Will Britain piss off and get on with Brexit II (mod warning in OP)

RobMc59 · 26-01-2020 9:37pm

Imreoir2 wrote: »

In what sence is that leverage? Can the UK credibly suggest that in the absence of a favourable trade deal from the US they will distance themselves from the US alliance or slash their defence spending? I don't think they can. As such, those are benefits the US can safely pocket and effectivly ignore in trade talks.

I`m not saying that gives the UK leverage,what I`m saying is the UK is probably America`s closest friend and ally which I imagine would count for something(plus Trump does`nt seem to like the EU)-I personally think Trump is a loose cannon and would prefer to remain close to Europe in all matters.

Irishmale0399 · 26-01-2020 9:43pm

Some amount of tripe coming out in here about anti English agenda...

Anyway as a person who employs approx. 85 educated British workers here in Germany I can report the following;

Over 60 have applied for and received German passports, 4 are in the process of getting Dutch/Belgium passports based on heritage having failed to secure German ones, 4 have received Irish passports and the rest are praying that they will get a visa to stay when the time comes based on income and education. One of the remaining lads comes from Northern Ireland, hates everything Irish, claimed the EU never did anything for Northern Ireland or its people, however suprised me last May by handing me a copy of his new residence permit. He applied for and got an Irish passport over his Easter holidays, told me he wanted to have the benifits of the German medical system and so on once Brexit happens.

Well upon talking to many of these lads about the future one thing keeps popping up...they all claim it is either the extemely wealthy or lower class who want and pushed for Brexit. The wealthy as they are against EU banking regulations and the lower class because they believe the spin in the papers, better houses, improved NHS, more jobs...... Time will tell if Boris can make Britain great however I do not believe he will. I personally see him or a future Prime Minister coming back to Brussels within 10-15 years to ask to re-enter the EU....the grass is not always greener and all that.

Padre_Pio · 26-01-2020 9:46pm

As always, none of the pro-Brexit posters here, Crypto, Kidchameoleon and one or two others, have ever posted any link, study or evidence to show that Brexit will benefit the UK.

26-01-2020 9:49pm

RobMc59 wrote: »

I`m not saying that gives the UK leverage,what I`m saying is the UK is probably America`s closest friend and ally which I imagine would count for something(plus Trump does`nt seem to like the EU)-I personally think Trump is a loose cannon and would prefer to remain close to Europe in all matters.

There was a recent article posted on the thread of the tariffs that the U.S. are currently stating that they will apply against the U.K. if they won't do what trump wants and it shows the special relationship for what it's worth.

fly_agaric · 26-01-2020 9:55pm

RobMc59 wrote: »

The one thing the UK does have with the US over others is they are their closest ally.Trump for some reason seems to think Europe relies too much on the US defending them and won`t pay their way in regards to defence which is`nt the case with the UK.

It's an odd situation. A normal US administration would be I think at this stage be furious with the UK (ally it relied on to put its position inside the EU has left & UK relations with other member states have been damaged).

It would have been pressing them not to go for a really "hard" Brexit over the last few years. This US administration goes against 80 odd years of US foreign policy & is inimical to the EU and works to undermine it. It regularly praises the UK for Brexit; harder the better.

So possibility is there for a major agreement, esp. if Trump is reelected. However this US administration is very incompetent & also seems unable to do anything except bully others to get its way. They may make the price of the agreement too high politically for the UK to bear. Can see this already with the very public threats being made over allowing Huawei to upgrade telecoms infrastructure and the UKs plans for taxing US MNCs. Is that going to be the pattern every time the UK does something Trump disapproves of? It'll put Boris Johnson (+ the UK) in a very difficult position I think.

Timberrrrrrrr · 26-01-2020 10:25pm

Boredstiff666 wrote: »

Maybe they can't for many reasons. If everybody could just up sticks on a whim they would be great but not good for Ireland as the last time they did there was plenty of Polish here to do jobs.

Everybody is entitled to give out about any government . The fact that there were two clowns doing it really makes no difference as long as they cant do same again.

Of course if you are trying to start a Brits out argument then thats ok it is an Irish country.

Crypto is apparently a "millionaire " with many properties scattered around the UK/Ireland

cryptocurrency · 26-01-2020 11:04pm

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Crypto is apparently a "millionaire " with many properties scattered around the UK/Ireland

You do realise that just owning outright a three bed terraced house will make you a "millionaire"

https://www.daft.ie/dublin/houses-for-sale/ranelagh/41-ashfield-road-ranelagh-dublin-2080702/

It's not a difficult thing to be.

blinding · 27-01-2020 1:42am

Imreoir2 wrote: »

And yet you fail to understand that this dynamic is also at play between the EU which has a population of 450 million and little Britain with its population of only 67 million.

The UK is welcome to leave, it should have been gone nearly a year ago but kept asking to be allowed stay a little longer while they sorted out their political crisis.

The EU is bored with the UK's political drama at this stage, the omnishambles used to be somewhat entertaining but the novelty has worn off. The UK will slowly be roasted in trade talks by the EU over the next few years but this will be of interest only to a few politicos and technocrats on the EU side. The people of the EU are already largely ignoring the foggy little island that used to be a member of the club but which now has little relevance to their lives.

But the Brits have Democratically decided to leave the ‘ Club “ and that is their right as a Nation State and a Sovereign Independent Country.

Why are Irish people whinging about the Democratic actions of a Sovereign Independent Country especially when the vast vast majority of that Country do not give two jots what you think of it !

blinding · 27-01-2020 1:45am

RobMc59 wrote: »

The one thing the UK does have with the US over others is they are their closest ally.Trump for some reason seems to think Europe relies too much on the US defending them and won`t pay their way in regards to defence which is`nt the case with the UK.

Thats because many European and Eu countries have not being paying their way . They have been free loading on the US.

KildareP · 27-01-2020 6:40am

cryptocurrency wrote: »

You do realise that just owning outright a three bed terraced house will make you a "millionaire"

https://www.daft.ie/dublin/houses-for-sale/ranelagh/41-ashfield-road-ranelagh-dublin-2080702/

It's not a difficult thing to be.

Crypto - EU army - joke or genuine danger?

KildareP · 27-01-2020 6:42am

blinding wrote: »

Why are Irish people whinging about the Democratic actions of a Sovereign Independent Country especially when the vast vast majority of that Country do not give two jots what you think of it !

Why do you keep bringing it up then at every possible opportunity?

cryptocurrency · 27-01-2020 7:11am

KildareP wrote: »

Crypto - EU army - joke or genuine danger?

Currently the EU army is a joke and i can't see how it will ever be allowed to become anything else even if by some miricle they tried to make it less of a joke.

EU threatens the UK according to you guys and will not allow them compete on their doorstep. Well the US/UK will not allow a military rival appear on their NATO door step. Their will only be one winner....don't back the tin pot EU at anything.

This army talk will be their downfall, they will be made stay in the pocket.

KildareP · 27-01-2020 7:12am

cryptocurrency wrote: »

Currently the EU army is a joke and i can't see how it will ever be allowed to become anything else even if by some miricle they tried to make it less of a joke

Edit (typo)
So what has changed since you said it was a danger in 2018 but not anymore?

cryptocurrency · 27-01-2020 7:15am

KildareP wrote: »

So what has changed since you said it was a danger in 2008 but not anymore?

2008?

It was never more then a dangerous idea.

KildareP · 27-01-2020 7:19am

cryptocurrency wrote: »

2008?

It was never more then a dangerous idea.

Typo - 2018

Well it’s either a danger or a joke that will never materialise - which is it?

According to you it is both which is contradictory.

27-01-2020 8:09am

For a country that's had enough of experts, this new talent visa makes little sense.

cryptocurrency · 27-01-2020 8:19am

Deleted User wrote: »

For a country that's had enough of experts, this new talent visa makes little sense.

Can't be prejudiced against the global talent pool for numbers of plasterers from EU

blinding · 27-01-2020 8:45am

KildareP wrote: »

Why do you keep bringing it up then at every possible opportunity?

Because it is at the cusp of the matter.

First Up · 27-01-2020 9:50am

blinding wrote:

Because it is at the cusp of the matter.

No it isn't. The UK has left; bye bye and don't forget your hat.

The cusp of the matter now is how the UK performs (as a sovereign independent country) without free or preferential terms of trade with anyone and having excluded itself from the hundreds of international collaborations it enjoyed as an EU member.

Ireland has an extra interest because for geographic and historical reasons we are more exposed to collateral damage than others. That entitles us to a view and also entitles us to work with EU partners for our mutual benefit, which we are doing

The UK can go fish (in its sovereign independent territorial waters )

Winning_Stroke · 27-01-2020 9:55am

Padre_Pio wrote: »

As always, none of the pro-Brexit posters here, Crypto, Kidchameoleon and one or two others, have ever posted any link, study or evidence to show that Brexit will benefit the UK.

It's not like it's a scientific experiment. Sure you could go looking for "studies" done by partisan hacks with dubious results (see SNP's plans for their independent economy in 2014 dependent on oil revenues, which were off by 99% in real life). You'll get to see the results in the coming decade, we all will. The argument is well and truly over, it's happening.

Winning_Stroke · 27-01-2020 9:59am

Deleted User wrote: »

For a country that's had enough of experts, this new talent visa makes little sense.

How come people still peddle that partial quote. It's classic fake news tactic, I guess Donald taught you all something.

Gove: I think the people in this country have had enough of experts, with organizations from acronyms, saying—
Interviewer: They've had enough of experts? The people have had enough of experts? What do you mean by that?
Gove: People from organizations with acronyms saying that they know what is best and getting it consistently wrong.

I've had enough with experts who get stuff wrong and peddle agendas. Remember all those acronym snakes who abounded Prime Time during the boom? But I guess Gove is a Bad Man, therfore twisting words is ok for the Greater Good of the EU.

KildareP · 27-01-2020 10:28am

blinding wrote: »

Because it is at the cusp of the matter.

It really isn't! Your average Irish Joe doesn't give a hoot what the UK is doing.

Sure, there are concerns around trade, competition and our shared landmass via Northern Ireland - but a lot of that concern is that the UK hasn't a clue what it actually proposes to do when it's "left" this week: what the UK proposes to do in the first 30 days, the first quarter, the first year, the next decade.

You are at pains to make out Ireland and the EU and it's entire populace are spending every waking minute worrying about an EU sans UK. They really aren't as bothered as you'd like to think. About as bothered, probably, as you state the UK are about Ireland and the EU.

We're tired of hearing about it's the democractic vote of the people.
Yes - we got that memo the first thousand times.
Get on with it!

ancapailldorcha · 27-01-2020 10:59am

Boredstiff666 wrote: »

You and others have been telling us how powerless and wrong and all the other things they have been for almost 4 years now.

I think you may have been wrong on most if not all of them so far. Keep it up.

You going to unroll the flag next week at Dover?

I've been right. Johnson was so desperate for a deal that he agreed to the EU's original proposal which means effectively carving up the UK.

trashcan · 27-01-2020 11:09am

blinding wrote: »

2015 to 2019 and they kicked the Eu out. They sure had plenty of time to think it through and it still ended in kicking the Eu out. Bye Bye Eu.

No, it’s bye bye UK. And good riddance tbh. Your statement reminds me of that old newspaper headline “Heavy Fog on the channel - Continent cut off.”

Leroy42 · 27-01-2020 11:36am

But still no plan.

Divergence, equivalence, stick to current regulations, increase above current regulations.

No more low level immigration, only immigration above certain wage level, exemptions for particular industries.

Increase democracy, place losing candidates in cabinet and HoL.

Trade deal with EU, no US, no Japan, no all three, no we don't want a trade deal and will happily leave on WTO.

So a trade deal with US is great, but no deal with EU is also great.

There is no plan, other than be seen to do something, anything. TM for all her faults actually tried to do what was best for the UK. Johnson and his government only care about what is best for them.

blinding · 27-01-2020 11:43am

trashcan wrote: »

No, it’s bye bye UK. And good riddance tbh. Your statement reminds me of that old newspaper headline “Heavy Fog on the channel - Continent cut off.”

The Democratic Decision of the UK to leave the Eu has been respected.

Without Democracy we are nothing. I for one am delighted / relieved that Democracy in this European Country has been saved . Long live Democracy.

Winning_Stroke · 27-01-2020 11:54am

Moving on from their hilarious obsession with passport colour, Remainers (actually that term will be defunct in a few days...) are creating much hilarity with their over the top RAGE about a coin

https://twitter.com/Andrew_Adonis/status/1221408246650621952

Best reply by far

If you give them all to me I'll give you 20p back and tell you what to spend it on. That way you'll feel like we never left Andy!

RasTa · 27-01-2020 11:57am

Going to be a long couple of years saying yes to the yanks

Britain’s sovereignty will be in jeopardy if the UK allows Huawei to develop its 5G infrastructure, the US secretary of state has warned.

In a last-minute plea to senior ministers, who are expected to decide on Tuesday whether to use the Chinese company, Mike Pompeo described the decision facing Britain’s national security council as “momentous”.

Boredstiff666 · 27-01-2020 1:09pm

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I've been right. Johnson was so desperate for a deal that he agreed to the EU's original proposal which means effectively carving up the UK.

Actually old Boris can do nothing but impliment what you lot call hard Brexit proposals because anything less would mean a swift collapse in faith and the sure end of the Torys within 6 months from the UK people.

So what ever has been said before will change as from Feb 1st otherwise he is gone.

27-01-2020 2:46pm

It'll be some craic if the UK back down and don't use Huawei.

Will Britain piss off and get on with Brexit II (mod warning in OP)

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