Doctor Who Season 10 [ Spoilers ]

Wibbs · 16-07-2017 10:25pm

tritium wrote: »

Im going to separate my feelings towards the beeb and the why they're going this way imho (and the very negative message it sends to a particular demographic)

I hear that.

I dont think the beeb has ever really cherished the Dr Who brand (or at least not since several years before the original incarnation was pulled).

It is a huge money spinner for them T and was even moreso in the earlier New Who. Second only to Top Gear in international sales for a single series, at times higher than their natural world stuff. It is their "big three", Doctor Who, Top Gear and Nature Documentaries. They value it hugely in those terms. I'd reckon they value it even more since the Top Gear debacle. Indeed, many within and without the Beeb complained about how much of the budget it was getting over other projects. The Late AA Gill used to regularly rant about it and I suspect his disdain for the series sprang from that. I don't really need to suspect as he wrote that in plain view and how people he knew within the biz were of the same mind and that he would have given it a fairer shake of critique if it hadn't been sucking so much investment.

Now it has been faltering in direct sales since the middle of Smith's Doc and really looked like a depreciating asset in Capaldi's tenure, but is still a strong moneymaker for the BBC. It's how they handle such a property is the thing and the Beeb can be a bit shortsighted in this. The Top Gear loss an obvious one(Clarkson was a prize arsehole in that, but they could have handled it far better).

tritium · 16-07-2017 11:41pm

Wibbs wrote: »

I hear that.

It is a huge money spinner for them T and was even moreso in the earlier New Who. Second only to Top Gear in international sales for a single series, at times higher than their natural world stuff. It is their "big three", Doctor Who, Top Gear and Nature Documentaries. They value it hugely in those terms. I'd reckon they value it even more since the Top Gear debacle. Indeed, many within and without the Beeb complained about how much of the budget it was getting over other projects. The Late AA Gill used to regularly rant about it and I suspect his disdain for the series sprang from that. I don't really need to suspect as he wrote that in plain view and how people he knew within the biz were of the same mind and that he would have given it a fairer shake of critique if it hadn't been sucking so much investment.

Now it has been faltering in direct sales since the middle of Smith's Doc and really looked like a depreciating asset in Capaldi's tenure, but is still a strong moneymaker for the BBC. It's how they handle such a property is the thing and the Beeb can be a bit shortsighted in this. The Top Gear loss an obvious one(Clarkson was a prize arsehole in that, but they could have handled it far better).

Oh i dont doubt its valuable wibbs, but make no mistake the beeb has for a very long time had some sort of conceptual issue with dr who. Whether it was michael grade doing his damdest to cancel the original show (an awful little twerp of a man who seems to think everyone should like what he did, he also cancelled the tripods), or the current attempts to make it an ideologocal vehicle for certain beeb execs while throwing in the odd 12 month hiatus when it suits and expecring the fans to suck it up.

There is imho a real danger that the latter group will drive fans away and lead to the shows demise. Sadly the gob****e idealogues will likely put it down to some failing or immaturity on the fans part rather than how they ****ed up the goose that laid many golden eggs

pixelburp · 20-07-2017 9:48am

Dr. Who's eternal circling of the drain started approx. 1966 when William Hartnell stepped down; I suspect it will outlast this current controversy in some way shape or form; honestly there's no need to be reaching for conclusions using pejoratives either.

And really, the two hiatuses taken since the relaunch would imply the opposite to me: better for a creative team to take a break from an intensive production than constantly churning out season-after-season of entertainment. TBH, more channels & shows could benefit from a hiatus now & then.

What's the worst that can happen anyway? Cancellation? C'mon people, any other show that might be a viable outcome, but we're talking about arguably the most flexible TV show in pop culture that has run for 50 years by being able to change with the times. More likely worst outcome would be another hiatus, Whittaker stepping down and the Doctor regenerating again. There is no bell here that can't be un-rung.

Doctor DooM · 20-07-2017 10:16am

pixelburp wrote: »

Dr. Who's eternal circling of the drain started approx. 1966 when William Hartnell stepped down; I suspect it will outlast this current controversy in some way shape or form; honestly there's no need to be reaching for conclusions using pejoratives either.

And really, the two hiatuses taken since the relaunch would imply the opposite to me: better for a creative team to take a break from an intensive production than constantly churning out season-after-season of entertainment. TBH, more channels & shows could benefit from a hiatus now & then.

What's the worst that can happen anyway? Cancellation? C'mon people, any other show that might be a viable outcome, but we're talking about arguably the most flexible TV show in pop culture that has run for 50 years by being able to change with the times. More likely worst outcome would be another hiatus, Whittaker stepping down and the Doctor regenerating again. There is no bell here that can't be un-rung.

It's quite interesting that this is the first time in the new Who Run we're seeing Who being "ruined forever". Happens all the time in other franchises, but up to this point Who seems to have been immune (perhaps because of the older fanbase).

I wonder if it's arising now because of the maturity of the new series.

WomanSkirtFan8 · 21-07-2017 2:28pm

Doctor DooM wrote: »

It's quite interesting that this is the first time in the new Who Run we're seeing Who being "ruined forever". Happens all the time in other franchises, but up to this point Who seems to have been immune (perhaps because of the older fanbase).

I wonder if it's arising now because of the maturity of the new series.

Quite possibly. For me personally, I love this choice. TBCH the whole "will never watch DW again", or "DW has been ruined forever" or "not my doctor" is completely utter rubbish. DW has NOT been ruined. It's just evolved into another dimension if you like.

One should applaude the BBC for having the balls to actually do this, not condemn them for doing so.

CramCycle · 21-07-2017 3:20pm

We could all just watch an episode first and see what she is like. Seems an odd thing to do, condemn here without having any knowledge of if she will be good or not.

Eccelston - thought would be good but never enjoyed
Tennant - knew nothing about him but loved him
Smith - excited before but he took awhile to grow on me
Capaldi - very excited but the writing really was a disappointment for me, nothing wrong with him though.
Jodie Whittaker - I only know here from Broadchurch and there was little there to set my world alight but then again, as with the previous, judging her before she makes it to the screen seems a bit silly.

Angron · 21-07-2017 5:50pm

I've never seen Broadchurch, so I have no idea what she's like. However, I'm hopeful it'll be good, and I'm also hopeful the seasons get a bit more consistency that I felt they were lacking under Moffat.

pixelburp · 23-07-2017 10:51pm

From comic con, a trailer for the Xmas episode has been released :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNx9bzq1p4g

Busi_Girl08 · 24-07-2017 11:27am

Brilliant trailer, and I'm looking forward to Christmas, but once again,

could they cool it with the spoiler reveals months before the episode? It would have been nicer to have been surprised by Bill's return.

Daledge · 24-07-2017 12:28pm

I'm more pissed off about all the spoiler reveals than I am about a female doctor. Literally don't know any other show that does it and it's a terrible, terrible marketing ploy. People are going to watch it whether they know that, for example, the master is in a certain episode or not, but they'd enjoy it so much more if they were genuinely surprised. It's actually having the opposite effect on me - I'm considering stopping watching because I already know the main plot points and biggest twists before they even unfold. It makes it boring.

I mean just imagine the effect it would have had if we hadn't known

Simms

was going to be in the recent episode, it would have been one of the best moments of New Who without a shadow of a doubt.

Can sort of understand announcing the next doctor being female prior to the episode as it might take a while for some fans to adjust but I know personally I'd prefer to find out live. It just adds so much more to the show.

Take Game of Thrones for example. NOBODY (apart from book readers, obviously) saw

Ned's death

or the

Red Wedding

coming and it was absolutely astounding, while also gut-wrenching, to watch it happen. Twists like these are what make great shows great and I think Who would be so much better than it already is if it followed suit.

For those who are going to say "Just don't watch the trailers", I don't. But it gets spoiled on every form of social media because they give so much away in the trailers and announcements.

The_Valeyard · 24-07-2017 7:03pm

Busi_Girl08 wrote: »

Brilliant trailer, and I'm looking forward to Christmas, but once again,
could they cool it with the spoiler reveals months before the episode? It would have been nicer to have been surprised by Bill's return.

Yeah I Think BBC actually have a Spoiler division team who's job it is to ruin everything.

Penn · 25-07-2017 8:58am

The_Valeyard wrote: »

Yeah I Think BBC actually have a Spoiler division team who's job it is to ruin everything.

Soaps are the worst for it. I can't understand why my mother and sisters watch them when they spend half the episode talking about what's going to happen in the next few episodes.

Busi_Girl08 · 25-07-2017 9:33am

RopeDrink wrote: »

Trailer didn't actually do much for me. In addition, I both love and hate that 1st (Hartnell) to 1st (Bradley) merge.

a) It's nice that they keep acknowledging the fact that the 1st is played by someone else now. Hartnell's portrayal will always be remembered and I'm sure there are people out there who find it difficult to see past it and give Bradley the reigns fully, so it's a tip of the hat without forgetting the past. Having said that, I think we can all assume that (aside from possible sporadic appearance potential) this is likely a once-off deal for Bradley.

b) But it's so blatantly CGI looking and having gone through a lot of the Tenth Planet after the previous finale episode where Bill first became a Cyberman, I know why it looks off - the background/set being different.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBHGbBJwyh0

Either way, no doubt I'll be checking in to see how it pans out... But yes, they really do love undermining their own hype potential by spoiling everything in advance. Pearl's popularity as Bill was always a bit topsy-turvy but fans would have probably appreciated her appearance being a surprise. Also unsure if true or just pot-stirring but YouTube comments on that trailer keep going on about
Clara will be included seeing as the actress has been supposedly signed for the special - which, to me, seems like a brief goodbye scene, probably similar to Amy/11th
- or it could be a load of ole cobblers.

I would be amazed if

she didn't make an appearance. It would be even more poignant if she was saying goodbye to the Doctor, or guiding him to his regeneration, while on her final journey to Gallifrey to finish her cycle and face her death.

Doctor DooM · 26-07-2017 1:13pm

Busi_Girl08 wrote: »

I would be amazed if
she didn't make an appearance. It would be even more poignant if she was saying goodbye to the Doctor, or guiding him to his regeneration, while on her final journey to Gallifrey to finish her cycle and face her death.

Yeah the Doctor often hallucinates during regeneration, 12 would probably see Clara, as those neurons fire and him forgetting her "heals". they could leave it up to our imagination if it's real or not

for the first time I nearly wrote 13 instead of 12 there

Busi_Girl08 · 26-07-2017 2:05pm

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Yeah the Doctor often hallucinates during regeneration, 12 would probably see Clara, as those neurons fire and him forgetting her "heals". they could leave it up to our imagination if it's real or not

for the first time I nearly wrote 13 instead of 12 there

She came up in his "Doctor" moment just before Bill's magical tear brought him back to life. She's still there unconsciously I think. Which would explain why he still he remembers her song. Kind of like when Rory was wiped out and she was crying for him without realising.

pixelburp · 17-11-2017 11:06pm

A 2 minute clip from the Xmas Special was released during Children in Need tonight; it's nothing too spoilery, just a bit of banter in the TARDIS between Doctors

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIHIyuVK9uA

OU812 · 17-12-2017 9:34pm

OK lads & lasses. I've three episodes from the last season I haven't seen (have seen the finale), didn't watch them because the season didn't grip me a lot & had other stuff to watch. Question is whether I need to binge them before next week?

pixelburp · 17-12-2017 9:36pm

OU812 wrote: »

OK lads & lasses. I've three episodes from the last season I haven't seen (have seen the finale), didn't watch them because the season didn't grip me a lot & had other stuff to watch. Question is whether I need to binge them before next week?

The Xmas episode looks to pick up from the finale so I'd say yeah, best to get through them so the tables are set for you, so to speak...

FunLover18 · 17-12-2017 10:32pm

OU812 wrote: »

OK lads & lasses. I've three episodes from the last season I haven't seen (have seen the finale), didn't watch them because the season didn't grip me a lot & had other stuff to watch. Question is whether I need to binge them before next week?

You've seen the finale so you haven't seen 9, 10 or 11? I wouldn't bother, bit weird that you didn't seen the first part of the finale but I don't think there's anything of relevance. Empress of Mars is very poor and Eaters of Light is a good standalone.

pixelburp · 17-12-2017 10:45pm

I realise now you did say you had seen the finale, so ignore my own comment lol.

Yeah, agree on the above, though part 1 of the finale (episode 11) is worth watching - IMO much better than the followup and one of the strongest, legitimately creepiest Cyberman stories out there. Definitely one that captured the body horror aspect (insofar as tea time telly allows).

Doctor Who Season 10 [** Spoilers **]

Comments

Doctor Who Season 10 [ Spoilers ]