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Wifi mesh systems

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  • #32
    Ray Donovan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,015 ✭✭✭Ray Donovan


    Pardon my total tech ignorance but would that still more or less be a plug and play device?


  • #33
    alta stare
    Registered Users Posts: 2,326 ✭✭✭alta stare


    Sleeper12 wrote: »
    Google wi-fi sorted out all my virgin router problems. Not cheap but I have a stress free life now

    I was looking at one those. Is the range good? The house had solid walls and the extender os a pain in the ass at this rate.


  • #34
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Ray Donovan wrote: »
    Pardon my total tech ignorance but would that still more or less be a plug and play device?


    Yeah, when you plug it into the wall it uses the power lines in the house as cables to directly connect from one device to another, so if you have think walls it wont stop the signal


    The mesh wifi will also work but this is a backup netowrk


  • #35
    Ray Donovan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,015 ✭✭✭Ray Donovan


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Yeah, when you plug it into the wall it uses the power lines in the house as cables to directly connect from one device to another, so if you have think walls it wont stop the signal


    The mesh wifi will also work but this is a backup netowrk

    Thanks for all the info. Pretty steep at €300ish. Might chance the M5 for €100 less and see how we go. Return it and upgrade it if necessary.


  • #36
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Ray Donovan wrote: »
    Thanks for all the info. Pretty steep at €300ish. Might chance the M5 for €100 less and see how we go. Return it and upgrade it if necessary.

    Amazon they are circa 200
    Euro


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  • #37
    Ray Donovan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,015 ✭✭✭Ray Donovan


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Amazon they are circa 200
    Euro

    Really?? If you get me that link I’d be forever on your debt. Im talking about the 3 pack....!!!???


  • #38
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    TP-LINK Deco P9 Whole Home Powerline Mesh Wi-Fi System, Up To 6000 Sq ft coverage, Thick Wall, Works with Amazon Echo/Alexa, Wi-Fi Booster, Parental Controls, Pack of 3 https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07XSBGP7G/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_9UnQEbRF30S3F


  • #39
    Ray Donovan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,015 ✭✭✭Ray Donovan


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    TP-LINK Deco P9 Whole Home Powerline Mesh Wi-Fi System, Up To 6000 Sq ft coverage, Thick Wall, Works with Amazon Echo/Alexa, Wi-Fi Booster, Parental Controls, Pack of 3 https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07XSBGP7G/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_9UnQEbRF30S3F

    Sorry to be a square but you recommended the M9 and this is the P9??


  • #40
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Ray Donovan wrote: »
    Sorry to be a square but you recommended the M9 and this is the P9??


    Sorry I meant the P9.....


    The M9 is the tri-band version which is a seperate wifi network as a backbone. Will not help in your situation as the block walls will affect the second wifi as well.


    The P9 is the one which connects the backbone via the electric cables.....sorry too many model numbers in head


  • #41
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,436 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    When it comes to wifi mesh systems, it is important to consider how the backhaul works on different systems as that will give you very different performance.

    The ideal setup is to connect each unit via Ethernet cable if you can run it to each unit. This will give you the best performance and actually allows you to use cheaper wifi mesh units or wireless access points, while getting better performance. Only downside is the need to run ethernet cables if not already in place, but well worth doing if you can.

    Next best option is either Tri-band systems or powerline based systems. Which is better can depend on your home. Some wall materials/construction can cause tri-band not to work well, but equally poor electrical cable and interference on that can cause poor powerline performance too. So if going with one of these options, I'd recommend buying from somewhere with an easy returns policy that allows you to try it out for a week or two.

    Last option is dual band only system. The only reason to consider one of these systems, is if you are using it with ethernet backhaul or if you budget is very limited and you can't stretch to any of the above options. Now if all you care about is getting connectivity where you currently don't have any, then yes, they do work, but performance is slow. Though that might not really bother some people, as long as it is fast enough to do one HD stream, they are happy. However I wouldn't pay much for this, if this is your goal, you should be looking at the cheaper systems.


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  • #42
    Ray Donovan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,015 ✭✭✭Ray Donovan


    bk wrote: »
    When it comes to wifi mesh systems, it is important to consider how the backhaul works on different systems as that will give you very different performance.

    The ideal setup is to connect each unit via Ethernet cable if you can run it to each unit. This will give you the best performance and actually allows you to use cheaper wifi mesh units or wireless access points, while getting better performance. Only downside is the need to run ethernet cables if not already in place, but well worth doing if you can.

    Next best option is either Tri-band systems or powerline based systems. Which is better can depend on your home. Some wall materials/construction can cause tri-band not to work well, but equally poor electrical cable and interference on that can cause poor powerline performance too. So if going with one of these options, I'd recommend buying from somewhere with an easy returns policy that allows you to try it out for a week or two.

    Last option is dual band only system. The only reason to consider one of these systems, is if you are using it with ethernet backhaul or if you budget is very limited and you can't stretch to any of the above options. Now if all you care about is getting connectivity where you currently don't have any, then yes, they do work, but performance is slow. Though that might not really bother some people, as long as it is fast enough to do one HD stream, they are happy. However I wouldn't pay much for this, if this is your goal, you should be looking at the cheaper systems.

    My house was built in 2017 so if wiring is up to scratch it seems you would advise the Deco P9 system too for powerline. I don't fancy running ethernet cables to 2 satellite decos to be honest.


  • #43
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Ray Donovan wrote: »
    My house was built in 2017 so if wiring is up to scratch it seems you would advise the Deco P9 system too for powerline. I don't fancy running ethernet cables to 2 satellite decos to be honest.


    No issues


  • #44
    alta stare
    Registered Users Posts: 2,326 ✭✭✭alta stare


    bk wrote: »
    When it comes to wifi mesh systems, it is important to consider how the backhaul works on different systems as that will give you very different performance.

    The ideal setup is to connect each unit via Ethernet cable if you can run it to each unit. This will give you the best performance and actually allows you to use cheaper wifi mesh units or wireless access points, while getting better performance. Only downside is the need to run ethernet cables if not already in place, but well worth doing if you can.

    Next best option is either Tri-band systems or powerline based systems. Which is better can depend on your home. Some wall materials/construction can cause tri-band not to work well, but equally poor electrical cable and interference on that can cause poor powerline performance too. So if going with one of these options, I'd recommend buying from somewhere with an easy returns policy that allows you to try it out for a week or two.

    Last option is dual band only system. The only reason to consider one of these systems, is if you are using it with ethernet backhaul or if you budget is very limited and you can't stretch to any of the above options. Now if all you care about is getting connectivity where you currently don't have any, then yes, they do work, but performance is slow. Though that might not really bother some people, as long as it is fast enough to do one HD stream, they are happy. However I wouldn't pay much for this, if this is your goal, you should be looking at the cheaper systems.

    Do they need to be connect in series or parallel?


  • #45
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    bk wrote: »
    When it comes to wifi mesh systems, it is important to consider how the backhaul works on different systems as that will give you very different performance.

    The ideal setup is to connect each unit via Ethernet cable if you can run it to each unit. This will give you the best performance and actually allows you to use cheaper wifi mesh units or wireless access points, while getting better performance. Only downside is the need to run ethernet cables if not already in place, but well worth doing if you can.

    Next best option is either Tri-band systems or powerline based systems. Which is better can depend on your home. Some wall materials/construction can cause tri-band not to work well, but equally poor electrical cable and interference on that can cause poor powerline performance too. So if going with one of these options, I'd recommend buying from somewhere with an easy returns policy that allows you to try it out for a week or two.

    Last option is dual band only system. The only reason to consider one of these systems, is if you are using it with ethernet backhaul or if you budget is very limited and you can't stretch to any of the above options. Now if all you care about is getting connectivity where you currently don't have any, then yes, they do work, but performance is slow. Though that might not really bother some people, as long as it is fast enough to do one HD stream, they are happy. However I wouldn't pay much for this, if this is your goal, you should be looking at the cheaper systems.


    My experience of dual band is they would preform better than you refer to. I had none of them wired and they worked ok. In reality they would have been prefect for most people but I like to mess around :-)



    I would of had 2-3 Netflix streams while I worked etc and they worked. If gaming then yes I think you could have issues


  • #46
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,436 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Ray Donovan wrote: »
    My house was built in 2017 so if wiring is up to scratch it seems you would advise the Deco P9 system too for powerline. I don't fancy running ethernet cables to 2 satellite decos to be honest.

    I'd just stress buying from somewhere with a good returns policy, so you can return if needed.
    alta stare wrote: »
    Do they need to be connect in series or parallel?

    Ethernet? Ideally Parallel
    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    My experience of dual band is they would preform better than you refer to. I had none of them wired and they worked ok. In reality they would have been prefect for most people but I like to mess around :-)

    "Worked ok" is how I'd describe them.

    You are correct that it is probably "ok" for most people.

    As in, if someone has a dead spot in their bedroom at the end of the house that gets no signal. Sure it can probably get you 50 or 60 Mbps down there, which is fine for two Netflix streams or whatever.

    And for most people, that is probably very much good enough for them.

    But I feel that it is still quiet weak. After all if you are paying for 500mb/s Broadband, then it kind of sucks to get that limited to a tenth of the speed and specially when you are paying so much for a mesh system.

    An ethernet backed system or a triband/powerline system can often deliver speeds of up to 300mb/s or more in the distant parts of the house.

    Of course that may not matter to people, if all that are looking for is streaming Netflix, but I think it is worth pointing out, so that people can make informed decisions.


  • #47
    alta stare
    Registered Users Posts: 2,326 ✭✭✭alta stare


    bk wrote: »
    Ethernet? Ideally Parallel.

    Cool thanks. I asked as i wasnt sure if they have an in and out Ethernet set up or what way they were done.


  • #48
    towger
    Registered Users Posts: 440 ✭✭towger


    Anyone who has got Google Nest WiFi, where did you get it ? Not launched in Ireland yet.


  • #49
    whowantstwoknow
    Registered Users Posts: 754 ✭✭✭whowantstwoknow


    bk wrote: »
    When it comes to wifi mesh systems, it is important to consider how the backhaul works on different systems as that will give you very different performance.

    The ideal setup is to connect each unit via Ethernet cable if you can run it to each unit. This will give you the best performance and actually allows you to use cheaper wifi mesh units or wireless access points, while getting better performance. Only downside is the need to run ethernet cables if not already in place, but well worth doing if you can.

    Next best option is either Tri-band systems or powerline based systems. Which is better can depend on your home. Some wall materials/construction can cause tri-band not to work well, but equally poor electrical cable and interference on that can cause poor powerline performance too. So if going with one of these options, I'd recommend buying from somewhere with an easy returns policy that allows you to try it out for a week or two.

    Last option is dual band only system. The only reason to consider one of these systems, is if you are using it with ethernet backhaul or if you budget is very limited and you can't stretch to any of the above options. Now if all you care about is getting connectivity where you currently don't have any, then yes, they do work, but performance is slow. Though that might not really bother some people, as long as it is fast enough to do one HD stream, they are happy. However I wouldn't pay much for this, if this is your goal, you should be looking at the cheaper systems.

    Thanks for this info. Considering doing something to improve the wifi in the house seeing it has SIRO coming in. I have 2 points with Ethernet cables currently in use and possible another location which has the LAN via a powerline. bk, can you recommend a suitable system for such a setup?

    If the system would consume the existing cable and I'd like to keep the hardwire uses, could one use a small 1gb POE switch/hug inbetween?

    Thanks
    W.


  • #50
    GinSoaked
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,049 ✭✭✭GinSoaked


    whowantstwoknow wrote: »
    Thanks for this info. Considering doing something to improve the wifi in the house seeing it has SIRO coming in. I have 2 points with Ethernet cables currently in use and possible another location which has the LAN via a powerline. bk, can you recommend a suitable system for such a setup?

    If the system would consume the existing cable and I'd like to keep the hardwire uses, could one use a small 1gb POE switch/hug inbetween?

    Thanks
    W.

    In a very large house our neighbor has I put in 4 AC1750 dual band AP's using PoE off a switch providing PoE, works great. All same SSIDs and roaming works a treat.

    Most houses would only need two AP's of that type and you could use cheaper units, I like the ones I linked to because they have excellent range and a commercial warranty so if one dies after a bit of tech support they will send out a replacement (even 3 years down the road - did have one die).


  • #51
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,531 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    alta stare wrote: »
    Do they need to be connect in series or parallel?
    bk wrote: »
    Ethernet? Ideally Parallel

    Really? I would have said that Ethernet would ideally be wired in "star" i.e. all home runs back to a common point.


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  • #52
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    ANyone seen or heard of these from Huawei: https://www.amazon.co.uk/HUAWEI-Gigabit-Seamless-Roaming-Everywhere/dp/B07ZTPZCBT

    Performance looks good and the ability to add satellites also looks good, smaller devices to the TP-Link ones.

    I can't find the satellites as a standalone sale is the only issue. Reviews seem good


  • #53
    ablelocks
    Registered Users Posts: 4,672 ✭✭✭ablelocks


    towger wrote: »
    Anyone who has got Google Nest WiFi, where did you get it ? Not launched in Ireland yet.

    got mine in currys last year (maybe an older model though?)


  • #54
    Ray Donovan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,015 ✭✭✭Ray Donovan


    So this is how much of a tech dope I am - I'm pretty sure it turns out I have the appropriate CAT 5 cabling running through my walls to set up a mesh system with ethernet backhaul and I have 3 access points downstairs and one upstairs.

    So any recommendations out there in the TP Link series for a Deco system that would be suitable for this job for a 2700 sq ft house? Because the ethernet backhaul option is available to me I'm provisionally thinking of going with the Deco M5 (3 pack).


  • #55
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,436 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    whowantstwoknow wrote: »
    Thanks for this info. Considering doing something to improve the wifi in the house seeing it has SIRO coming in. I have 2 points with Ethernet cables currently in use and possible another location which has the LAN via a powerline. bk, can you recommend a suitable system for such a setup?

    If the system would consume the existing cable and I'd like to keep the hardwire uses, could one use a small 1gb POE switch/hug inbetween?

    Definitely, my place has two ethernet ports in each room and I'm using two standard cheap ethernet switches to connect multiple devices to the ports. Mine are powered by a plug. POE is even neater, though the gear for it a bit more expensive.

    The absolute gold standard are the Ubiquiti access points. Though they are more enterprise grade kit and a bit more techy to set up. Others on this forum have them and can lively advise.

    GinSoaked recommendation of the TP-Link good too from what I've seen of reviews.

    If you want a straight consumer versions, some of the Google Wifi units support ethernet backhaul. But double checker, I think some of the newer units don't.
    2011 wrote: »
    Really? I would have said that Ethernet would ideally be wired in "star" i.e. all home runs back to a common point.

    Ha, yes, "star" is correct, but that is what I was actually thinking when I replied to that question!

    Of course series and parallel, mean something very different with electrical cable! :D

    I was thinking two parallel ethernet cables from the WAPs back to a central router. Which of course is fundamentally a star topology.

    Having said that, some WAP's do support series routing if that is more convenient, but not all, so you would need to double check.


  • #56
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,436 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Ray Donovan wrote: »
    So this is how much of a tech dope I am - I'm pretty sure it turns out I have the appropriate CAT 5 cabling running through my walls to set up a mesh system with ethernet backhaul and I have 3 access points downstairs and one upstairs.

    So any recommendations out there in the TP Link series for a Deco system that would be suitable for this job for a 2700 sq ft house? Because the ethernet backhaul option is available to me I'm provisionally thinking of going with the Deco M5 (3 pack).

    Yes, looks like the Deoc M5 supports ethernet bakchaul:
    https://www.tp-link.com/us/support/faq/1794/

    Also interesting graph there of how the M5 can be wired. Looks like it supports both star and series connection.


  • #57
    GinSoaked
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,049 ✭✭✭GinSoaked


    I've installed both Ubiquiti and TP-Link AP's and links and its hard to put a cigarette paper between them. The interfaces are often very similar with near identical features. I've only recently put in three Ubiquiti long range wireless links but could have just as easily used similar TP-Link products. tbh next time I will use TP-Link gear because its a bit cheaper, thought Ubiquiti was going to be much better which is why I started using it but it really isn't.

    One reason I'd never use Ubiquiti access points is that their PoE is all 24Volt so can't be plugged into a standard supply from a normal PoE switch. You need to be a 25 quid adapter to use Ubiquiti equipment on a normal PoE switch. The TP-Link AC1750 and most of their other access points take a standard 48 volt PoE supply.


  • #58
    Gooey Looey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,297 ✭✭✭Gooey Looey


    GinSoaked wrote: »
    I've installed both Ubiquiti and TP-Link AP's and links and its hard to put a cigarette paper between them. The interfaces are often very similar with near identical features. I've only recently put in three Ubiquiti long range wireless links but could have just as easily used similar TP-Link products. tbh next time I will use TP-Link gear because its a bit cheaper, thought Ubiquiti was going to be much better which is why I started using it but it really isn't.

    One reason I'd never use Ubiquiti access points is that their PoE is all 24Volt so can't be plugged into a standard supply from a normal PoE switch. You need to be a 25 quid adapter to use Ubiquiti equipment on a normal PoE switch. The TP-Link AC1750 and most of their other access points take a standard 48 volt PoE supply.

    Depends on which you buy,the cheaper ones maybe but there are plenty of Unifi are 802.3af and 802.3at poe

    https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/115000263008-UniFi-Supported-PoE-Protocols


  • #59
    GinSoaked
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,049 ✭✭✭GinSoaked


    Gooey Looey wrote: »
    Depends on which you buy,the cheaper ones maybe but there are plenty of Unifi are 802.3af and 802.3at poe

    https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/115000263008-UniFi-Supported-PoE-Protocols

    I'm not quite with you, are you saying if you buy Ubiquiti AP's and want to power them from a switch then you have to buy a Ubiquiti PoE switch as referenced in your link? Thats my understanding anyway either that or buy the Ubiquiti adapters. Maybe I've got that wrong but when the Ubiquiti device says its 24V passive and your switch is 48V I won't be plugging it in.


  • #60
    Gooey Looey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,297 ✭✭✭Gooey Looey


    GinSoaked wrote: »
    I'm not quite with you, are you saying if you buy Ubiquiti AP's and want to power them from a switch then you have to buy a Ubiquiti PoE switch as referenced in your link? Thats my understanding anyway either that or buy the Ubiquiti adapters. Maybe I've got that wrong but when the Ubiquiti device says its 24V passive and your switch is 48V I won't be plugging it in.

    Most Unifi are now 48v and 802.3af or 802.3at Poe compliant to work with any third party Poe switch.

    Legacy devices were mostly 24v


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  • #61
    towger
    Registered Users Posts: 440 ✭✭towger


    ablelocks wrote: »
    got mine in currys last year (maybe an older model though?)

    Thanks yes, that would be the older model.


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