Old Tool Restoration

..Brian.. · 11-04-2016 11:05pm

Great thread. My workshop (large uninsulated cavity block garage) gets very cold and damp so the condensation that builds up on my tools is a nightmare for creating rust. I'm currently building a wall hanging tool cabinet for them all with the hope being that it will keep the condensation off them. Once that's complete, I will be cleaning up and restoring about 5 planes, including a recently acquired No.7 that I haven't touched at all yet. It has a load of surface rust on it but should clean up nicely.

To clean them up I plan just just use wet and dry paper and a load of elbow grease. Will also flatten the soles using the same wet and dry stuck to a 10mm thick piece of glass shelf from a glass display stand. The irons will be sorted out using my cheapo Amtech diamond plates (really need to get a nice set of diamond plates!) and a strop.

Will post some before and after pics ..... if they turn out well! :P

magicbastarder · 12-04-2016 12:52pm

might be an idea to merge this with the other 'old tool restoration' thread?

on the topic, i've a tenon saw which is probably at least 40 years old at home. rather than me making a dud job of sharpening it, is there anywhere in dublin (city centre or northside) which would offer sharpening services?

imakebiodiesel · 12-04-2016 1:48pm

The sheet of plate glass is absolutely essential for renovating plane bodies. I see in Paul Sellers video he has a large precision machined steel plate. I dont think this is necessary and offers no advantage over plate glass except that it wont break if you drop it. The longer the piece of glass the better, I would go for 24 inches or longer if you intend to work on no 7 and 8s. About 8 inches wide is good so that you can tape the 6 inch rolls of sandpaper to it. 8 or 10mm plate is best and glaziers will sometimes have offcuts they will let you have . Either have the glazier buff the edges smooth or do it yourself with a coarse diamond sharpening stone.

I sent Kadman a message yesterday and I see the posts from Tool Suppliers have been removed so hopefully they will appear here on this thread soon.

Sparks · 12-04-2016 1:49pm

I think Sellers has a block of granite and some tempered glass, did I miss the video with the steel plate?

imakebiodiesel · 12-04-2016 2:34pm

Collibosher wrote: »

On the subject of plane restoration projects, I picked up this Record 0220 at a market for 3 euro a while back. It looks worse in the photo than it actually is, mostly light surface rust and dust.

Will be my first project, so midway through the Paul Sellers video linked to above.

I notice that Paul Sellers uses a large machined steel plate to flatten and clean his planes, I dont think that is necessary, a piece of heavy plate glass is just a good. Start with the ordinary dry sandpaper you can buy in rolls from hardware shops. 120 grit is a good general purpose cleaning paper and will quickly reveal if there are any high or low spots. When the whole surface is cleaned switch to 240 and then move up to very fine wet and dry to finish off. Sometimes cleaning will reveal faults like pitting and cracks. i would not be too concerned about a small amount of pitting provided its not around the mouth. Cracks are something else. Large cracks will probably get worse over time so my advice is to go ahead and use the plane and in the meantime look out on Ebay for a replacement body, they do turn up and are usually reasonably cheap. Ratherthan make this post too long Ill leave it there and when you get the body cleaned we can look at the workings and the blade.

imakebiodiesel · 12-04-2016 6:31pm

I mistook the block of granite for metal.

Calahonda52 · 12-04-2016 7:09pm

magicbastarder wrote: »

might be an idea to merge this with the other 'old tool restoration' thread?

on the topic, i've a tenon saw which is probably at least 40 years old at home. rather than me making a dud job of sharpening it, is there anywhere in dublin (city centre or northside) which would offer sharpening services?

we are trying to get the relevant posts moved over here..:)
re saw
http://www.citysawservices.com/index.php
its easy to miss in heavy traffic
or
http://www.carbide.ie in Coolock

Call both to make sure they will do it...

jack of all · 12-04-2016 9:29pm

Thanks for starting this thread OP; I've often admired the fine tools you have for sale on Adverts, if you weren't so far from me I'd be a customer for sure! I love buying, restoring and using old tools myself, it's very satisfying to find an old piece of "junk" and restore it to working condition.

Sparks · 12-04-2016 9:46pm

...and it seems I have a record no. 7 to tidy up a little after today. Sorted

My entire shopping list of tools is almost done now, if I could find a nice 71 that would be all the nice-to-haves as well (and by a sequence of weird and honestly unplanned coincidences, everything I've gotten so far has been by record, so I might as well get a record 071 I suppose just to be precious about it). Time to start thinking about ordering lumber and actually using these things now

imakebiodiesel · 13-04-2016 11:43am

Good 71 routers can be expensive, but if you can find one cheaply with the cutters missing it quite easy to make cutters from large allen keys.You will need a vice to hold the allen key in , a handgrinder, a plumbers blowtorch and some waste oil. Before you start down load images of the real cutters so that you have a good idea of the angles. use a cutting disc and then a grinding disc to replicate the shape of the original cutter. When you are happy with the shape, heat the tip of the blade to a dull red heat and then drop it into a small can of waste oil. Do this in a well ventilated area and place a lid over the can to contain the smoke and prevent the oil catching fire. When the cutter has cooled hone and strop it as normal.
With a bit of practice you could even make make curved cutters for creating flutes.

my3cents · 14-04-2016 9:57am

imakebiodiesel wrote: »

Good 71 routers can be expensive, but if you can find one cheaply with the cutters missing it quite easy to make cutters from large allen keys.You will need a vice to hold the allen key in , a handgrinder, a plumbers blowtorch and some waste oil. Before you start down load images of the real cutters so that you have a good idea of the angles. use a cutting disc and then a grinding disc to replicate the shape of the original cutter. When you are happy with the shape, heat the tip of the blade to a dull red heat and then drop it into a small can of waste oil. Do this in a well ventilated area and place a lid over the can to contain the smoke and prevent the oil catching fire. When the cutter has cooled hone and strop it as normal.
With a bit of practice you could even make make curved cutters for creating flutes.

How times have changed, I picked up an old Stanley 71 in about 1980 and it was missing a couple of bits so I phoned Stanley and they posted out all the bits I needed for free :eek:

imakebiodiesel · 14-04-2016 4:26pm

my3cents wrote: »

How times have changed, I picked up an old Stanley 71 in about 1980 and it was missing a couple of bits so I phoned Stanley and they posted out all the bits I needed for free :eek:

Those were the days.
Now companies put you on hold and then charge you for the 20 minutes it took to tell you its out of stock.

imakebiodiesel · 17-04-2016 6:23pm

Now this will be a challenge. Ive been after one of these for years, a combination drawknife and hollowing knife. Bought it on Ebay for 20 quid, its heavily rusted, the handles are split and woodwormed and who knows what horrors lurk behind that bandage. Ill post pics of it when Ive finished.

my3cents · 17-04-2016 6:40pm

imakebiodiesel wrote: »

Now this will be a challenge. Ive been after one of these for years, a combination drawknife and hollowing knife. Bought it on Ebay for 20 quid, its heavily rusted, the handles are split and woodwormed and who knows what horrors lurk behind that bandage. Ill post pics of it when Ive finished.

Are you sure its a hollowing knife? I'll take a look at some old books later as I've half an idea there is a particular purpose to that tool?

imakebiodiesel · 17-04-2016 8:01pm

Im pretty sure its a hollowing knife, I ve used one like it for about 20 years, mine has the curved part but does not have the two flat blades to either side. I use it for hollowing the inside of staves in coopering work. Interestingly the bandage didnt hide any nasty suprises. I have a theory that the knife had been used as an improvised Jigger knife and the bandage served as a temporary handle. Look up images of a jigger knife to see what i mean. Ive turned two new handles for it from some Spanish chestnut and Ill fit them when Ive cleaned up the blade.

my3cents · 18-04-2016 12:43am

Couldn't find anything but still have a few places to look. Might have been one that someone showed me I'm thinking of or in a auction catalog I no longer have.

tbh the tool doesn't make any sense to me? A lot of effort to make it when it could be made much more easily without the flat part of the blade unless its a plain draw knife that has been modified? Interesting if the makers mark, if there is one, is on the curve.

Which side of the curve is the blade sharpened? Inside or outside? Looks like inside?

Also which side is the makers mark if there is one? Interesting if its on the curve but doubt that.

Nearest I could find was this http://www.greatplanestrading.com/HnH-10/HtH_2010.html see photo for 002, sort of in the area of use I was expecting (I was thinking wheelwright) but that one looks like its made for doing an outer edge and may not be an inshave at all (sharpened on the outside of the curve when it would be much easier to sharpen on the inside unless there is a good reason not to).

imakebiodiesel · 18-04-2016 7:57pm

Well I spent a pleasant Sunday working on this tool and it went pretty well. Its a blacksmith made tool so no makers mark. Its lamininated with a thin layer of hard carbon steel firewelded onto a wrought iron frame. Its well done but not brilliantly so you can see the weld line clearly on the top of the blade. the bevel is on the outside of the curve. I suspect this was a tool made for a country cooper or white cooper. Many of these coopers were journeymen and combining two tool into one would have been an advantage where as it would have made no sense for the cooper employed in a distillery or brewery. I tried it out on some oak staves I have lying around and it cuts very nicely after just one honing. The hollowing part of the knife is tricky to sharpen but works well.
I made new handles, quite different from the originals as I find those fat oval handles a bit uncomfortable.
Over all Im pleased and I may well find it becomes one of my favourite tools.

Sparks · 19-04-2016 1:31pm

My Number 7 just arrived. Pristine condition, far better than I was expecting. A minimal amount of rust on the top of the blade, none on the body, most of the original paint intact, the handles are solid and secure (though the finish is gone, so that's going to be scraped off and replaced with some boiled linseed oil), and the frog looks sound (I haven't fully disassembled it because I'm still in the office

).

Best of all? The blade happily says "best crucible cast tungsten steel"

And all of that for €55 (okay, plus €30 shipping). I think I got a damn good bargain there

my3cents · 19-04-2016 2:26pm

Sparks wrote: »

My Number 7 just arrived. Pristine condition, far better than I was expecting. A minimal amount of rust on the top of the blade, none on the body, most of the original paint intact, the handles are solid and secure (though the finish is gone, so that's going to be scraped off and replaced with some boiled linseed oil), and the frog looks sound (I haven't fully disassembled it because I'm still in the office ).

Best of all? The blade happily says "best crucible cast tungsten steel"

And all of that for €55 (okay, plus €30 shipping). I think I got a damn good bargain there

If you are sticking with Record then you could keep an eye out for a stayset (think thats the trade name) cap iron to go with that blade.

Actually its Stay-Set just looked up the spelling and found a nice Record dating page here. Clifton also do a modern version of the Stay-Set cap iron.

Sparks · 19-04-2016 2:56pm

To be honest, I didn't even want to get a record collection thing going, it pretty much happened by accident (and my 9 1/2 is a stanley so it's not even a collection really

). But I am going to be precious about the last item on my list (the router plane) and try for a record 071 instead of a stanley (hey, might as well).

Also, I saw the stay-set stuff before; I'm sure it works great, but there's just something about having a dirty great "SS" stamped on the front of the thing that gave me a bit of a pause

my3cents · 19-04-2016 3:02pm

The Stay-Set is just handy info really just in case you are rummaging around in a box of rusty junk at a car boot sale and find one.

imakebiodiesel · 21-04-2016 10:49am

Congrats on the no 7, you certainly got a bargain, that blade is worth €30 on its own. Cast steel is lovely metal, very easy to sharpen, one note of caution however if you need to regrind the edge. Cast steel will not tolerate any overheating so cool the blade constantly with cold water. What about a picture?

Sparks · 24-04-2016 1:57pm

imakebiodiesel wrote: »

What about a picture?

Here you go:

Sparks · 24-04-2016 2:08pm

And its new cousins:

They don't need much in the way of restoration (I was using them only yesterday and they worked perfectly well), but the little bit that'd be nice (refinishing the paint job) is a bit beyond me at the moment. I've read people have been able to do it with low-temperature enamel in BS110 blue using domestic ovens, but the only time I've used enamel, it was more to do with airfix than metal

woodturner · 24-04-2016 7:43pm

Here's a few I picked up a while back. None really needed any work just a sharpening.

my3cents · 24-04-2016 8:02pm

woodturner wrote: »

Here's a few I picked up a while back. None really needed any work just a sharpening.

Looks like it your picture proves something that I was going to say earlier about dating, you have to be careful that the parts your are dating are all original. It looks to me the SS (Stay-Set) Record may have a (ST)ANLEY frog in it?

Larger planes and rarer ones are less susceptible to parts being swapped but I've seen a few No. 4's put together from the best bits available.

Sparks · 24-04-2016 8:30pm

Jealous of your 071 though

imakebiodiesel · 25-04-2016 9:17pm

My 3 cents is right , you can just see the end of the word Stanley on the lateral adjustment lever. It probably works perfectly but if it bothers you I might have a Record frog in my spares box that i could swap with you.

Wossack · 25-04-2016 9:37pm

painting an old woden 189b vice at the mo. Just throwing some hammerite at it, and buffing up the shiny bits so hardly a restoration mind! Could do with a darker blue perhaps.. my test piece is looking a bit too bright (more record blue then that darker woden blue)

woodturner · 26-04-2016 12:08pm

imakebiodiesel wrote: »

My 3 cents is right , you can just see the end of the word Stanley on the lateral adjustment lever. It probably works perfectly but if it bothers you I might have a Record frog in my spares box that i could swap with you.

Yeah I don't mind. When I got the plane the lateral lever was broken on the original frog.

Old Tool Restoration

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