the people who use it pay for this modernisation (on condition that the service remains under state ownership).


  • #147
    markodaly
    Registered Users Posts: 13,913 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    I find this funny. Some of the posters in another thread about crappy public services and taxation are here giving out about this fee.

    Couldn't make it up, to be honest.


  • #148
    BarryD2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,732 ✭✭✭BarryD2


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    Why are you asking me? We were told several years ago the leaks would be fixed first. Then again that was only the start of the lies around IW.
    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    Boring same old stupid response so reminiscent of the old water threads.

    You answered your own question a few posts earlier :)


  • #149
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭[Deleted User]


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    First of all it is stupid, secondly water has always being paid for through direct and indirect taxation. Nothing is free and it is hilarious to suggest otherwise. IW was nothing more than a robbery writ dressed up as a utility.

    This is a point that was bandied about last time around, and I can't really see the relevance. So we were paying for the water infrastructure through general taxation. Cool. It was neglected for years, though, so now it needs extra funding to bring it up to scratch.

    So, we're left with two options. We either let it rot and the water seep into the ground......or else we fix it.
    If we fix it, it has to be paid for.
    No point saying "we've been paying for it for years, now, so use all that money from the past"
    We either raise new funds, or we divert money away from other essential services.
    If you don't charge the users (in particular those who use it excessively) then the money has to come from somewhere.

    Make no mistake, money will have to be spent to fix the pipes and leaks etc. Whether its through IW or the Local authority or whatever. Those who contribute more to the Govt. coffers (i.e. those with a job) will end up paying more than the rest. It is as simple as that.

    People call it a stealth tax now. What if they just upped income tax by 1% across the board and used that to fund it?


  • #150
    blackcard
    Registered Users Posts: 3,852 ✭✭✭blackcard


    cameramonkey wrote: »
    Tommy Kelly wrote: »
    No. It's our fault that water is being lost on public mains pipes. Decades upon decades of ignoring & not updating the water system has led to leaks on dirty, rotten & dangerous to our health, lead pipes.

    Irish water have been for the past several years now upgrading these pipes in various parts of the country.

    It's also worth noting that thousands of jobs have been created as a result of the ongoing upgrades to our water system.


    How should IW be sanctioned for this loss of water. Maybe a 500 euro fine for every 213,000 lost through leaks? If IW are not sanctioned for this wastage of water then they will just continue to let water flow away , there has to be some sort of fine, they have now had a few years to deal with the problem but dont seem to do much about it.
    90% of the water network in Ireland is between 30 to 100 years old and is in poor condition. The lifespan of watermains is 30 to 50 years. A lot of the work repairing leaks is like putting on a sticking plaster or servicing a clapped out car. We need to replace vast amounts of the water network at a cost of multiple billions. It will mean digging up our cities and towns and will cause huge disruption. When people talk about fixing leaky pipes, this is what is required. There has been underinvestment for decades in water infrastructure and unless serious money is spent, we are wasting our time trying to repair the dilapidated network.


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  • #151
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    $hifty wrote:
    People call it a stealth tax now. What if they just upped income tax by 1% across the board and used that to fund it?


    No issue with that. Good idea actually.


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