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Force Majeure

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  • 21-09-2020 2:17pm
    #1
    AdrianG08
    Registered Users Posts: 902 ✭✭✭


    Quick query in relation to force majeure entitlement. (Hypothetical of course)

    Recently (in last 2 weeks) had to taken unpaid leave (i'm a contractor on daily rate) due to a sudden and life threatening illness to my dad. To give precise details, he has had a stroke and tests have shown him to be terminally ill with cancer also unfortunately. The first day he took ill and I was at home with him myself (no other family) waiting for ambulance etc... My presence was indispensable as there was literally nobody else to help.

    Now I returned to work after 2 weeks (for which I was unpaid, you don't work any hours, you don't get paid and I get that, totally understandable).

    However, my temporary contract states that the company (agency through which I am contracting) provides for Force Majeure leave in line with statutory provisions.

    Both of the below links show this statutory provision

    https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/employment_rights_and_conditions/leave_and_holidays/types_of_leave_from_work.html#lcdc92

    https://employmentrightsireland.com/tag/force-majeure/

    Am I incorrect in assuming I should be entitled to 3 days pay as force majeure leave?

    I want to have solid footing, i've been told no, but that was before I saw in contract that its expressly mentioned.

    Thanks a million in advance


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    #2
    AdrianG08
    Registered Users Posts: 902 ✭✭✭AdrianG08


    EDIT: They are looking into it now, they have requested proof that my presence was required, never saw anything like this. How can I prove this? My GP (also GP of my dad) has stated in a letter that my presence was required due to a serious illness to my father, but undersandably he cannot give anymore details.

    I have no siblings, and my presence was required at the hospital to liaise with doctors, he had to move hospitals during this time and they relied on me for info etc.. as my dad was non responsive.

    How the hell do you give any more proof than this?

    Any advice would be greatly appreciated


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    #3
    Batgurl
    Registered Users Posts: 1,208 ✭✭✭Batgurl


    Have your company stated that the GP’s letter isn’t sufficient?


  • Options
    #4
    AdrianG08
    Registered Users Posts: 902 ✭✭✭AdrianG08


    Batgurl wrote: »
    Have your company stated that the GP’s letter isn’t sufficient?

    No they have not, the are using it in order to come to a determination.

    I think they are just trying to find a way not to have to pay this to a contractor. Being told its not company policy in the first instance (until I look at my contract to see it was) is poor though. As a request needs to be written upon return to work, and obviously it was done after the fact.

    Even the doctor has said this is poor enough form, but its not up to him anyway. At the time the company gave me the whole, "thats awful, take all the time you need, please let us know if there is anything we can do to make things easier" etc...

    All I asked was that my job be kept (it was) and if there was some kind of force majeure policy.


  • Options
    #5
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    You are not required to prove anything in relation to FM leave, once you make a statutory declaration of such to your employer you are legally entitled to be paid.


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    #6
    AdrianG08
    Registered Users Posts: 902 ✭✭✭AdrianG08


    GM228 wrote: »
    You are not required to prove anything in relation to FM leave, once you make a statutory declaration of such to your employer you are legally entitled to be paid.

    I have been specifically asked to provide independent evidence.

    "An employee who believes that they have grounds to claim Force Majeure Leave must give written notice immediately upon their return to work. All applications for Force Majeure Leave are subject to approval by the Companyl representative.

    Where possible, an employee should provide written independent evidence to support their having taken Force Majeure Leave, this may help to speed up the approval process. Following evaluation of the application the Company will inform the employee of its decision".

    I've given a GP letter, I will give them no more. Leaves a bitter taste in the mouth to be honest. Full of empty gestures to tick boxes, but completely lacking when an employee actually needs something tangible.

    I now have to wait 30 days for head office to sign off as to whether this is suitable grounds. There is no ambiguity here either, events are exactly as described. They are not far off looking for proof of death, and whilst that hasn't happened yet unfortunately its not far off in this instance. :o


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    #7
    Lenar3556
    Registered Users Posts: 1,350 ✭✭✭Lenar3556


    The central issue here is the nature of the contract of engagement between you and the firm you are working for.

    Force Majeure leave is statutorily available to employees. An employee is required to make a declaration that their attendance was indispensable, and that, in the absence of evidence to the contrary is sufficient to entitle them to FM leave.

    Significantly however, you say you are not an employee, but a contractor. Albeit one who appears to be engaged with one particular customer to the point where it is questionable whether you would meet the revenue tests of a self employed person - buts that’s a separate matter.

    You will argue that there is a contractual clause in your contract for services which entitles you to the equivalent treatment of an employee in an FM scenario such as this. The inclusion of the phrase “in line with statutory provisions” is not particularly favourable to you, as the party for whom you are working could suggest there is no statutory provision in this case and sin e the way it is.

    Doesn’t sound like a particularly healthy relationship between you two - maybe time to keep an eye out for something else?


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