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10-05-2020, 20:12   #61
Odhinn
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That's ok, you don't have to be Christian to live here.
The fifth amendment of the constitution actually removed from the Constitution the special position of the Catholic Church and the recognition of other named religious denominations.
I'm aware of that. However the actual removal of the real privilege of the church is a relatively recent thing, and something which is ongoing.



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And you don't have to worry.
Current Christianity doesn't have a penalty for leaving the religion.
Current Islam do - it's death.

So you think those in those ramadan diary slots believe any who leaves the faith should be killed?
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10-05-2020, 20:30   #62
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I'm aware of that. However the actual removal of the real privilege of the church is a relatively recent thing, and something which is ongoing.






So you think those in those ramadan diary slots believe any who leaves the faith should be killed?
What those people in the Ramadan diary slots believe is not the question... It's what the Quran says is what counts, and the question is, " Is death the punishment for any Muslim who leaves Islam?
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10-05-2020, 20:36   #63
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Actually given the thread title and op, I'd say the content of the programme in question is very relevant.
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10-05-2020, 20:41   #64
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Actually given the thread title and op, I'd say the content of the programme in question is very relevant.



The content seems innocuous.
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10-05-2020, 20:44   #65
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I would agree.... My point is trying to Bring it around to content or practices from elsewhere in the world which wasn't the subject of the show seems reductive.
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10-05-2020, 21:58   #66
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The content seems innocuous.
Of course it seems innocuous.., and indeed much of it is actually innocuous, depending on a persons interpretation of a particular passage or Surah in the Quran.
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10-05-2020, 22:03   #67
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Of course it seems innocuous.., and indeed much of it is actually innocuous, depending on a persons interpretation of a particular passage or Surah in the Quran.



The fact is that you can't have a state broad caster doing something like the angelus and not allow some similar mentions for other faiths. That includes the orthodox lads,the jews, the protestants, the hindus, sikhs and whatever else floats peoples boats.
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10-05-2020, 22:12   #68
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The fact is that you can't have a state broad caster doing something like the angelus and not allow some similar mentions for other faiths. That includes the orthodox lads,the jews, the protestants, the hindus, sikhs and whatever else floats peoples boats.
Of course, after all we are a democracy, but my comment was more in answer to your comment on biko's post

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So you think those in those ramadan diary slots believe any who leaves the faith should be killed?
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10-05-2020, 23:58   #69
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Also very much doubt ex-muslims in Ireland face death having renounced their faith, if we are comparing like with like in this 'Christian country'
https://allianceofformermuslims.com/legalise-apostasy/

Throughout the Muslim world, those who renounce Islam are faced with persecution and death. According to the 2019 Freedom of Thought Report of the International Humanist and Ethical Union, there are no less than twelve Muslim-majority countries in which apostasy is punishable by death.
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11-05-2020, 00:00   #70
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So you think those in those ramadan diary slots believe any who leaves the faith should be killed?
If they are god-fearing then probably.

From the website of exmuslims in Ireland:

The prescription of the death penalty for apostasy is derived from shari’ah – the legal code of Islam, which has remained fundamentally unalterable since the “closing of the gates” of ijtihad (inquiry) in the tenth century. In Sunan an-Nasa’i, the Prophet Muhammad plainly states “Whoever changes his religion, kill him” (hadith 4061). Thus, all four Sunni law schools, as well as the primary Shi’a school of thought, demand the killing of apostates.
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11-05-2020, 00:19   #71
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https://www.theguardian.com/global/2...n-crisis-faith

In UK, next door to us
“If someone found out where I lived,” he explains, “they could burn my house down.”
Why should such an understated figure, someone who describes himself as a “nobody”, speak as if he’s in a witness protection programme? The answer is that six years ago he decided to declare that he no longer accepted the fundamental tenets of Islam. He stopped being a believing Muslim and became instead an apostate.
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11-05-2020, 00:27   #72
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If they are god-fearing then probably.

From the website of exmuslims in Ireland:

The prescription of the death penalty for apostasy is derived from shari’ah – the legal code of Islam, which has remained fundamentally unalterable since the “closing of the gates” of ijtihad (inquiry) in the tenth century. In Sunan an-Nasa’i, the Prophet Muhammad plainly states “Whoever changes his religion, kill him” (hadith 4061). Thus, all four Sunni law schools, as well as the primary Shi’a school of thought, demand the killing of apostates.
Biko, I think that this post is in answer to Odhinns post #61 ( above ) Personally, I'm fully aware of Islam's view of apostates.
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11-05-2020, 00:34   #73
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It always really interests me to find stuff out about Ramadan from people who do it. Intermittent fasting is in many religions including Catholicism, even though most people who claim to be Catholic don't observe the fast days anymore. There is actually a lot of research done into the benefits of fasting, though the concensus is that three days is the best period of fasting for it to have benefits to one's health.

Last year around Ramadan I got a taxi home after a night out and the lad who dropped me home was Muslim. He was saying most of the taxi drivers do the night shift as they can't eat during the day, I thought it was a crafty loophole. He was also telling me about the class food they eat, gave me a recipe for Biryani I've made loads of times since.

The level of contempt in here is unfortunate but not very surprising as certain sections of Irish society are totally insulated from ever encountering people of different cultures. Fortunately the generation growing up in Ireland now represent a wide variety of races and religions. Current trends seem to show that many will be atheist or agnostic due to readily available information when they start to question the tenets of their family's tradition. There will definitely be a lot more appreciation and acceptance of people when it comes to religion in about six or seven years when the current primary school kids finish secondary school.
I’ve spent Ramadam last year in Oman, and had the honour of being invited to Iftar. Felt very privileged sitting on the ground breaking the fast with the governor and chief of police, eating goat and rice with my right hand.
Very spiritual , respectful a dignified people
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11-05-2020, 07:10   #74
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Throughout the Muslim world, those who renounce Islam are faced with persecution and death. According to the 2019 Freedom of Thought Report of the International Humanist and Ethical Union, there are no less than twelve Muslim-majority countries in which apostasy is punishable by death.

Having read that I can see Irish Muslims are lobbying the Irish government to work towards international abolition of a death penalty. However that doesn't address the point I made that you quoted and that has been discussed by other users. Is it employed in Ireland? Doubt it. Do the people on the show in question fear it in Ireland? No, imo.

Biko why are you trying to Bring this discussion about a programme about Ramadan in Ireland back to the death penalty for apostasy everywhere else but Ireland.

Do you get all religions have their bad points. And that not all discussions about religion have to focus on one aspect of that religion? And that bringing the discussion about Ramadan in Ireland back to apostasy elsewhere is very reductionist?
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11-05-2020, 08:44   #75
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Biko why are you trying to Bring this discussion about a programme about Ramadan in Ireland back to the death penalty for apostasy everywhere else but Ireland.
We should widen our scope and think outside of this island. What happens in UK today will happen in Ireland in 5/10 years, it's always been that way.

I will stop if you think I'm going offtopic but I would urge everyone to ask their Muslim friends about correct punishment for someone who denounces Allah, or if they could be friends with gay people.
Then ask your Jewish friends the same question.
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