Ireland Team Talk XI: Team of nervoUS MOD warning Post 1

Tomtom364 wrote: »

Slightly out of the box thinking.

Should Ireland call Billy Holland up to the squad.
Not to play.
But to coach the damn lineout.

By all account Billy is an absolute lineout expert and does a heck of a lot of work in the Munster lineout analysis.

for a second....for a split second I though you were advocating for Holland to be brought into the team

Soooooo good hit out then.

Clegg wrote: »

Some encouraging signs but a lot of bad things as well. We still can't convert pressure into points. It was a problem under Schmidt and it's still a problem now. Thought Doris and Porter were the pick of the forwards

Our 10/12/13 needs serious re-evaluating. Ross Byrne's first cap can be discounted as his pack was mullered. But today we were fairly even with England. He just didn't seem confident to try things and just shipped the ball on. Aki and Farrell are too similar to be an effective partnership. Thought Farrell in particular was poor.

Our pack is where the most troubling issues lie....we are now routinely getting absolutely dominated by England to the point where is looks like a childs team facing a mens team

Pretty disappointed at some people writing off Ronan Kelleher. Today was his second start for Ireland and just his 20th appearance as a professional rugby player. And just 13 of this shave been starts.

He's at the very beginning of his career and saying he's not good enough because the lineout is malfunctioning is pure rubbish. The set piece is about every different component working well as a unit, which clearly wasn't happening today.

Odd as it may seem, but the more I see England play the more it seems they park the bus in front of the posts then kick the ball down the pitch. Like some others here, I am not convinced Andy Farrell is the best to be the boss. If we give Ireland another 6 months I think we will all have a better idea if our current game plan works.

1. Healy
2. Kelleher
3. Furlong
4. Ryan
5. Henderson
6.Baird
7. Leavy
8. Doris

^^ I want to start see this pack , its the only one in the near future i see beating England

Clegg wrote: »

Pretty disappointed at some people writing off Ronan Kelleher. Today was his second start for Ireland and just his 20th appearance as a professional rugby player. And just 13 of this shave been starts.

Agree he absolutely shouldn't be written off...but in a way you've also explained why he shouldn't be starting for Ireland right now. He seems destined to be the long term answer at hooker, but right now, Id have Herring starting with Kelleher getting plenty of exposure off the bench. Nevertheless he will learn from days like today and be better for it.

kingofthekong wrote: »

Our pack is where the most troubling issues lie....we are now routinely getting absolutely dominated by England to the point where is looks like a childs team facing a mens team

We didn't get smashed today, that's what's so frustrating. We fronted up well, and regularly made strong carries over the gainline. We completely stuffed their maul, at least twice winning turnovers on the tryline. We didn't get mullered in the scrum, in contrast to Leinster vs Saracens and previous outings vs England recently.

Our lineout misfired, which was not all on Kelleher. At least two of those failures was an English jumper dislodging the ball from an Irish jumper. This has been a persistent systems error, and pretty inexplicable

Our use of forwards in attack is still frustratingly basic. Too many static carries into double tackles. No one is going to look good doing that. We have players who can offload, need to take advantage of that. We need to create opportunities for attacking flow. Get Doris making a half break, and passing out of a tackle to Stander or a back. Get Stander on a hard line, a la his try against England a few years back.

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Such blue bias... Kelleher cant start if he cant get some of the basics of his position right. Baird isnt and cant play backrow if he is primarily played in the second row. Doris might be the future but O Mahony showed today while he has to be involved.

Bias toward the best pack in Ireland? Nah your red bias keeping O’mahony in a team whilst being so dominated by curry and Underhill

The maul was an issue was well. The times when we actually secured our own lineout we didn't seem able to make headway with our drive.

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Doris wasnt great either. Ryan was poor. For all talk of him being world class etc he was totally underwhelming today. There was one top top class second row on show today and he certainly wasnt in green.
O Mahony is far from the problem and if you were to criticise any of the munster men today in the pack it was stander.

Doris was literally a one man job trying to carry into the entire English pack by himself - offered himself on every occasion for the impossible task of the hard yards into the England pack -

He also got just as many turn overs as O’mahony and that’s supposed to be O’mahony’s usp
He carried more and was equally as effective as O’mahony on their deck.

Stander wasn’t even on the pitch - that’s why Baird is getting in for him, hopefully gets minutes against Georgia.

Ryan showed far more fight then anyone in the back today despite some poor errors there’s absolutely no chance Ryan doesn’t start

kingofthekong wrote: »

1. Healy
2. Kelleher
3. Furlong
4. Ryan
5. Henderson
6.Baird
7. Leavy
8. Doris

^^ I want to start see this pack , its the only one in the near future i see beating England

Furlong is injured, has not returned from injury and even before he got injured he was playing well below his potential

Henderson has just returned from long term injury and hasn't had any performances recently to indicate that he is back at his peak form

Leavy won MOTM last weekend in his first start since returning from long term injury (against poor opposition)

James Ryan is not performing at the level he set for himself last year, or even at a level high enough to say he should be a guaranteed starter at the moment.

It looks like your dream pack is based on a healthy dose of nostalgia rather than picking players who are in good form... Isn't that what everyone criticises the Irish Management team for doing?

We have 2 more games in this autumn series, one against Georgia, and one against Scotland (more than likely) or possiby France

Who would you pick for these games numbers 1 to 8?

I personally think we should play a really experimental team against Georgia. Let the fringe players put their hand up for selection. If they do not rise to the challenge, then we need to bring in a lot of much younger players into the international camps prior to the 6 nations next year

Gavin Coombes, The two Wicherleys, Jack O Donoghue, Ben Healey, Craig Casey are just a few Munster players who have already show that they are likely to be future stars in the sport. (injuries aside) and there are plenty of players of this calibre in Leinster Ulster and Connacht's set up who we can blood and put them on the road towards being Ireland's next generation of grand slam winning rugby players.

kingofthekong wrote: »

Doris was literally a one man job trying to carry into the entire English pack by himself - offered himself on every occasion for the impossible task of the hard yards into the England pack -

He also got just as many turn overs as O’mahony and that’s supposed to be O’mahony’s usp
He carried more and was equally as effective as O’mahony on their deck.

Stander wasn’t even on the pitch - that’s why Baird is getting in for him, hopefully gets minutes against Georgia.

Ryan showed far more fight then anyone in the back today despite some poor errors there’s absolutely no chance Ryan doesn’t start

I never said Ryan shouldnt start. I just think he was poor. For all talk of him being world class. He isnt near that. He has a fantastic engine but he was leading a terrible lineout. His calling was terrible. Stander wasnt fantastic but Baird isnt a back row option at international level.
Leavy is barely back from a very long term injury. No reason at all to just shove him straight back to international level on basis of 2 hours of rugby.

Akrasia wrote: »

Furlong is injured, has not returned from injury and even before he got injured he was playing well below his potential

Henderson has just returned from long term injury and hasn't had any performances recently to indicate that he is back at his peak form

Leavy won MOTM last weekend in his first start since returning from long term injury (against poor opposition)

James Ryan is not performing at the level he set for himself last year, or even at a level high enough to say he should be a guaranteed starter at the moment.

It looks like your dream pack is based on a healthy dose of nostalgia rather than picking players who are in good form... Isn't that what everyone criticises the Irish Management team for doing?

We have 2 more games in this autumn series, one against Georgia, and one against Scotland (more than likely) or possiby France

Who would you pick for these games numbers 1 to 8?

I personally think we should play a really experimental team against Georgia. Let the fringe players put their hand up for selection. If they do not rise to the challenge, then we need to bring in a lot of much younger players into the international camps prior to the 6 nations next year

Gavin Coombes, The two Wicherleys, Jack O Donoghue, Ben Healey, Craig Casey are just a few Munster players who have already show that they are likely to be future stars in the sport. (injuries aside) and there are plenty of players of this calibre in Leinster Ulster and Connacht's set up who we can blood and put them on the road towards being Ireland's next generation of grand slam winning rugby players.

oh thank god for Mensa here to point out the injuries....of course they werent available for selection today well done for the astute observation

This is my injury free team to face them in the 6 nations,

Guys I would look at bringing in for Georgia would be:

Penny, Coombes, Leavy, Baird - would've said Hodnett but injury, O'toole if he goes well on Sunday, Eric O'sullivan

Not all of them at once but blend them in

Was specifically talking about forwards but for the backs i'd also like to see some of : Daly, JOB, H.Byrne, Casey, Marmion, Lytlle