Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

UFC 258

2

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,229 ✭✭✭Chairman Meow


    Beersmith wrote: »
    Those "8k" camera shots were horrible! Can't believe anyone thinks they look good.

    I knew id see complaints about this today lmao. It was ****ing horrible alright. Depth of field looks great in photographs, or for close up conversations, but for the in-ring shots it just looked bloody awful. Made it look like the background was a bad green screen.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,370 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    eagle eye wrote: »
    So if he wants it then go face the man who has shown more than he has.

    Ok. Since you are implying that they are a similar size then there's no reason why they couldn't fight at 155lb then is there? Except we all know that Usman would have to chop off a limb to make 155lb. He's already killing himself to make the 170lb limit.

    It's not just the skills inside the ring that dictate great champions. It's also less exciting, but vitally important things like weight cutting and staying injury free outside of fights. Every fighter does a calculation as to how low a weight they can fight without it adversely affecting their abilities. For Khabib the magic number is 155lb. For Usman it's 170lb.

    Khabib laid claim to the P4P crown, not the 170lb crown.

    It is telling that you are happy to declare Usman the P4P king without demanding that he in turn challenge Adesanya at Middleweight. After all, Usman is a similar size to a lot of middleweights. Why do you have one rule for Khabib and another for Usman?


  • Registered Users Posts: 37,329 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    It is telling that you are happy to declare Usman the P4P king without demanding that he in turn challenge Adesanya at Middleweight. After all, Usman is a similar size to a lot of middleweights. Why do you have one rule for Khabib and another for Usman?
    Adesanya is moving to light heavy, were you not aware of that?


  • Registered Users Posts: 38,923 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    eagle eye wrote: »
    The reason I said he should go take on Usman is because it's well.kniwn that Khabib walks around at 190 when not in camp.

    Khabib cuts from around at 180. If he occasional hit 190, it's rare and down to being a bit fatter.

    Usman cuts from 190+. He stays in shape, if he gets fat he'd be 200+.

    There is 10 pounds difference at least between them. They are a weight division apart.


  • Registered Users Posts: 37,329 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Mellor wrote:
    There is 10 pounds difference at least between them. They are a weight division apart.

    I find that hard to believe, I haven't heard much about Usman ever struggling to hit his weight at least in recent years. Khabib has missed a fight from getting ill over it and had a real dodgy weigh in for his last fight.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 38,923 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    eagle eye wrote: »
    I find that hard to believe, I haven't heard much about Usman ever struggling to hit his weight at least in recent years. Khabib has missed a fight from getting ill over it and had a real dodgy weight in for his last fight.
    When did I suggest he struggled?
    20 lbs is a fairly normal cut for a welterweight.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,370 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    eagle eye wrote: »
    Adesanya is moving to light heavy, were you not aware of that?

    I was. He's still the middleweight champion and you didn't answer the question. Why are you requesting that Khabib fight a champion at a higher weight category before he can lay claim to the best P4P fighter but you don't apply that same standard to Usman?


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,453 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    I think Usman has already beat better names than Khabib ,
    Also Khabib is not 29 -0 some of his fights where scheduled for just 2 rounds that does not fall under unified rules
    For example Usman's tuf fights are not counted on his recorded so cant see how 2 rounders are on Khabib's

    But I honestly don't think you get even in the GOAT conversation without doing it in two weight classes ,Its literally shows you are p4p the best,


    The only person I would give a pass on that is Jones and that's because going from 205 to 265 is such a massive difference ,but he is giving it a go anyway


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,131 ✭✭✭akelly02


    I think Usman has already beat better names than Khabib ,
    Also Khabib is not 29 -0 some of his fights where scheduled for just 2 rounds that does not fall under unified rules


    For example Usman's tuf fights are not counted on his recorded so cant see how 2 rounders are on Khabib's

    But I honestly don't think you get even in the GOAT conversation without doing it in two weight classes ,Its literally shows you are p4p the best,


    The only person I would give a pass on that is Jones and that's because going from 205 to 265 is such a massive difference ,but he is giving it a go anyway




    i wouldnt be giving jones any passes because he is a cheating kernt.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,453 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    akelly02 wrote: »
    i wouldnt be giving jones any passes because he is a cheating kernt.

    Oh he is but I'm of the opinion he is not the only one ,

    Izzy's looks like he to me has a manboob , Usman's looks like to me he has ghg gut (didn't Colby say EPO) & so on ,

    Again I'm not accusing anyone just my uneducated opinion ,


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 19,145 ✭✭✭✭MrStuffins


    Remember when the MMA Forum had conversations of an objective nature?

    Nowadays there's way too much sh*te from people trying to shoehorn in their biased views on certain fighters.

    Not only did UFC 258 feature a Welterweight title fight, but it didn't feature a single Lightweight. Not one.

    It still somehow becomes about Khabib. How the f*ck is this about Khabib?

    Back to the topic:

    Fair play to Usman, he's a class fighter and is currently the best WW in the world. But he has a long way to go before he's spoken about in the same breath as GSP, or even Matt Hughes in my opinion.

    The WW division has become kinda stale. There aren't too many matches featuring Usman that will float the boat of the casual. Masvidal being the only one really but that's only because Jorge has some shine at the minute.

    I fight 'd personally like to see is Usman v Chiesa eventually


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 776 ✭✭✭Fall_Guy


    akelly02 wrote: »
    i wouldnt be giving jones any passes because he is a cheating kernt.

    Maybe. He's definitely a stupid "kernt", but I always think it strange people believe that Jones would not have beaten all Comers without possible doping when I normally look at his career and think how much more dominant he would have been over his opposition if he was training regularly between fights and staying away from drug-fuelled benders while in camp.

    If he was using steroids intentionally, I doubt he was ever maximising his potential in a way that would allow him to really take advantage of whatever marginal gains were to be extracted from their usage.

    P4P GOAT for me.

    Usman has the potential to enter that conversation in time too and appears to have that champions mindset that all the other contenders had too (Jones, GSP, Anderson, Khabib IMO) and Khabibs last few wins definitely move him into contention with Jones but it seems he's done and Jones has the chance to cement his claim with a successful heavyweight run.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,453 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    MrStuffins wrote: »
    Remember when the MMA Forum had conversations of an objective nature?

    Nowadays there's way too much sh*te from people trying to shoehorn in their biased views on certain fighters.

    Not only did UFC 258 feature a Welterweight title fight, but it didn't feature a single Lightweight. Not one.

    It still somehow becomes about Khabib. How the f*ck is this about Khabib?

    Back to the topic:

    Fair play to Usman, he's a class fighter and is currently the best WW in the world. But he has a long way to go before he's spoken about in the same breath as GSP, or even Matt Hughes in my opinion.

    The WW division has become kinda stale. There aren't too many matches featuring Usman that will float the boat of the casual. Masvidal being the only one really but that's only because Jorge has some shine at the minute.

    I fight 'd personally like to see is Usman v Chiesa eventually

    Its stale because Usman has beat all the top guys ,

    Id love to see him fight Wonder boy , its just a different style of fight from anything we have seen Usman in

    I think Usman is to strong for Chiesa

    Masvidal doesn't have a hope , just a waste of time if you ask me ,


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,707 ✭✭✭✭Hello 2D Person Below


    Usman has a far superior resumé to Khabib.


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,145 ✭✭✭✭MrStuffins


    Its stale because Usman has beat all the top guys ,

    Id love to see him fight Wonder boy , its just a different style of fight from anything we have seen Usman in

    I think Usman is to strong for Chiesa

    Masvidal doesn't have a hope , just a waste of time if you ask me ,

    True. He's by far the top WW at the moment and i'm not too sure there are too many threats behind him in the division.

    I think there's also a gap between Colby @ #2 and the rest of the division..... and Kamaru put an absolute beating on Colby!

    I also agree about Chiesa. But there's something about the guy having been paying his dues for so long that makes me want to see him get a crack at the belt.


  • Registered Users Posts: 37,329 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    MrStuffins wrote:
    It still somehow becomes about Khabib. How the f*ck is this about Khabib?
    Well I didn't start it. I just gave my opinion that Usman is the P4P best in the UFC right now, I never mentioned any other fighter.


  • Registered Users Posts: 38,923 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    Usman is one fight off Anderson’s UFC win streak record.
    Although, Jones has more fights “undefeated”


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,271 ✭✭✭✭mdwexford


    Usman has a far superior resumé to Khabib.

    On what planet, bizarre statement.
    MrStuffins wrote: »
    I think there's also a gap between Colby @ #2 and the rest of the division..... and Kamaru put an absolute beating on Colby!

    Usman Colby was dead level going into the last round. Was a very close fight until Usman closed the show.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,453 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    mdwexford wrote: »
    On what planet, bizarre statement.



    Usman Colby was dead level going into the last round. Was a very close fight until Usman closed the show.

    On planet Earth ,

    I have to agree Usman has fought better fighters than Khabib


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,406 ✭✭✭✭The Nal


    Outside of McGregor, Poirier and Gaethje, who has Khabib beaten who would be considered top tier? Could argue Usman has a similar CV so far.

    Thats why greatness needs longevity. Was watching some old Jones fights the other night. He was beating people like Bader, Rua, Machida, Sonnen, Belfort etc 9, 10, 11 years ago! Still unbeaten as champ.

    Usman and Khabib aren't in his league. Maybe in another 9 or 10 title defences time.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 37,329 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    The Nal wrote:
    Outside of McGregor, Poirier and Gaethje, who has Khabib beaten who would be considered top tier? Could argue Usman has a similar CV so far.
    What decent grappler has Khabib beaten?
    Usman has beaten all types.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,453 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    The Nal wrote: »
    Outside of McGregor, Poirier and Gaethje, who has Khabib beaten who would be considered top tier? Could argue Usman has a similar CV so far.

    Thats why greatness needs longevity. Was watching some old Jones fights the other night. He was beating people like Bader, Rua, Machida, Sonnen, Belfort etc 9, 10, 11 years ago! Still unbeaten as champ.

    Usman and Khabib aren't in his league. Maybe in another 9 or 10 title defences time.


    People say the lightweight division is stacked I actually think its the opposite , I think its full of lads that are good but not many stand outs , Henderson, Pettis ,RDA , Alvarez , Conor all champs before Khabib are good but not stellar ,

    I'm always shocked at the lack of high level wrestler's a lightweight ,

    Welter weight in my opinion is a far tougher division ,

    Conor has 1 win at the weight in the UFC and is one of Khabib's best wins says it all really


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,145 ✭✭✭✭MrStuffins


    The Nal wrote: »
    Outside of McGregor, Poirier and Gaethje, who has Khabib beaten who would be considered top tier? Could argue Usman has a similar CV so far.

    Thats why greatness needs longevity. Was watching some old Jones fights the other night. He was beating people like Bader, Rua, Machida, Sonnen, Belfort etc 9, 10, 11 years ago! Still unbeaten as champ.

    Usman and Khabib aren't in his league. Maybe in another 9 or 10 title defences time.

    But that's the thing with biases. I've seen people on this board try to minimise Jones's wins over the very guys you've mentioned. Why? Because they're biased towards someone else who they want to be seen as "The GOAT".

    Usman & Khabib have a long way to go before they can match Jones's record. Pico or no pico!


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,406 ✭✭✭✭The Nal


    eagle eye wrote: »
    What decent grappler has Khabib beaten?

    Poirier is a black belt in BJJ. RDA is too. But yeah, its a short list and hes yet to come up against anyone with pedigree in that category, or anyone decent who is bigger than him.

    Either way the GOAT conversation is ridiculous.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,453 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    The Nal wrote: »
    Poirier is a black belt in BJJ. RDA is too. But yeah, its a short list and hes yet to come up against anyone with pedigree in that category, or anyone decent who is bigger than him.

    Either way the GOAT conversation is ridiculous.

    Being a BJJ blackbelt means F*CK all at that level of fighting ,its like saying Paul McShane is a profession footballer , There are different levels,

    Also its not early 2000's , just because you have belt black does not mean you are a HIGH level grappler just ,

    When I first stepped on a mat there was one in Ireland (Kavanagh) so that was the highest level of anyone in the sport ,now there most be nearly a thousand which means guys on all different levels,

    It' s a great achievement but it doesn't make you an elite grappler in UFC terms ,



    oh look at Khabib has no BJJ rank ,


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,290 ✭✭✭xtal191


    Mad people think Usman has a far superior resume than Khabib, to be honest I think they're very very similar but if I had to say who has the better wins its Khabib but as I said its very close


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,406 ✭✭✭✭The Nal


    Being a BJJ blackbelt means F*CK all at that level of fighting ,its like saying Paul McShane is a profession footballer , There are different levels,

    Also its not early 2000's , just because you have belt black does not mean you are a HIGH level grappler just ,

    When I first stepped on a mat there was one in Ireland (Kavanagh) so that was the highest level of anyone in the sport ,now there most be nearly a thousand which means guys on all different levels,

    It' s a great achievement but it doesn't make you an elite grappler in UFC terms ,



    oh look at Khabib has no BJJ rank ,

    Agree of course. Don Anjos is a 4th degree black belt and hes lost a lot. Including to Usman and Khabib. Has never been submitted though. Same for sambo guys like Arlovski. Lost a lot but never/rarely subbed.

    It might not make you an elite grappler in the UFC but it helps! For example can you see McGregor lasting a round against Olivera on the ground?

    For giggles though, remember the apparent threat Gaethje's wrestling was to Khabib because Gaethje wrestled in college?


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,453 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    xtal191 wrote: »
    Mad people think Usman has a far superior resume than Khabib, to be honest I think they're very very similar but if I had to say who has the better wins its Khabib but as I said its very close

    Would you agree Khabib's best wins are Conor, Justin & Dustin ?

    Conor got one win at lightweight,
    Justin is fun to watch but he is not close to elite
    Dustin is by far the best guy Khabib has fought


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,919 ✭✭✭The Floyd p


    I genuinely don't know what Usman's best win is tbh. Jorge is very good but not truly elite, Woodley was always massively overrated and now is just a shell, Covington is quite well rounded but very hittable. I don't think Usman has a win as impressive as Khabib's over Poirier, or even Gaethje/McGregor.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 6,290 ✭✭✭xtal191


    Would you agree Khabib's best wins are Conor, Justin & Dustin ?

    Conor got one win at lightweight,
    Justin is fun to watch but he is not close to elite
    Dustin is by far the best guy Khabib has fought

    100% I think there his best wins. Gethje was coming off 4 wins and Dustin was coming off 4 very impressive wins.

    Usmans best win was Colby which was very close, after that I'd prob say Woodley. Masvidals not elite, Dos Anjos was coming off a loss, Maia off two losses.

    I've no problem if someone thinks Usman has a slightly better resume, there's an argument for both of them but to say either is far superior is ridiculous.


Advertisement