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14-05-2019, 22:40   #61
iamwhoiam
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Right, I'll try again.

She's asked does she feel safe in her home. She's not asked this when she goes to the doctor generally, it's because she is pregnant. So the question mustn't be for her it's for the unborn child. Which is ours. So following this logic if it's also mine, why am I not being asked is she keeping her end up also?
Its been explained to you in the thread that pregnancy has been shown to put women at risk of domestic abuse . They are also at a higher risk of being abused post natal . So I think you really should understand that this question is about the mother and her baby and keeping them safe
So right then its about her and just live with it that you are not the focus of attention
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14-05-2019, 22:55   #62
ceadaoin.
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Right, I'll try again.

She's asked does she feel safe in her home. She's not asked this when she goes to the doctor generally, it's because she is pregnant. So the question mustn't be for her it's for the unborn child. Which is ours. So following this logic if it's also mine, why am I not being asked is she keeping her end up also?
No, the question is for her, she doesn't cease to exist as a person once she is pregnant. Being pregnant is a risk factor for abuse and the WHO recommend that this question be asked to identify at risk women and offer help. They would also ask this question in other scenarios such as repeated injuries or something like that. Why do you seem to be taking it so personally?

You don't need to be asked if she is "keeping her end up" because she is able to answer those questions herself as an adult.

Last edited by ceadaoin.; 14-05-2019 at 22:58.
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14-05-2019, 22:56   #63
Muir
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I've known of both men and women to have similar questions asked when seeking healthcare in regards to mental health. It's not only asked during pregnancy. It's asked in circumstances where abuse is more likely. Also, circumstances where seeking help is more likely, for example a child might be the push someone needs to leave an abusive relationship.

As regards asking a partner about smoking and drinking, would you like it if your GP called your partner when you had appointments to verify things you told them? I'm guessing that'd be a no from most people. It's no where near the same thing.

I haven't had a chance to watch the documentary yet but I'm looking forward to catching up on it.
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14-05-2019, 23:03   #64
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Is this repeated anywhere? I meant to tape it but forgot
It is shown again Thursday night BBC 2.
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14-05-2019, 23:14   #65
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No , why would you be entitled to same duty of care ? Are you pregnant ? Carrying a child ? About to give birth ?
Honestly get a grip . The mother and child are the primary focus here
Right, I'll try again.

She's asked does she feel safe in her home. She's not asked this when she goes to the doctor generally, it's because she is pregnant. So the question mustn't be for her it's for the unborn child. Which is ours. So following this logic if it's also mine, why am I not being asked is she keeping her end up also?
Take yourself down the gp and tell them that your wife is pregnant and you would like a full antinatal check up including being asked if you feel safe in your home. Them get them to ring your wife to ask if you’ve been smoking or drinking. Problem solved - you won’t feel left out.
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14-05-2019, 23:50   #66
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Louis thereoux isn’t he the guy from Dark Tourist?
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15-05-2019, 00:21   #67
Glass fused light
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My wife is pregnant, at one of the appointments there was a part that I wasn't in with her for. She was asked was she safe in her home, apparently standard a question. Fair enough I'm not the patient in their care however my unborn son is. Surely they should have asked me how she was coping, is she drinking or smoking.
Well hello, what do we have here .... maternity care providers what attitudes should we 'red flag' as they could indicate a controlling partner?
Well how about this, let's get the partner in a room ask him who the patient is and let's see how he reacts to questions which should be addressed directly by/to the woman growing the baby!

You are only there with the permission of your wife.  Your unborn son is not the patient your wife is.  It's her body and therefore all the decisions, medical or otherwise, remain under her control until the birth.

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She's being afforded this additional duty of care not for herself but because of our child.
No she is being afforded this additional duty of care because of you.
As her partner, you are statistically more likely to commence a pattern of abuse or to escalate existing domestic abuse (up to and including violence), which can escalate towards the end of the pregnancy, and continue after the birth.

If  physical violence is happening the pregnancy complicates the risk to her health as she has the additional concern of protecting her womb during an attack.

After the birth the identification and treatment of any hormonal imbalance (a side effect of pregnancy) can be complicated by domestic abuse




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It is shown again Thursday night BBC 2.
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Last edited by Glass fused light; 15-05-2019 at 02:00. Reason: ^ more
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15-05-2019, 00:58   #68
Gimme A Pound
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To be fair, I can understand a father to be feeling uncomfortable with the expectant mother being asked if she feels safe at home. Even if it isn't personal and is just a box ticking exercise.
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15-05-2019, 01:07   #69
Obvious Desperate Breakfasts
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There was an especially interesting talk with the clinical psychologist Dr Paul D'Alton on RTÉ's Drivetime yesterday. He was presenting an overview of the enormous field of medical evidence on the importance of stability and love in the first three years of a child's life with the emphasis on how this is affecting homeless children in Ireland today. It was a very, very disturbing listen - not least because every parent will be thinking about how they could have been better - and I got the strong impression that we are brewing up a storm when these kids grow up:

Paul D'Alton on RTÉ's Drivetime: Homeless children
No parent gets it right all the time. That’s an impossible standard.

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To be fair, I can understand a father to be feeling uncomfortable with the expectant mother being asked if she feels safe at home. Even if it isn't personal and is just a box ticking exercise.
It just needs to be made clear that it’s a routine question. Like the way I’m asked if I’m pregnant at every single scan I have now despite being on medication to shut down my ovaries for over three years.
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15-05-2019, 11:48   #70
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If the man/father had to be consulted to verify what the woman says about smoking and drinking (or any other matter), you will inevitably have men who will lie for the sake of creating drama or to get back at her or whatever & say she's smoking 60 a day and drinking every night, when she isn't.

It will be used as just another tool for abusive men to exert control over their partners.

Her word is good enough, and if she lies and is actually drinking/smoking excessively this will be picked up on.
Doctors & midwives are trained to look for signs, not just medically with the baby, but through observing the woman etc. and if there's even the tiniest suspicion they have a duty of to alert Túsla before the birth.
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15-05-2019, 12:43   #71
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I can see where Feisar is coming from, I think.
It is so important that the pregnant woman be asked questions to determine her domestic situation and if everything is ok for her. But the dad has a part to play to in raising the child. It might be an idea to ask him some questions too which will help ensure the medical professionals his partner is of sound enough mind and that the baby will be safe.

Of course there are no guarantees of a positive outcome even with questions being asked.
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15-05-2019, 13:00   #72
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??? Why is it a bizarre post? She's being treated differently as she is carrying our child. Am I not entitled to the same duty of care as she is, being asked these additional questions due to being pregnant with our child.
The pregnant female is the patient. So you wouldn't get the same duty of care as you aren't the patient.

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She's being afforded this additional duty of care not for herself but because of our child.
Not necessarily. The midwife is focused on the health of the mother and the health of the foetus. If you think about it, they are taking you /your wife at your word that you ARE actually the father and next of kin.

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I don't agree with doctors/nurses asking the pregnant woman's partner if she smokes or drinks or whatnot, obviously. They are there to provide care for her through her pregnancy, not police her. But myself I thought Feisar's wider point was interesting. I wasn't aware that questions about domestic abuse were a standard thing in antenatal care, and I'm glad to know it's there and happens.

However, I suppose as a parallel point, I don't think it would be objectionable for a doctor or nurse to ask the father-to-be if he has any concerns relating to the pregnancy. And I mean that in a very general way, not with a view towards "yes, she smokes 20 a day", more like "I feel stupid asking her this, but is XYZ normal during pregnancy?" - obviously he is not entitled to the same duty of care, not by any stretch of the imagination, he's not a patient. But he is involved, and I don't see the harm in that kind of inclusion.
They do ask if you smoke or drink or do drugs!

They ask how much and the frequency - if you do either then you get a lot of information on how it affects the foetus and directed towards a whole heap of referrals for example smoking cessation. And if you are in concerning levels they'll ask at every appointment. They also ask about how much caffeine based products you consume, how long you've taken folic acid for and so on.

They also ask very private stuff like sexual health history, whether you've been pregnant before, had any abortions or pregnancy losses - things that are not relevant to the current relationship but may cause problems for the pregnancy or the health of the mother during a pregnancy.

Men CAN ask questions at any of the antenatal visits - my partner did.

There was ONE single part out of about 10-15 check ups where he was specifically excluded and that was one part of the intake questionnaire where questions like these are asked along with questions about your relationship wrt domestic red flags.
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15-05-2019, 15:22   #73
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She's being afforded this additional duty of care not for herself but because of our child.
If I was your pregnant partner, I'd be looking to cut you loose at the earliest opportunity.

Your attitude is appalling

The whole world didn't start off as out to get you. But when you go around with a chip on your shoulder all the time, it becomes a self fulfilling prophesy
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15-05-2019, 15:23   #74
Gimme A Pound
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If I was your pregnant partner, I'd be looking to cut you loose at the earliest opportunity.

Your attitude is appalling

The whole world didn't start off as out to get you. But when you go around with a chip on your shoulder all the time, it becomes a self fulfilling prophesy
On reflection, I'd say he's taking the piss.
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15-05-2019, 15:24   #75
Feisar
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If I was your pregnant partner, I'd be looking to cut you loose at the earliest opportunity.

Your attitude is appalling

The whole world didn't start off as out to get you. But when you go around with a chip on your shoulder all the time, it becomes a self fulfilling prophesy
Ouch! I'm not that bad really and I've no chip on my shoulder.
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