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02-09-2020, 16:38   #31
Storm 10
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Also - the videos linked above would have been *so* much better in landscape mode instead of the dumb portrait mode most people record in. We would then have been able to get a better scale of the damage and destruction without a need to pan around as much.
It's beyond me why people film in portrait mode it's a waste of a good capture of any incident
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02-09-2020, 16:57   #32
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The forestry plantations will have reduced the floodwater peak from what it would have been otherwise - the root systems slow down the runoff. Now, if there was a large swathe of recently felled forestry, that would revert the behaviour to pre-forestry runoff speeds.

Bogs can take in a lot of water for sure, but only up to a certain rate. Above that rainfall rate the extra runs straight off. Source? I've a mate who is a forestry manager, and I've also observed this behaviour after 25 years of watching floodwater levels on Irish streams with my kayaking background.

I would suspect that if it were not for the forestry work, there would have been a mudflow/bogflow situation with the peat mobilising similar to that at the Dawn of Hope Bridge in Sligo and that would have been significantly worse for the Clifden residents.
Forestry would reduce peak flow - except for the drainage ditches which vastly speed up the rate of water runoff.
I'm not familiar with any of the forestry near clifden, but those I've seen in the past across the country usually have ditches dug for drainage and other reasons - stops the forest floor getting waterlogged in heavy rain, but shifts the problem elsewhere.

This exact kind of works caused a big bogflow in Leitrim earlier in the year
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02-09-2020, 17:08   #33
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Radar estimates say between 80-130mm fell locally in 12 hours.

https://twitter.com/ScottDuncanWX/st...337800193?s=20
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02-09-2020, 17:28   #34
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Met Eireann dropped the ball on this one. Mind you it doesn't look like IWC did much better.
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02-09-2020, 18:08   #35
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Met Eireann dropped the ball on this one. Mind you it doesn't look like IWC did much better.
Met Éireann did forecast heavy rain, leading to some spot flooding. The Clifden event was due to a combination of runoff of orographic enhancement of rain rates and land usage issues. Surrounding areas didnt have any problem. Nearby Mace Head had only 25 mm overnight.

As for IWC, he won't be happy about missing that one given that he recently claimed that he is more qualified in Meteorology than anyone in Met Éireann. I shít you not.
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02-09-2020, 18:31   #36
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Connemara is amazing after nights of heavy rain. The mountain streams come alive and you can drive through the valleys and marvel at the numerous waterfalls.
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02-09-2020, 19:04   #37
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Not a mention of the rain that hit Clifden on the forecast just said warnings still in place forgot to mention Connacht only got the warning at 9am today, now if this had hit Dublin
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02-09-2020, 20:55   #38
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If you ever walk through these modern plantations of forest's you'll notice that the ground is hard and doesn't absorb anything, there's no undergrowth or different canopy's, shrubs and fern's etc they soak up the moisture and the rain is distributed naturally.

Just your mundane evergreens and that's typical of the mentality of the greed going on in this county, ah sure lads plant away,we'll see the fruit of our success in the future...
Green shoots and all that stuff.

Mess around with nature and you'll see how it bites back.

There's a lot of these forest's in Clare too and the run off is poisonous to river's and lakes.
But dare you suggest that and you'll have the pitch forks out.

There's no such thing as a risk assessment or how these artificial woods will impact the environment or whatever is in its path.
A Horticulture student from the 80's and 90's would know about Risk assessment and how topography works.

Whatever they're teaching now in forestry course's and horticulture definitely isn't as practical as it was.

No doubt this is going to create a lot of finger wagging in Clifden.
A canopy forest layer is there for a reason...

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02-09-2020, 21:12   #39
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It is a bit odd how Galway was left out of the warning, ARPEGE model forecast was pretty good for it:

https://twitter.com/carlowweather/st...275694592?s=21
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02-09-2020, 21:44   #40
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More rain fell here in this eastern part of Galway (which wasn't that much compared to Connemara) in the last 24 hours than from 'Emma'. We got a yellow rainfall warning for Emma, but none for today's event, except when it was already in full swing.

I'm not blaming Met Eireann for this as the models right up to this were all over the place, but once again it shows that these county specific warnings are useless and for large western counties such as Galway, just too encompassing. The climate of this part of Galway, and even more so as you go further east into the country, has more in common with that of the midlands than the actual west coast, which is always prone to the feeling the full impacts of the Atlantic's tantrums.
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02-09-2020, 21:51   #41
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Rainfall totals since 1am (up to 9pm) on all of the reporting stations on the Met Eireann 'WOW' site:

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02-09-2020, 22:06   #42
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upto 49.4 for sw donegal now
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02-09-2020, 22:16   #43
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there is another depression leaving the coast of North Carolina on its way. Unless there is a serious discussion and funding to dredge the rivers which not ideal is the least intrusive method for offering some cushion to water outflows. tree plantations etc are not going to revert to pre planted state anytime soon. Also consider the underlying damage of fast flowing rivers on embankments and structures.
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02-09-2020, 22:18   #44
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The forestry plantations will have reduced the floodwater peak from what it would have been otherwise - the root systems slow down the runoff. Now, if there was a large swathe of recently felled forestry, that would revert the behaviour to pre-forestry runoff speeds.

Bogs can take in a lot of water for sure, but only up to a certain rate. Above that rainfall rate the extra runs straight off. Source? I've a mate who is a forestry manager, and I've also observed this behaviour after 25 years of watching floodwater levels on Irish streams with my kayaking background.

I would suspect that if it were not for the forestry work, there would have been a mudflow/bogflow situation with the peat mobilising similar to that at the Dawn of Hope Bridge in Sligo and that would have been significantly worse for the Clifden residents.
The peat in the Sligo case had been damaged already by forestry and windfarm works. Spruce forests are shallow rooted and prone to windthrow on blanket bog so provide little in the way of stability. Also they kill all the ground vegetation which makes the area even more vulnerable to such events
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02-09-2020, 22:24   #45
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there is another depression leaving the coast of North Carolina on its way. Unless there is a serious discussion and funding to dredge the rivers which not ideal is the least intrusive method for offering some cushion to water outflows. tree plantations etc are not going to revert to pre planted state anytime soon. Also consider the underlying damage of fast flowing rivers on embankments and structures.
Failed spectacularly in Bantry only a few weeks ago - we need a proper catchment approach including restoration of natural wetlands. The reasons Naas and Clondalkin do not flood anymore is thanx to the intallation of Reed beds and spillover ponds in upstream parks. Sadly the OPW appears to prefer wasting vast amounts of tax payers money on costly and destructive "hard" solutions that damage fisheries etc.
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