HAP

Dav010 wrote: »

Just tell them straight out, they can’t refuse you because you are receiving HAP.

I would say wait until they get offered the place in writing. They can't admit to making their decision based on hap but they probably will.

HAP landlord here -
I’d tell them, they may already be a HAP LL.

the biggest issue most LLs have with HAP is the knowledge gap of what it actually entails - it’s quite a long and VERY probing process (3.5 months in my case from application stamped received by council to having rent in my account - April 10th - Jul 28th). That wasn’t unduly slow either, it’s taking 8+ weeks to process claims, and then they missed the June payment run and had to wait to next month.

The risk the LL has is that if you stop paying the council, the council immediately cut the landlord payments loose.

People refusing HAP aren’t necessarily all discriminating against you either - there’s a large list of banking, tax and LTP proofs required - so if someone isn’t fully (and I mean FULLY) legit, they can’t touch HAP even if they wanted to.

I’ve taking it in the past. On the basis that the standard terms of the lease are adhered too and that is the rent is paid on the first for the coming month. So they have to pay it till Hap kicks in.

Dav010 wrote: »

The chances of that happening are remote. The LL cannot legally refuse HAP, but there can be issues with compliance, for instance the condition of the property and whether it meets the required standards, and whether the LL can provide a tax clearance certificate. Also, remember, HAP is paid in arrears so you will have to continue paying full rent until the payment starts being lodged on the LLs account.

Thank you for your answer.
This reassured me on one side, but quite worried me on the other.
Where I live now is temporary. A friend of mine is renting me her holiday cottage while looking for a long term accommodation.
At some stage I had to increase my budget in order to find something more suitable and decent. I was previously advised by Hap that landlords might refuse the scheme at first stage, so it's better to pay the deposit and the first month's rent. Once I'm in the house, they cannot refuse Hap.
Having increased my budget, I can afford to pay the deposit and the first month, but I cannot keep paying the same amount for other months.
I have called Hap office now and they told me that once the forms have been signed, I don't have to worry about it. Landlords will receive the money in arrears, but they'll get paid. I don't have to pay other full rents.

Shinsen wrote: »

Thank you for your answer.
This reassured me on one side, but quite worried me on the other.
Where I live now is temporary. A friend of mine is renting me her holiday cottage while looking for a long term accommodation.
At some stage I had to increase my budget in order to find something more suitable and decent. I was previously advised by Hap that landlords might refuse the scheme at first stage, so it's better to pay the deposit and the first month's rent. Once I'm in the house, they cannot refuse Hap.
Having increased my budget, I can afford to pay the deposit and the first month, but I cannot keep paying the same amount for other months.
I have called Hap office now and they told me that once the forms have been signed, I don't have to worry about it. Landlords will receive the money in arrears, but they'll get paid. I don't have to pay other full rents.

One thing to be aware of, your tenancy agreement will state rent is paid in advance, the HAP office can tell you what they want, if the rent is to be paid in advance on your lease, that is what will have to be done, otherwise you would be in arrears and the LL can legally issue you with a notice. Some LA will pay in advance apparently, but you will have to confirm this.

Dav010 wrote: »

One thing to be aware of, your tenancy agreement will state rent is paid in advance, the HAP office can tell you what they want, if the rent is to be paid in advance on your lease, that is what will have to be done, otherwise you would be in arrears and the LL can legally issue you with a notice. Some LA will pay in advance apparently, but you will have to confirm this.

I'm supposing by the tone of your message that you are a landlord?

Shinsen wrote: »

Actual words from the man in the Hap office "I wouldn't worry about it".
Why would staff working in the Hap "can say all the want to say"? They work in a public office. I suppose (and I want to trust!) that the information that they give is correct.

All rental agreements are paid rent month in advance. Be sure to tell the landlord “not to worry about it” when he/she doesn’t receive it in advance. If paid in arrears, you will have to continue to pay until all paperwork is sorted out and first HAP payment comes through, this will then be taken by the LL as the rent for the following month.

The LA cannot change the terms of your tenancy agreement by telling you not “to worry about it”. If the tenancy says month in advance, that is what it will be. Remember, the HAP agreement is between you and the Local Authority, not the LA and the LL, so you have to abide by the tenancy agreement.

It doesn’t matter if I’m a LL, you need to know this. The LL cannot legally refuse HAP, but you need to be aware of your obligations under your tenancy agreement.

Dav010 wrote: »

All rental agreements are paid rent month in advance. Be sure to tell the landlord “not to worry about it” when he/she doesn’t receive it in advance. If paid in arrears, you will have to continue to pay until all paperwork is sorted out and first HAP payment comes through, this will then be taken by the LL as the rent for the following month.

The LA cannot change the terms of your tenancy agreement by telling you not “to worry about it”. If the tenancy says month in advance, that is what it will be. Remember, the HAP agreement is between you and the Local Authority, not the LA and the LL, so you have to abide by the tenancy agreement.

It doesn’t matter if I’m a LL, you need to know this. The LL cannot legally refuse HAP, but you need to be aware of your obligations under your tenancy agreement.

OK, no need to be sarcastic.
First of all, I've been trying to learn about the Hap system. Everyday I discover another jigsaw puzzle piece.
Then I just quoted what the man in the office said to me.
Following what you say, all the Hap tenants in Ireland are not in line with the lease contract considering that all the payments are in arrears. Are they?

Dav010 wrote: »

No sarcasm intended, you asked about HAP and what LL can do legally, this is it.

Again, HAP is between you and the LA, the tenant must stay “in line” with their rental agreement, which means the tenant continues to pay rent until the first HAP payment is recieved by the LL, which is then accepted by the LL as the rent for the next month.

Effectively what this means, is that you will need to have the means to pay the rent up until that first HAP payment is made. Considering the LL has to fill the forms, get a tax clearance cert from Revenue and the forms have to be processed by the LA, which from experience can take a couple of weeks, you should provisionally plan to pay rent yourself for 2-3 months. If you do not pay rent in advance the second month, and HAP payment for month one hasn’t come through, you will be in arrears.

I have understood everything you've said in here, although I have a scenario on my mind.
Let's say that I have the Hap forms in my hands (it's not true because they should arrive on the post, but I'll have them by the time I find a place and sign the contract). So I have these forms which I'm not showing to the landlord. I pay the deposit, I pay the first month's rent, I get the keys and enter my new home. On day 2 I ask the landlord to sign the forms.
Based on the information I've got from Hap, if the forms are correct, the payments to the landlord start within 2-3 weeks (on last Wednesday of the month). Depending on the day of the month I give my forms, I could be fine and not having to pay other rents.
But what if the landlord holds over, with the excuse of getting that certificate, sign or send that form or whatever. In this case it is unfair and I have to undergo further rents payments which I shouldn't have.
What would be your advice on this situation?
Thanks.

Shinsen wrote: »

I have understood everything you've said in here, although I have a scenario on my mind.
Let's say that I have the Hap forms in my hands (it's not true because they should arrive on the post, but I'll have them by the time I find a place and sign the contract). So I have these forms which I'm not showing to the landlord. I pay the deposit, I pay the first month's rent, I get the keys and enter my new home. On day 2 I ask the landlord to sign the forms.
Based on the information I've got from Hap, if the forms are correct, the payments to the landlord start within 2-3 weeks (on last Wednesday of the month). Depending on the day of the month I give my forms, I could be fine and not having to pay other rents.
But what if the landlord holds over, with the excuse of getting that certificate, sign or send that form or whatever. In this case it is unfair and I have to undergo further rents payments which I shouldn't have.
What would be your advice on this situation?
Thanks.

if you have paid the first months rent at the start of the month and the landlord receives the payment from HAP at the end of the month then the landlord has been paid twice for the same month. Once by your and once by HAP.

The HAP payment for the first month can be used as the payment for the next month ie the landlord is being paid in advance.

What then happens at the end of your tenancy is that the landlord will receive a payment for the last month of your tenancy which he will give back to you as as the return of your first months rent as same was paid twice.

Immaculata wrote: »

What if your prospective LL doesn't take HAP though? Won't he or she immediately give you notice to leave? Wouldn't you be hypothetically putting yourself in danger of having to find another place in only a few days or a month?

The enormous payout from the WRC would soften the blow. A LL cannot decide not to take HAP, it is discrimination.