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Defence - text from the tri-partite draft Programme for Government June 2020

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Comments

  • #32
    Maoltuile
    Registered Users Posts: 634 ✭✭✭Maoltuile


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    • Ensure that all enlisted members of the Defence Forces have the same access to healthcare as officers do currently.

    This is long, long overdue. I was in Blackrock Clinic for something a couple of years ago (covered by VHI) and turned around to see the then-current COS behind me in line. He was just waved straight hrough - no forms for him - as being on the DF officer scheme.


  • #33
    NewSigGuy
    Registered Users Posts: 179 ✭✭NewSigGuy


    Maoltuile wrote: »
    This is long, long overdue. I was in Blackrock Clinic for something a couple of years ago (covered by VHI) and turned around to see the then-current COS behind me in line. He was just waved straight hrough - no forms for him - as being on the DF officer scheme.

    Did you ever consider that maybe he just had an appointment.

    I've never heard of the DF officer scheme, can you enlighten us..


  • #34
    Maoltuile
    Registered Users Posts: 634 ✭✭✭Maoltuile


    NewSigGuy wrote: »
    Did you ever consider that maybe he just had an appointment.

    I've never heard of the DF officer scheme, can you enlighten us..

    Nope, he just identified himself as DF and bypassed the queue.


  • #35
    NewSigGuy
    Registered Users Posts: 179 ✭✭NewSigGuy


    Maoltuile wrote: »
    Nope, he just identified himself as DF and bypassed the queue.

    Wow that's incredible.. I served 12 years as a DF Officer and they never told me about this scheme. I could have skipped so many queues and saved a fortune on VHI.


  • #36
    Maoltuile
    Registered Users Posts: 634 ✭✭✭Maoltuile


    NewSigGuy wrote: »
    Wow that's incredible.. I served 12 years as a DF Officer and they never told me about this scheme. I could have skipped so many queues and saved a fortune on VHI.

    Someone must not have liked you very much, then. Because:

    'Changes to health insurance rules introduced last week put pressure on more than 1,000 officers serving in the Defence Forces to take out private health insurance even though they already have full medical cover as part of their terms of employment.'

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/army-officers-insured-on-the-double-to-avoid-health-levies-1.2198558

    This was 2015. The COS I'm referring to was recently gone by that stage, so had been on it.


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  • #37
    NewSigGuy
    Registered Users Posts: 179 ✭✭NewSigGuy


    Maoltuile wrote: »
    Someone must not have liked you very much, then. Because:
    'Changes to health insurance rules introduced last week put pressure on more than 1,000 officers serving in the Defence Forces to take out private health insurance even though they already have full medical cover as part of their terms of employment.'https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/army-officers-insured-on-the-double-to-avoid-health-levies-1.2198558
    This was 2015. The COS I'm referring to was recently gone by that stage, so had been on it.

    I am sorry you are reading too much into that report. There was never and is not now a DF officers scheme, DF officers have the same basic health cover as any Member of the DF and would use the public health system for anything beyond routine health checks etc..

    Most Officers I knew had VHI and that was in the 90's..

    I know there is a common theme in these forums that Officers somehow live a privileged life and have batmen etc.. Let me assure you that this is not the case.


  • #38
    davetherave
    Registered Users Posts: 3,359 ✭✭✭davetherave


    Defence Forces Medical Services - https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/question/2018-04-25/77/

    The majority of secondary health care for members of the Defence Forces is provided through the public/private health system. There is no charge to members of the Defence Forces for attendance at a public hospital AandE or a stay in a public hospital. Additionally, Commissioned Officers can be referred for out-patient and in-patient treatment through private/semi-private care in civilian hospitals or private consultants’ rooms, where it is deemed necessary by the Defence Forces Medical Officer or the attending doctor subject to financial sanction. There is no cost to the officer for the private/semi private treatment as this forms part of the terms and conditions of their employment in the Defence Forces.

    https://www.hia.ie/sites/default/files/03.03.2017%20Dept.%20of%20Defense%20LCR%20Submission%20.pdf

    1. Medical Services provided to Commissioned Officers of the Defence Forces.

    Defence Forces healthcare, includes, inter alia, an annual occupational medical, primary medical care treatment and the provision of medication prescribed by a doctor, physiotherapy, routine dental treatment and some limited in-house secondary care.

    Additionally. Commissioned Officers can be referred for out-patient and in-patient treatment through private semi-private care in civilian hospitals or private consultants rooms, where it is deemed necessary. Enlisted personnel, in exceptional circumstances may also be referred.

    There is no cost to the officer for the private/semi private treatment. This is provided as part of the terms and conditions of employment in the Defence Forces. Indeed it is noteworthy that the perceived benefits ensuing. relative to employees generally, have already been examined and factored into account by the Gleeson Commission of 1990, when it considered the total remuneration package and non pay elements pertaining to military personnel.


  • #39
    NewSigGuy
    Registered Users Posts: 179 ✭✭NewSigGuy


    davetherave wrote: »
    Defence Forces Medical Services - https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/question/2018-04-25/77/

    The majority of secondary health care for members of the Defence Forces is provided through the public/private health system. There is no charge to members of the Defence Forces for attendance at a public hospital AandE or a stay in a public hospital. Additionally, Commissioned Officers can be referred for out-patient and in-patient treatment through private/semi-private care in civilian hospitals or private consultants’ rooms, where it is deemed necessary by the Defence Forces Medical Officer or the attending doctor subject to financial sanction. There is no cost to the officer for the private/semi private treatment as this forms part of the terms and conditions of their employment in the Defence Forces.

    https://www.hia.ie/sites/default/files/03.03.2017%20Dept.%20of%20Defense%20LCR%20Submission%20.pdf

    1. Medical Services provided to Commissioned Officers of the Defence Forces.

    Defence Forces healthcare, includes, inter alia, an annual occupational medical, primary medical care treatment and the provision of medication prescribed by a doctor, physiotherapy, routine dental treatment and some limited in-house secondary care.

    Additionally. Commissioned Officers can be referred for out-patient and in-patient treatment through private semi-private care in civilian hospitals or private consultants rooms, where it is deemed necessary. Enlisted personnel, in exceptional circumstances may also be referred.

    There is no cost to the officer for the private/semi private treatment. This is provided as part of the terms and conditions of employment in the Defence Forces. Indeed it is noteworthy that the perceived benefits ensuing. relative to employees generally, have already been examined and factored into account by the Gleeson Commission of 1990, when it considered the total remuneration package and non pay elements pertaining to military personnel.

    Fair play, the actual wording, it does mention "Can be referred" and not "shall" so no guarantee, and also subject to financial sanction, quite a few caveats. Clearly it is not as good as any of the regular private health insurance schemes.

    It also says it may also be for any member of the DF.

    DF officers would not be skipping queues and would not have any better coverage then even the most basic VHI, hence many have there own private health insurance.

    There is also mention in the Cadet and Direct entry FAQ type info, that this coverage may be subject to Benefit in Kind..


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