What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

biko · 01-12-2020 3:28am

Soon at a school near you.

A SCHOOL pupil who joined a Coventry school claiming to be a 15-year-old boy as parents feared he 'looked like a 40-year-old' is now being taught apart from other pupils.

Parents at the school in Coventry raised concerns after the asylum-seeker student - who appeared to be a balding, adult male - joined the school in October.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/13313005/coventry-school-adult-asylum-seeker-pupil/

Similar to https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7808973/school-pupil-adult-asylum-seeker-faces-deportation/

01-12-2020 6:18am

biko wrote: »

Soon at a school near you.

It'll be interesting when these migrants start self-identifying too. after all, if it's something westerners can do... :rolleyes:

V8 Interceptor · 01-12-2020 8:54am

RyanthePirate wrote: »

I would like to see a Boards.ie Consensus. Economists agree that immigration has a net positive on the economy and this immigration is surely a wonderful thing for the county.

Agree/Disagree?

endacl wrote: »

Hard to imagine a dish that can’t be improved by adding a dash of spice. Good thing.

Why is the one pro argument always culinary related?

Randy Archer · 01-12-2020 1:09pm

Geuze wrote: »

About the IBC and leave to remain.............

I see African children in secondary school and college, aged 15-20.

Other than being the children of doctors with work visas to work here, I am curious as to how they are here?

I'm guessing they are foreign-born or Irish-born children of parents who were bogus AS during 1995-2005?

Is that a reasonable guess?

It’s an educated guess. It’s not really a guess at all. It is facts . However, to avoid misleading people and acknowledging the truth :

Most of those kids are NOT children of doctors Or work permit holders, particularly the Africans - that’s just a reality .

Why ? In addition to the asylum reports, the department of jobs /employment also have their own archive of Annual reports for the issuing of work permits for each year and the country of origin

Some of the children that you refer to are Irish born and thus Irish citizens. How their parents got in includes dodgy asylum claims and it includes legitimate routes like work permits

Some of the children were born elsewhere but their parents got status because the mother gave birth to a child in Ireland before the change in the citizenship rules

Then of course, we have to take into account that some kids are children of declared refugees . Eg Iran , Iraq, Somalia , Afghanistan , the odd Pakistani (gay or women cases), Kosovo , Kenya , Zimbabwe (Mugabe was a nutter) . You do get the odd Georgian who can prove that they had political problems .

Then you got the leave to remain cases. Eg failed asylum seekers for whatever reason. The department delay for a long time to make a decision , through no fault of the applicant (and they have a lawful right to appeal and go to the high court) and maybe a child was born in Ireland but not a citizen

There is also the possibility that some Africans genuinely hold duel citizenship of an EU State eg Ghana and German... French and Algerian etc .

While Nigeria did have legitimate problems prior to 1999 , most of these guys failed in their asylum cases across Europe. Mainly due to credibility . Same with Cameroon and Ghana - common country of origins for asylum seekers in the early 2000s

The alarm bells for the Irish State pre 2005 was the amount of cases involving heavily pregnant women coming in without visas And fake passports (dont need them when applying for asylum) , giving birth , and within 2 weeks ,withdrawing their asylum case (the sole legal basis for being allowed into the country) . They then apply for leave to remain on the basis of Irish citizen child.

There are judicial reviews involving mothers losing their leave to remain (extremely difficult to lose the leave to remain) Because the cops found out that the mothers and kids went back to their home country a lot and for a few years (hang on, weren’t they in danger?)

In fact, that famous town councillor in the midlands (2007/2008) claimed asylum in Ireland on foot of religious persecution in his home land , in his community. Got status on IBC instead. Guess what he did when he became town mayor ? Went to his home land and got a hero’s welcome. RTE came with him. How lovely . But wait, wasn’t he telling the world and it’s mother that those same people persecuted him for his religious beliefs ? People who get refugee status can not return home - I know he didn’t get refugee status, but the principle still applies

V8 Interceptor · 01-12-2020 1:17pm

suicide_circus wrote: »

there is an inescapable link between those in favour of mass immigration and those who generally do not have to compete with those immigrants for jobs.

They don't live in diversity rich areas either. They're all for diversity but for everyone except them.

Gervais08 · 01-12-2020 1:18pm

Randy Archer wrote: »

It’s an educated guess. It’s not really a guess at all. It is facts . However, to avoid misleading people and acknowledging the truth :

Most of those kids are NOT children of doctors Or work permit holders, particularly the Africans - that’s just a reality .

Why ? In addition to the asylum reports, the department of jobs /employment also have their own archive of Annual reports for the issuing of work permits for each year and the country of origin

Some of the children that you refer to are Irish born and thus Irish citizens. How their parents got in includes dodgy asylum claims and it includes legitimate routes like work permits

Some of the children were born elsewhere but their parents got status because the mother gave birth to a child in Ireland before the change in the citizenship rules

Then of course, we have to take into account that some kids are children of declared refugees . Eg Iran , Iraq, Somalia , Afghanistan , the odd Pakistani (gay or women cases), Kosovo , Kenya , Zimbabwe (Mugabe was a nutter) . You do get the odd Georgian who can prove that they had political problems .

Then you got the leave to remain cases. Eg failed asylum seekers for whatever reason. The department delay for a long time to make a decision , through no fault of the applicant (and they have a lawful right to appeal and go to the high court) and maybe a child was born in Ireland but not a citizen

There is also the possibility that some Africans genuinely hold duel citizenship of an EU State eg Ghana and German... French and Algerian etc .

While Nigeria did have legitimate problems prior to 1999 , most of these guys failed in their asylum cases across Europe. Mainly due to credibility . Same with Cameroon and Ghana - common country of origins for asylum seekers in the early 2000s

The alarm bells for the Irish State pre 2005 was the amount of cases involving heavily pregnant women coming in without visas And fake passports (dont need them when applying for asylum) , giving birth , and within 2 weeks ,withdrawing their asylum case (the sole legal basis for being allowed into the country) . They then apply for leave to remain on the basis of Irish citizen child.

There are judicial reviews involving mothers losing their leave to remain (extremely difficult to lose the leave to remain) Because the cops found out that the mothers and kids went back to their home country a lot and for a few years (hang on, weren’t they in danger?)

In fact, that famous town councillor in the midlands (2007/2008) claimed asylum in Ireland on foot of religious persecution in his home land , in his community. Got status on IBC instead. Guess what he did when he became town mayor ? Went to his home land and got a hero’s welcome. RTE came with him. How lovely . But wait, wasn’t he telling the world and it’s mother that those same people persecuted him for his religious beliefs ? People who get refugee status can not return home - I know he didn’t get refugee status, but the principle still applies

I live near that town - didn’t he end up as Mayor???’

Utter **** his story from start to finish.

01-12-2020 1:31pm

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

They don't live in diversity rich areas either. They're all for diversity but for everyone except them.

I don't think that's true anymore.

The numbers of people who live in particularly exclusive areas is limited, and they're not isolated (since most shopping/services are shared). There is a lot of support for diversity from a wide range of university graduates over the last few decades. Even when I went to university/college 20 years ago, there were student union campaigns to promote immigration and diversity.. and few from my college would have been wealthy.

The simple truth is that there is money in diversity. Agencies, NGOs or government/public institutions/offices. The people who support diversity will often work in those positions, and won't be living in exclusive areas..

Nah. I know people who harp on about the benefits of immigration, and helping others, and they do live near the immigrants they support. I think it's inaccurate to pass this off on to the upper middle class or the rich, because our society has shifted so much, due to the introduction of social media.

For example, my sister in law is a diehard supporter of immigration and having more foreigners here. She does funding drives, will go on marches, and is quite outspoken on the overall issue. Totally incapable of taking in any objections from others. She works for the Department of Education, and earns an 'average' salary, living in an 'average' housing estate. Apparently most of her friends are similar..

V8 Interceptor · 01-12-2020 1:59pm

Fair enough Klaz. Perhaps that's the case. Looking at people on TV etc seems to paint a different story. Eg John Snow "I've never seen so many whites in one place" lives in a rich 99% white area in England. Then I recall the woman who's head of a refugee quango going to court with her neighbour Pat Kenny to stop an affordable apartment scheme going up beside them in Dalkey.

I do believe if an official policy of placing all new DP centers in relatively affluent areas was announced in the morning you'd see a lot of them change their tune.

01-12-2020 2:09pm

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

Fair enough Klaz. Perhaps that's the case. Looking at people on TV etc seems to paint a different story. Eg John Snow "I've never seen so many whites in one place" lives in a rich 99% white area in England. Then I recall the woman who's head of a refugee quango going to court with her neighbour Pat Kenny to stop an affordable apartment scheme going up beside them in Dalkey.

I do believe if an official policy of placing all new DP centers in relatively affluent areas was announced in the morning you'd see a lot of them change their tune.

My parents live in an estate that is 100% white. Does it matter that three of the families are from continental Europe? It's an estate with 16 fairly large houses.. and is considered one of the better estates in our town (my parents were dirt poor when they first started working). However, it's now surrounded by 7 other larger estates, which were either traditionally working class estates, or new estates with a lower purchase price. So, while our estate is considered to be worth more, we're well stuck in with everyone else.. because the truly wealthy buy houses outside the town, in the countryside.

I sit by a window facing out on the a busy road (leads to many of the schools), and every so often, I'll see a family of Black people, or others speaking in foreign languages... because they live nearby. There's no privacy wall, or security guards to prevent them from walking into our estate because we face the road. Grand.

The point being that in my hometown there's very little separation, except possibly on home value, but even there I know that the council has given properties to migrants. Just as they did with Travellers and other low income families.

As for DP centers, there's one about a mile from where my parents live, and most people use the road outside their house to reach the town. Again.. there's no separation because they walk through the area.. and since we all use the same shopping centers, shops or services...

weldoninhio · 01-12-2020 2:16pm

Zookey123 wrote: »

Silence due to very little room for discussion. If posters here were actually interested in what the opposite side thought on this topic rather then locked and loaded with gotcha points usually found online via some American media personality there could actually be a healthy discussion. And insults have come from both sides to be fair.

So tell us, what are some of the advantages of multiculturalism?

V8 Interceptor · 01-12-2020 2:26pm

Deleted User wrote: »

For example, my sister in law is a diehard supporter of immigration and having more foreigners here. She does funding drives, will go on marches, and is quite outspoken on the overall issue. Totally incapable of taking in any objections from others. She works for the Department of Education, and earns an 'average' salary, living in an 'average' housing estate. Apparently most of her friends are similar..

If the council bought the two houses either side of her and put a Pakistani Muslim family in one and an Afghan family in the other, would she/they have no problem with it?

01-12-2020 3:19pm

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

If the council bought the two houses either side of her and put a Pakistani Muslim family in one and an Afghan family in the other, would she/they have no problem with it?

I've no idea... but I seriously doubt it... but then, i wouldn't have any issue with it myself (since I have spent time living in Muslim countries before)

People rarely get to see what happens within a Muslim family... it's all smiles to everyone external to the family unit.

Gervais08 · 01-12-2020 4:31pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

My parents live in an estate that is 100% white. Does it matter that three of the families are from continental Europe? It's an estate with 16 fairly large houses.. and is considered one of the better estates in our town (my parents were dirt poor when they first started working). However, it's now surrounded by 7 other larger estates, which were either traditionally working class estates, or new estates with a lower purchase price. So, while our estate is considered to be worth more, we're well stuck in with everyone else.. because the truly wealthy buy houses outside the town, in the countryside.

I sit by a window facing out on the a busy road (leads to many of the schools), and every so often, I'll see a family of Black people, or others speaking in foreign languages... because they live nearby. There's no privacy wall, or security guards to prevent them from walking into our estate because we face the road. Grand.

The point being that in my hometown there's very little separation, except possibly on home value, but even there I know that the council has given properties to migrants. Just as they did with Travellers and other low income families.

As for DP centers, there's one about a mile from where my parents live, and most people use the road outside their house to reach the town. Again.. there's no separation because they walk through the area.. and since we all use the same shopping centers, shops or services...

We’re about 45-50 houses, mainly white (it’s the middle of Ireland!) but we’ve black families, a family with a single Middle Eastern dad (never seen a partner); two Chinese families down the end by me. And my neighbour is from darkest Roscommon....

Lovely community - everyone welcome. Mainly because everyone came here legally and wanted.

It’s not immigrants or even immigration that is the problem, it’s unwanted massive numbers and illegals.

01-12-2020 5:16pm

Gervais08 wrote: »

We’re about 45-50 houses, mainly white (it’s the middle of Ireland!) but we’ve black families, a family with a single Middle Eastern dad (never seen a partner); two Chinese families down the end by me. And my neighbour is from darkest Roscommon....

Lovely community - everyone welcome. Mainly because everyone came here legally and wanted.

It’s not immigrants or even immigration that is the problem, it’s unwanted massive numbers and illegals.

I agree that, in the short term (a decade or two), legal immigration isn't a problem. The issue is more about the long term effects when integration hasn't been emphasized, as part of their stay here, and their children start hitting the teenage years. This has been borne out in all European countries where many of the children of migrants feel disconnected from the culture of the host country, but also disconnected from their native culture... which can lead to hostility, bitterness, etc.

I'd be happier if we had extensive research into this, and a working plan to ensure integration, thus avoiding the problems that other countries have.

V8 Interceptor · 01-12-2020 5:31pm

Klaz if your sis-in-law and her types didn't have their own homes do you think they'd still go out marching to ban Direct Provision and put the refugees straight into Council houses they themselves still hadn't been given after 7 years on waiting list?

jmreire · 01-12-2020 5:38pm

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

If the council bought the two houses either side of her and put a Pakistani Muslim family in one and an Afghan family in the other, would she/they have no problem with it?

Would all depend on what they would be like...the best in the world, or the neighbours from hell.

Yellow_Fern · 01-12-2020 6:24pm

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

Klaz if your sis-in-law and her types didn't have their own homes do you think they'd still go out marching to ban Direct Provision and put the refugees straight into Council houses they themselves still hadn't been given after 7 years on waiting list?

To far there are plenty paying a fortune in rent in the big cities who are very open borders leaning. Worrying about why people come to the positions they do is probably a waste of time, the best thing we can do try to do is be honest brokers and raise the issue in the clearest, most respectful way to the media or to politicians.

01-12-2020 7:14pm

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

Klaz if your sis-in-law and her types didn't have their own homes do you think they'd still go out marching to ban Direct Provision and put the refugees straight into Council houses they themselves still hadn't been given after 7 years on waiting list?

I didn't say that my sis-in-law had her own home. I said she works for the Dept of Education. She rents an apartment in Dublin, and has been saving to get a mortgage for.... I dunno. I don't talk to her except at unavoidable family get-togethers.

And yes, I think many people will continue to support immigration, diversity, etc even though they're renting and are struggling to get their own homes... because "they care". :rolleyes: (wish I could do sound effects but I imagine you know the tone of voice for that one). Virtue signalling is a full-time activity for many people (and no, I don't mean that they're too rich to work, or support themselves).

Have you ever attended one of the woke/sjw marches or gatherings, talking about minority rights? Many of them are willing, even begging, to be sacrificed to save others. The problem being that they're willing to sacrifice others too for whatever crusade they believe in.

V8 Interceptor · 01-12-2020 7:28pm

I've not been Sir. They sound hideous. Where do they get this sacrificial (some might say suicidal) ideation from?

I think you mentioned it earlier. 3rd level institutions. They're nuts.

01-12-2020 8:07pm

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

I've not been Sir. They sound hideous. Where do they get this sacrificial (some might say suicidal) ideation from?

I think you mentioned it earlier. 3rd level institutions. They're nuts.

Only some of it comes from the universities. Thankfully, we're not the same as the US for this rubbish, although it does exist. The problem is that many people study/read feminist based articles and get a lot of the ideas from there, which are then expanded on social media to cover other crusades. Then, there's also the people who travel/study in the US and bring these ideas back with them. My in-law worked in the US for a few years and came back with all these 'radical' ideas.

John Doe1 · 01-12-2020 11:42pm

https://www.thejournal.ie/germany-trier-car-kills-two-people-driver-arrested-5285133-Dec2020/

5 killed including baby......

God almighty

Eric Cartman · 02-12-2020 12:13am

John Doe1 wrote: »

https://www.thejournal.ie/germany-trier-car-kills-two-people-driver-arrested-5285133-Dec2020/

5 killed including baby......

God almighty

'German born' , they're really trying to hide that one..

The_Kew_Tour · 02-12-2020 3:07am

Housing Crisis will never go away if we let this just become the norm Of letting everybody in.

But it’s just one area. Health system will continue to struggle

And education. Classroooms are getting larger and larger.

Unless we start printing free money (giggle) good luck with all that.

I honestly think some people think a house or a school just grows in trees.

Everything is getting more and more expensive. It will be a race to the bottom if we just think we can solve every problem around the world.

Kivaro · 02-12-2020 10:12am

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

......

Everything is getting more and more expensive. It will be a race to the bottom if we just think we can solve every problem around the world.

It is indeed a race to the bottom, with our children and grandchildren destined to suffer the consequences. With the massive population increases expected in 3rd world countries e.g. Nigeria to have 400 million people by 2050, and Africa having the second largest population by the end of the century, high welfare/lax border-entry countries like Ireland will be a primary target for millions of poor, uneducated economic migrants in the coming years. The constantly repeated argument to "take in our share" by those with a vested or naive view will sentence Ireland to a dystopian future unimaginable now.

Time is running out to change the cultural and economical suicidal trajectory of our country, and it can only be stopped by getting a political party in power who respects the will of the majority; a majority (at the moment) whose demographic is that of a contributing or working member of the community.

KevRossi · 02-12-2020 10:27am

Eric Cartman wrote: »

'German born' , they're really trying to hide that one..

His name is Bernd W.* , aged 51, born in Germany seemed to be a loner and with possible psychological problems. Was drunk and had medication taken. Seems to have spoken to police about the reasons why he did it.

* German police and media do not release the full names of suspects until they are convicted.

https://www.bild.de/video/clip/news/trauerfeier-nach-amokfahrt-in-trier-live-deutscher-51-fuhr-mit-suv-fuenf-mensche-bild-live-74250286.bild.html

Eric Cartman · 02-12-2020 12:15pm

KevRossi wrote: »

His name is Bernd W.* , aged 51, born in Germany seemed to be a loner and with possible psychological problems. Was drunk and had medication taken. Seems to have spoken to police about the reasons why he did it.

* German police and media do not release the full names of suspects until they are convicted.

https://www.bild.de/video/clip/news/trauerfeier-nach-amokfahrt-in-trier-live-deutscher-51-fuhr-mit-suv-fuenf-mensche-bild-live-74250286.bild.html

this has now become clear. It struck me as similar to when the BBC try muddy the waters of the nationality of offenders but it appears this time the journal were not hiding anything.

Hamsterchops · 02-12-2020 12:38pm

I think multiculturalism is fine if introduced slowly over the years/decades, and in moderation.

There at many bad examples in Britain of how not to make a country multicultural. Whole towns have been taken over with a massive & overpowering influx of people from a totally different culture, thereby displacing the replacing the indigenous population, ergo there really are towns in England where the English language & English culture is in 2nd or 3rd place.

I'm told that a multicultural society is the better for it, and my own perspective is yes, it probably is, as I've also witnessed in Britain & other countries, but it should be attained gradually and in a controlled manner, and not as mentioned above.

Arthur Daley · 02-12-2020 12:58pm

Hamsterchops wrote: »

There at many bad examples in Britain of how not to make a country multicultural. Whole towns have been taken over with a massive & overpowering influx of people from a totally different culture, thereby displacing the replacing the indigenous population, ergo there really are towns in England where the English language & English culture is in 2nd or 3rd place.

Some will think this is hyperbole, but the reality in London is that things are only going in one direction now.

These are the Tory and Labour candidates for London mayor (one of these will win it):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaun_Bailey_(AM)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sadiq_Khan

All very acceptable candidates in their parliamentary parties I'm sure, and all the rest of it, but the pace of change has been shocking.

Wibbs · 02-12-2020 1:12pm

Sure H, but how can it be controlled? Trying to butts up against human nature and freedoms we take for granted. For example like I was saying earlier how do you stop the natural human tendency to want to live in an area where more of your people and culture live? You would have to bring in some sort of legislation that actively discriminated against some groups over the locals, thereby forcing people to live where they may not want to live. Totally unworkable. The only way to stop ghettoisation and all the other negatives of multiculturalism is to restrict multiculturalism itself to small numbers overall and favouring those who are more likely to integrate over time.

02-12-2020 1:18pm

Arthur Daley wrote: »

Some will think this is hyperbole, but the reality in London is that things are only going in one direction now.

These are the Tory and Labour candidates for London mayor (one of these will win it):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaun_Bailey_(AM)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sadiq_Khan

All very acceptable candidates in their parliamentary parties I'm sure, and all the rest of it, but the pace of change has been shocking.

I'm sorry but what is wrong with these two guys?

What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

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