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15-04-2019, 14:59   #31
riffmongous
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For some reason, all the ills of the world originated with the Rothschild.
There is still a veneer of this Jewish anti-banker/anti-capitalist behind some of the left wing politics we see today.
This was posted by Austrian far right leader HC Strache who is actually more or less Tánaiste at the moment, check out the cufflink patterns

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15-04-2019, 15:06   #32
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I'm always amazed at how stupid antisemitism is. Ok, all racial discrimination is really but it's just that after the holocaust, after all the myths were shown to be lies, there's still people who support this crap.
There's still people so ineffably numb that the Holocaust is all abstract stuff. When I was standing in one of those really small cells underground in Auschwitz, about 8 metres from the cell in which some 600 USSR prisoners of war became the first to be gassed to death by Zyklon B (in September 1941, 4 months before the Wannsee Conference), and the guide tells you that this very room was filled with Jewish people after a hard day's slave labour and they all had to sleep and relieve themselves standing up. Nazi fun, it appears.

That room was about 400 metres walk to the building where thousands upon thousands of toddlers' shoes were on display (next to tons of human hair and other human parts that were used in a lucrative soap and cosmetic industry of all things). When you actually think of all those humans who took those shoes off little children in the full knowledge that they were all going to be murdered it makes you question human nature like you never did before.

I don't think any person can honestly say he or she understands the Holocaust. The magnitude of its evil is unfathomable. Hannah Arendt's 'banality of evil' carried out by enormous numbers of "normal" people. And that's the scary part we all need to be alert to in these populist times where many people are simply not learning about the Holocaust.
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15-04-2019, 15:13   #33
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For some reason, all the ills of the world originated with the Rothschild.
There is still a veneer of this Jewish anti-banker/anti-capitalist behind some of the left wing politics we see today.
Given that Jews represent approx 0.2% of the world population (1 in 500), and yet they have won 20% of the Nobel prizes, wouldn't anybody think they must be sound?

I'm no fan of financialisation, but why focus on Jewish bankers?
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15-04-2019, 15:25   #34
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I disagree, even just talking about it here and highlighting that it's still an issue helps stops a slow creep of normalisation of anti semitism and covert anti semitic tropes that are common online ( Soros as the the big bad jew, denial of Israel's right to exist framed as anti-zionism). If Labour had kept in mind how serious it is and why it needs to be dealt with they wouldn't be having such a huge scandal now (although their opponents would still be trying)
This, completely. I'd also say that this is something we should be wary of when it comes to discourse about Muslims, especially online. The great horrors of world history invariably start with the dehumanisation of a group. It becomes normal to scapegoat and demean a section of society, and all sorts of things against them can be excused once their "lesser" status has been accepted. It is much harder to kill and abuse loads of people if you haven't dehumanised them first.

It rarely happens overnight. It is, as you rightly say, a "slow creep of normalisation". The language we use always matters, even if some people get carried away into the superficiality of "political correctness".
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15-04-2019, 15:26   #35
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A question I've asked many times and have never received a satisfactory answer: Why, in the last few hundred years, are the Jews the most persecuted race in Europe?
There must be a good reason.
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15-04-2019, 15:33   #36
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A question I've asked many times and have never received a satisfactory answer: Why, in the last few hundred years, are the Jews the most persecuted race in Europe?
There must be a good reason.
There isn't a good reason they were persecuted. It's largely for religious reasons. They were myths spread they jews sacrificed babies in ritual slaughter.

In Ireland anti-semitic sentiment came from thr church and from politicians like Oliver Flanagan. Essentially Jews were seen as christ killers.

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15-04-2019, 15:34   #37
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A question I've asked many times and have never received a satisfactory answer: Why, in the last few hundred years, are the Jews the most persecuted race in Europe?
There must be a good reason.
A better question: If they are the most persecuted race in Europe, why are they still here, and doing relatively well?
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15-04-2019, 15:38   #38
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A better question: If they are the most persecuted race in Europe, why are they still here, and doing relatively well?
relative to what, exactly? millions of them were murdered not so very long ago.
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15-04-2019, 15:39   #39
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A question I've asked many times and have never received a satisfactory answer: Why, in the last few hundred years, are the Jews the most persecuted race in Europe?
There must be a good reason.
We could say that they are a widespread minority in Europe and the U.S. and simply the minority, and not the majority, will be the ones getting a kicking.

I've interacted with only about 100-200 in my time, some more than others, some from Israel and some from elsewhere.

They have largely been pleasant and helpful company, excepting one gruff Israeli girl I got talking to in a pub one evening who very much had her back up right from the off. Some of them in Italy and NY went out of their way to help me as a perfect stranger with zero tangible benefit accruing. Noble folks.
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15-04-2019, 15:42   #40
Charles Ingles
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A question I've asked many times and have never received a satisfactory answer: Why, in the last few hundred years, are the Jews the most persecuted race in Europe?
There must be a good reason.
Do want the real reason or the anti-Semitic answer?
Jew people have a higher average intelligence hence go to on to be high achievers.
They tend to pass on good money management through the generations and live their lives to a religious moral code.
Simple answer is good old fashioned jealousy and begrudgers.
Having said that I don't approve of Israel's actions in relation to Palestine but to be critical of Israel isn't anti-Semitic.
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15-04-2019, 15:46   #41
riffmongous
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A question I've asked many times and have never received a satisfactory answer: Why, in the last few hundred years, are the Jews the most persecuted race in Europe?
There must be a good reason.
More than gays, or gypsies etc? It doesn't really matter so much of course who had it worse, but rather the why, because they are different, minorities, easily dehumanised, and importantly easy targets
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15-04-2019, 15:56   #42
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A better question: If they are the most persecuted race in Europe, why are they still here, and doing relatively well?
Citizens of countries are allowed to live in them. Why not be here (in Europe I assume you're asking about?) There's plenty to like.
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15-04-2019, 16:00   #43
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Also the Jewish history over the centuries as money lenders (believe related to some loophole in the bible) made them resented and marginalised by the society relying on those services
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15-04-2019, 16:01   #44
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I disagree, even just talking about it here and highlighting that it's still an issue helps stops a slow creep of normalisation of anti semitism and covert anti semitic tropes that are common online ( Soros as the the big bad jew, denial of Israel's right to exist framed as anti-zionism). If Labour had kept in mind how serious it is and why it needs to be dealt with they wouldn't be having such a huge scandal now (although their opponents would still be trying)
Attacks on Israel and attacks on George Soros aren't automatically anti-semitic though. People can have a serious problem with a foreign billionaire using his money to influence politics in countries other than his own country, that doesn't make them anti-semitic - many people I know on the right who criticise Soros for butting in to politics which are none of his business wouldn't even be aware of his ethnicity. And the idea that Israel has a right to exist where it does is one I support (strictly within the 1967 borders) but to suggest that it cannot be open to question or discussion - especially when it stems directly from decisions taken by the British Empire - is exceptionally dangerous for democratic freedom. If someone believes, for instance, that Israel's "right to exist" is invalid because they do not regard the British Empire as having had any moral authority to carve up its former nations, in the same way that many people want a united Ireland and regard partition here as illegitimate, I don't see how that makes them anti-semitic?

Anti-semitism refers specifically to hating Jewish people as a people, or to hating their religious beliefs. Hating individual people who happen to be Jews for their behaviour (Soros) or delegitimising a country for entirely political reasons (Israel) is not anti-semitism or racism, and it is very dangerous for democratic freedoms to conflate the two.

In that context, I'd love to hear more details on what form, specifically, the UK Labour Party's alleged antisemitism takes - because if it entirely relates to issues regarding Israel or issues regarding George Soros, then in my view it simply doesn't count as anti-semitism. At all.
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15-04-2019, 16:01   #45
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Simple answer is good old fashioned jealousy and begrudgers.
Fed by political and religious leaders over time, however. Always good to have a scapegoat so your followers have someone else to blame for their unhappiness.

Christianity, especially Catholocism, built a long-lasting religion that has a big component of antisemitism in it (the role of Jews in the Crucifixion was a big rallying point for millenia and not rebuked by the Church until 1965, and updated by Pope Benedict in 2011.)
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