Home heating automation

flogen · 26-10-2017 12:01pm

deezell wrote: »

This is a basic two port boiler with pumped flow and return. There must be external components, maybe motorised valves, cylinder stats, in order to manage hot water only provison. Can you post a pic of the timer? Or even just the make and model no.

deezell wrote: »

Without seeing the timer, your simplest solution is to interject a smart thermostat into the call for heat circuit that runs from the timer. If the the timer has separate HW/CH buttons or controls, it's just a case of putting the smart stat relay in the connection back to the boiler and possible motorised valves. The timer gets set to always on and the smart stat takes over timing. The Tado is ideal for this, it has the relay built in. Others generally have the relay in a small controller or box, which can be wired next to the boiler, or may fit directly onto the plate of your existing timer controller depending on Model. Nest or Tado V3 for Home kit connectivity, also Honeywell Lyric, Ecobee and Heatmiser.

Thanks - will post a picture of the timer later but afaik there's no provision for hot water only - not that I've come across anyway.

deezell · 26-10-2017 12:26pm

flogen wrote: »

Thanks - will post a picture of the timer later but afaik there's no provision for hot water only - not that I've come across anyway.

This model is labelled as "Designed for the Irish Market", which means it's a simple boiler with just flow and return, no on demand hot water, it would have to be connected to a HW cylinder. This means at some stage the boiler has to pump the system water to the HW cylinder coil, independent of going to the radiators. A pump is built into this unit when it fires, so it's possible that the system is "always on" for hot water heating, possibly by a cylinder stat, and the timer you mention just opens a valve and calls for heat to the radiators. In this case its just a question of tapping or substituting the Switched Live (SL) from this timer to a smart stat or its associated extension or control box where the relay lives. This is important to establish, as the SL may not go directly to the SL terminal in the boiler, but to a motorised valve for the CH which in turn energises the boiler SL when it is open. This valve if fitted might be a three port type which directs the hot flow to the cylinder, radiators or both. In the absence of an existing thermostat which would simplify connection of a new smart stat, you need to establish if the timer just operates the CH (which seems to be the case) and has just a single connection SL back to operate boiler, valves etc which turns on the CH. Is the timer battery or mains operated? I suppose what i should ask is does it provide hot water when no CH is on?

flogen · 26-10-2017 12:54pm

deezell wrote: »

This model is labelled as "Designed for the Irish Market", which means it's a simple boiler with just flow and return, no on demand hot water, it would have to be connected to a HW cylinder. This means at some stage the boiler has to pump the system water to the HW cylinder coil, independent of going to the radiators. A pump is built into this unit when it fires, so it's possible that the system is "always on" for hot water heating, possibly by a cylinder stat, and the timer you mention just opens a valve and calls for heat to the radiators. In this case its just a question of tapping or substituting the Switched Live (SL) from this timer to a smart stat or its associated extension or control box where the relay lives. This is important to establish, as the SL may not go directly to the SL terminal in the boiler, but to a motorised valve for the CH which in turn energises the boiler SL when it is open. This valve if fitted might be a three port type which directs the hot flow to the cylinder, radiators or both. In the absence of an existing thermostat which would simplify connection of a new smart stat, you need to establish if the timer just operates the CH (which seems to be the case) and has just a single connection SL back to operate boiler, valves etc which turns on the CH. Is the timer battery or mains operated? I suppose what i should ask is does it provide hot water when no CH is on?

No - we don't have hot water unless the central heating has been on (that's part of what's drawing me to a smart system - I'd like to eventually add connected radiator controls so I could turn them off with greater ease when I wanted to heat the water only)

deezell · 26-10-2017 2:41pm

flogen wrote: »

No - we don't have hot water unless the central heating has been on (that's part of what's drawing me to a smart system - I'd like to eventually add connected radiator controls so I could turn them off with greater ease when I wanted to heat the water only)

The smart system on its own won't do that, but it will control the necessary hardware, which at the minimum requires a motorised valve, and realistically requires a pair, one each for the HW circuit and one for the CH. (Known as an S plan) Alternatively as you suggest you could put TRVs on every radiator, which would effectively close them off while the water only was heating. Unless you have manual radiator TRVs with the right valve body already installed, you will need to change the actual valve at one end of each radiator to do this, a biggish plumbing job which I'd cost materials at over €80 per radiator when you include the cost of the smart TRV heads, and perhaps €40+ per radiator for the labour of draining, removing old valve and inserting the new.
Installing a pair of S plan connected motorised valves at the boiler would be the best option, connected to your smart control unit which will operate them and fire the boiler. All the smart thermostats connect wirelessly to their control units, manual thermostat is shown on the diagram. Cylinder stat would still be a manual device .
The Nest can re-use the cables going to the current timer to supply a powered connection so you don't need to plug it in to its little charger. The other brands all use batteries in their thermostats. The diagram below is for a Vikera Vibe
and shows the wiring required from controller to valves for a standard install. a smart install would have the room stat connecting wirelessly to the controller timer unit.

mickdw · 26-10-2017 3:09pm

mickdw wrote: »

Looking to do a very basic boiler control update.
Currently the system has an oil burner controlled via timer on its front panel.
Due to location of boiler we now want to fit wall control panel instead of going to the front of the boiler each time.
Ideally the new controller should have manual control at the controller with basic on / off /timer and also would like control via wifi on phone.
I'm not interested in subscription based systems and don't need anything more complex.
Simplicity is important as older people will need to be able to hit a button on the wall to turn on the heat.
Any ideas of a good, possibly low cost unit to do this.

Just to follow up alittle here.
In addition to the above, we also have a small room with no oil heating and have a small 450w electric flat panel radiator to heat it.
If there are spare zones on the control device I get, can that electric rad to controlled as a zone of its own from the smart controller. Are smart controllers capable of switching and powering a 450w device or would it need to be run through some form of relay?

deezell · 26-10-2017 3:34pm

mickdw wrote: »

Just to follow up alittle here.
In addition to the above, we also have a small room with no oil heating and have a small 450w electric flat panel radiator to heat it.
If there are spare zones on the control device I get, can that electric rad to controlled as a zone of its own from the smart controller. Are smart controllers capable of switching and powering a 450w device or would it need to be run through some form of relay?

Yes, a zone controller will easily handle 450W. A smart controller with 3 zones and Home kit might be scarce and expensive. Nest and Tado have just two, so you'd need additional Stats to get the extra zone. Better and cheaper to get a smart Home kit enabled PowerPlug for the panel and operate it from Home kit maybe.

mickdw · 26-10-2017 4:01pm

Over my head alittle there but I'm slowly learning.
We only have the single zone and heat and water is all together so addition of rad would be second zone.

deezell · 26-10-2017 7:53pm

mickdw wrote: »

Over my head alittle there but I'm slowly learning.
We only have the single zone and heat and water is all together so addition of rad would be second zone.

It would be odd to leave heating and HW on a single circuit. You have to heat the radiators if you need hot water. If you install valves to separate heating from HW, you can always have the HW valve and boiler operated purely by a cylinder stat, no timer. You could then use the second zone of a smart stat controller to power on the panel. You could in fact power it on from the switched live which calls the boiler, it will turn on and off in sympathy with the rads. My only reservation in this is the load on the relay, which although low at about 2 amps, it might shorten the life of the controller relay contacts.

flogen · 27-10-2017 3:59pm

deezell wrote: »

The smart system on its own won't do that, but it will control the necessary hardware, which at the minimum requires a motorised valve, and realistically requires a pair, one each for the HW circuit and one for the CH. (Known as an S plan) Alternatively as you suggest you could put TRVs on every radiator, which would effectively close them off while the water only was heating. Unless you have manual radiator TRVs with the right valve body already installed, you will need to change the actual valve at one end of each radiator to do this, a biggish plumbing job which I'd cost materials at over €80 per radiator when you include the cost of the smart TRV heads, and perhaps €40+ per radiator for the labour of draining, removing old valve and inserting the new.
Installing a pair of S plan connected motorised valves at the boiler would be the best option, connected to your smart control unit which will operate them and fire the boiler. All the smart thermostats connect wirelessly to their control units, manual thermostat is shown on the diagram. Cylinder stat would still be a manual device .
The Nest can re-use the cables going to the current timer to supply a powered connection so you don't need to plug it in to its little charger. The other brands all use batteries in their thermostats. The diagram below is for a Vikera Vibe
and shows the wiring required from controller to valves for a standard install. a smart install would have the room stat connecting wirelessly to the controller timer unit.

Wow -that seems a lot more complicated than I’d expected. I had assumed that I’d essentially be able to replace the timer with something WiFi-enabled that would allow me to turn the heating on and off remotely. Then I’d add smart controls to each rad so that I could easily turn them all off while the heating was on, essentially heating the water only.

Anyway, there’s a pic of the current timer attached if it helps at all -it’s mains powered too (though it has a battery backup)

TMC99 · 27-10-2017 4:12pm

I was looking at the EPH controller for a total refurbishment and extension. My plumber is recommending 6 zones (incl HW) due to the layout and usage of the house. Is it possible to have 2 * 4 zone controllers and hardwired stats and still have the Ember app? My reason for the hardwired stats is that WiFi coverage is patchy (3ft walls) and as I'm rewiring already its not an issue to hard wire the stats.

deezell · 27-10-2017 9:23pm

flogen wrote: »

Wow -that seems a lot more complicated ......
Anyway, there’s a pic of the current timer attached if it helps at all -it’s mains powered too (though it has a battery backup)

Don't be put off. First you can go ahead and get smart, you'll have stat control and the rest, your hot water will still be heating dependent. The two wires to pins 2 and 4 of your timer are the ones yo be switched by the smart stat or it's controller depending on make. Once you get this up and running, decide between the cost of smart trv control of each rad, ( € 120 each maybe) or installing at least one motorised valve and a cylinder stat to heat water without the rads coming on, cost about €60 for each valve, plus labour to fit.

flogen · 28-10-2017 3:09pm

deezell wrote: »

flogen wrote: »

Wow -that seems a lot more complicated ......
Anyway, there’s a pic of the current timer attached if it helps at all -it’s mains powered too (though it has a battery backup)

Don't be put off. First you can go ahead and get smart, you'll have stat control and the rest, your hot water will still be heating dependent. The two wires to pins 2 and 4 of your timer are the ones yo be switched by the smart stat or it's controller depending on make. Once you get this up and running, decide between the cost of smart trv control of each rad, ( € 120 each maybe) or installing at least one motorised valve and a cylinder stat to heat water without the rads coming on, cost about €60 for each valve, plus labour to fit.

Thanks for that - would getting the motorised valve etc definitely allow for separate hot water or is it dependent at all on the way the rest of the system is plumbed?

Also what would the need be for more than one valve?

deezell · 28-10-2017 5:35pm

flogen wrote: »

Thanks for that - would getting the motorised valve etc definitely allow for separate hot water or is it dependent at all on the way the rest of the system is plumbed?

Also what would the need be for more than one valve?

It appears that your current system is plumbed with direct connections from the boiler to the cylinder coil and the heating circuit. As soon as the boiler fires it pumps hot water to both of these. The boiler has an internal pump but you could check to see if an aditional external circulation pump is installed. To heat HW only the simplest installation would require a valve for the heating to cut it off when only hot water is required. This valve would be controlled by the room stat/ timer. The HW would be heated either when the heating is on or when it's own cylinder stat calls the boiler. With this setup the cylinder is constantly topped up with hot water. Adding a two zone controller allows the cylinder to be timed separately from the heating. Adding a second valve means the cylinder is not being heated when the rads are unless the cylinder stat and timer coincide with a call for room heating.If you a have a poorly insulated HW cylinder then you might want to put it on a timer, only heating HW exactly when needed. With a modern deep foam insulated cylinder it makes little difference to just have the cylinder on a stat, calling the boiler on demand.

Another reason for two valves is to do with the flow pressure from the boiler. An open circuit to the cylinder coil will reduce the pump pressure available to reach the furthest rads, making them slow to heat. A valve on the cylinder flow shuts off the coil circuit and all the hot flows to the rads. There is a three port valve device which is used to send the hot to either circuit or split it to both. This is known as a Y plan, but it's only marginally less costly to install, and the wiring is fussier.

deezell · 29-10-2017 11:04am

TMC99 wrote: »

I was looking at the EPH controller for a total refurbishment and extension. My plumber is recommending 6 zones (incl HW) due to the layout and usage of the house. Is it possible to have 2 * 4 zone controllers and hardwired stats and still have the Ember app? My reason for the hardwired stats is that WiFi coverage is patchy (3ft walls) ancd as I'm rewiring already its not an issue to hard wire the stats.

You would need to check that the EMBER app can control more than one ember controller, but this is probably ok as their app claims to control more than one home, so two controllers in the same home should be ok. From what I've read the EMBER controller only connect to wireless stats, unless the stats also have a wired relay inside. Even with this you would need to wire then to the zone output of the controller. This would be no different than a dumb stat, you would have no temperature control. The stat needs to communicate with the controller to exchange temperature readings and settings as well as call for heat. The latter is actually wired in the controller based on the information from the stat.
The Nest can be wired back to its controller, exchanging data and getting power at the same time. The Tado stat has a wired contact, it's extension controller has two zones, one HW and one for heating. This box connects wirelessly to its stat. You could install 4 more tado stats each wired to its respective zone valve, but all talking to the app via the bridge or hub which could be located optimally using an extended Ethernet cable. You could try the same thing with the eph stats of course, or you could locate one of the controllers optimally for connection to the affected stats, then hardwire it's valve control wires back to the boiler/ zone valve location. Eph stats link to the controller(s), not the hub, so moving one controller is probably the best bet. Edit. I note you say two 4 zone controllers, but you say you have six zones inclusive of HW, so you really only need two 3 zone controllers. I'm assuming the zones are generic, none are dedicated specifically to HW control. From the install instructions it's just a matter of pairing a room stat to a zone on that controller. Using 4 zone controllers would give you room for expansion, plus you could just use one controller near the two distant zones meaning less wiring back to the zone valve location

matrim · 29-10-2017 11:13am

deezell wrote: »

You would need to check that the EMBER app can control more than one ember controller, but this is probably ok as their app claims to control more than one home, so two controllers in the same home should be ok. From what I've read the EMBER controller only connect to wireless stats, unless the stats also have a wired relay inside. Even with this you would need to wire then to the zone output of the controller. This would be no different than a dumb stat, you would have no temperature control. The stat needs to communicate with the controller to exchange temperature readiness and settings as well as call for heat. The latter is actually hsbked in the controller based on the information from the stat.

You can add multiple "homes" to the ember app.

flogen · 29-10-2017 3:59pm

deezell wrote: »

flogen wrote: »

Thanks for that - would getting the motorised valve etc definitely allow for separate hot water or is it dependent at all on the way the rest of the system is plumbed?

Also what would the need be for more than one valve?

It appears that your current system is plumbed with direct connections from the boiler to the cylinder coil and the heating circuit. As soon as the boiler fires it pumps hot water to both of these. The boiler has an internal pump but you could check to see if an aditional external circulation pump is installed. To heat HW only the simplest installation would require a valve for the heating to cut it off when only hot water is required. This valve would be controlled by the room stat/ timer. The HW would be heated either when the heating is on or when it's own cylinder stat calls the boiler. With this setup the cylinder is constantly topped up with hot water. Adding a two zone controller allows the cylinder to be timed separately from the heating. Adding a second valve means the cylinder is not being heated when the rads are unless the cylinder stat and timer coincide with a call for room heating.If you a have a poorly insulated HW cylinder then you might want to put it on a timer, only heating HW exactly when needed. With a modern deep foam insulated cylinder it makes little difference to just have the cylinder on a stat, calling the boiler on demand.

Another reason for two valves is to do with the flow pressure from the boiler. An open circuit to the cylinder coil will reduce the pump pressure available to reach the furthest rads, making them slow to heat. A valve on the cylinder flow shuts off the coil circuit and all the hot flows to the rads. There is a three port valve device which is used to send the hot to either circuit or split it to both. This is known as a Y plan, but it's only marginally less costly to install, and the wiring is fussier.

Thanks for all of that - really appreciate the help

Irish Gunner · 30-10-2017 12:05pm

Have the Netatmo valves installed on 3 radiators in the house. Still not perfect as you cannot turn them off.

Newer firmware been released hopefully with each user's posting issues over on their forums.

I would recommend anyone thinking of getting them hold out till all issues resolved

skerry · 13-11-2017 8:38pm

Hi folks, hopefully this isn't covered elsewhere but I was thinking of picking up one of the pre-owned Tado V2's at Maplins. Their £79.99 and much cheaper than the V3 which is coming in at £170.

Just bought a house and it has 3 zones, upstairs, downstairs and water and figured one of these might be a good way to suss out the smart thermostat thing. Would get another thermo and extension kit if it worked out.

Anyone know if these are ex display? Also, apart from homekit integration what would I be missing out on over the V3. Is the V2 compatible with the smart TRVs

I just need a system that will let me control zones and that I can control through Google Home and if the V2 does all that then its vastly cheaper than the V3.

Any advice appreciated.

dec2000 · 13-11-2017 11:11pm

skerry wrote: »

Hi folks, hopefully this isn't covered elsewhere but I was thinking of picking up one of the pre-owned Tado V2's at Maplins. Their £79.99 and much cheaper than the V3 which is coming in at £170.

Just bought a house and it has 3 zones, upstairs, downstairs and water and figured one of these might be a good way to suss out the smart thermostat thing. Would get another thermo and extension kit if it worked out.

Anyone know if these are ex display? Also, apart from homekit integration what would I be missing out on over the V3. Is the V2 compatible with the smart TRVs

I just need a system that will let me control zones and that I can control through Google Home and if the V2 does all that then its vastly cheaper than the V3.

Any advice appreciated.

I bought two of the used Maplin stock for upstairs and downstairs zones. Just have the water on a timer for now, might get the extension kit someday but think I'll jump into trvs first.

The two I got looked ex display in that all the protective pieces and battery pull for first use were in tact. The boxes were a bit worn but everything in the box. You honestly can't go wrong with them, but in saying that I don't know what the rest of their stock is like.

V3 only adds homekit. Trvs work with v2, deezell I think had this going. If you jump back a free pages you'll see my experience with ordering from Maplin and install... Firmware was really old, took about 2 days for them to be updated to the latest.

skerry · 13-11-2017 11:16pm

dec2000 wrote: »

I bought two of the used Maplin stock for upstairs and downstairs zones. Just have the water on a timer for now, might get the extension kit someday but think I'll jump into trvs first.

The two I got looked ex display in that all the protective pieces and battery pull for first use were in tact. The boxes were a bit worn but everything in the box. You honestly can't go wrong with them, but in saying that I don't know what the rest of their stock is like.

V3 only adds homekit. Trvs work with v2, deezell I think had this going. If you jump back a free pages you'll see my experience with ordering from Maplin and install... Firmware was really old, took about 2 days for them to be updated to the latest.

Thanks a million for the info. Did unit update the firmware itself and take that long, or did you need to get in touch with Tado?

I'm thinking I'll chance the V2 so and see how it goes. Presume the pack includes the hub too?

Will be getting an electrician to do a few jobs in the new house in the coming days so might pick one up for downstairs and see how it works out.

If the only difference is homekit then there's no point in me spending the extra £90 on a new V3. Use android and will be hoping to control through my Google Home too.

deezell · 14-11-2017 12:40am

skerry wrote: »

Thanks a million for the info. Did unit update the firmware itself and take that long, or did you need to get in touch with Tado?

I'm thinking I'll chance the V2 so and see how it goes. Presume the pack includes the hub too?

Will be getting an electrician to do a few jobs in the new house in the coming days so might pick one up for downstairs and see how it works out.

If the only difference is homekit then there's no point in me spending the extra £90 on a new V3. Use android and will be hoping to control through my Google Home too.

It should update after install, though you might need to nudge tado into doing this. It comes with the hub, if you're doing 2 zones the 'used' v2 kit is cheaper than buying the stat on its own. You'll have a spare hub if you buy two kits as the stats can both be paired to a single hub. I'm assuming you current system has some type of non-smart zone timer, or at the very least simple stat control of zone valves and boiler firing. Its easiest to leave hot water on whatever control it currently has, cylinder stat usually to its own zone valve. If you want tado control of the cylinder timing, you'll need the tado extension kit box. If the cylinder is just heated as a consequence of the boiler being fired by the central heating then you'll need to take steps to zone it with a valve and an ordinary cylinder stat. If your current system has a 3 zone timer, upstairs, down and HW, this is ideal for upgrade by just replacing stats and setting heating zone timers to always on, and leaving the HW zone as is. V2 does work with the smart TRVs. They act like normal TRVs in terms of opening and closing their valve but also can fire the boiler via the stat in whose zone they are assigned.

skerry · 14-11-2017 9:46am

deezell wrote: »

skerry wrote: »

Thanks a million for the info. Did unit update the firmware itself and take that long, or did you need to get in touch with Tado?

I'm thinking I'll chance the V2 so and see how it goes. Presume the pack includes the hub too?

Will be getting an electrician to do a few jobs in the new house in the coming days so might pick one up for downstairs and see how it works out.

If the only difference is homekit then there's no point in me spending the extra £90 on a new V3. Use android and will be hoping to control through my Google Home too.

It should update after install, though you might need to nudge tado into doing this. It comes with the hub, if you're doing 2 zones the 'used' v2 kit is cheaper than buying the stat on its own. You'll have a spare hub if you buy two kits as the stats can both be paired to a single hub. I'm assuming you current system has some type of non-smart zone timer, or at the very least simple stat control of zone valves and boiler firing. Its easiest to leave hot water on whatever control it currently has, cylinder stat usually to its own zone valve. If you want tado control of the cylinder timing, you'll need the tado extension kit box. If the cylinder is just heated as a consequence of the boiler being fired by the central heating then you'll need to take steps to zone it with a valve and an ordinary cylinder stat. If your current system has a 3 zone timer, upstairs, down and HW, this is ideal for upgrade by just replacing stats and setting heating zone timers to always on, and leaving the HW zone as is. V2 does work with the smart TRVs. They act like normal TRVs in terms of opening and closing their valve but also can fire the boiler via the stat in whose zone they are assigned.

Thanks for the reply Deezell. I'm still trying to get my head around the system as I'm coming from a gas system in a much smaller house myself.

There is a pretty formidable tank in the hotpress which I'm told is servicing 3 zones. There's solar panels too which are giving some hot water to the system. There's also a standard temp dial in the hotpress to control water temp and one downstairs in the press to control heating temp. As far as I know there is a motorized valve in the hotpress too.

There is a digital Danfloss TP5 thermostat in the kitchen (pictured below) and a more basic dial thermostat on the landing with just temperature control. I presume these give stat control of zone valves and boiler firing?

I didn't see the conventional type timer in the downstairs press for the heat to come on at certain times so I'm guessing previous owner may have just left it on and let the stats control when it comes on and off upstairs/ downstairs.

Do you think it would just be a case of replacing the stats in the kitchen and landing with smart stats or does it sound like there's more to it than that? If it worked out, I would be hoping to get one stat first for downstairs and the get a second and the extension kit.
Apologies for basic description of system, still trying to get my head around it.

deezell · 14-11-2017 10:49am

skerry wrote: »

....
There is a pretty formidable tank in the hotpress which I'm told is servicing 3 zones. There's solar panels too which are giving some hot water to the system. There's also a standard temp dial in the hotpress to control water temp and one downstairs in the press to control heating temp. As far as I know there is a motorized valve in the hotpress too........
There is a digital Danfloss TP5 thermostat in the kitchen (pictured below) and a more basic dial thermostat on the landing with just temperature control. I presume these give stat control of zone valves and boiler firing?......
Do you think it would just be a case of replacing the stats in the kitchen and landing with smart stats or does it sound like there's more to it than that?.

Sounds straightforward enough. The TP5 is a timer and stat, 2 wire connection so a straight swap out with the tado. Similarly the other stat can be replaced in the same way, it seems that there is timer control in the kitchen. Try and establish how the house is zoned. Rather than wreck your head studying the pipework, just see if you can heat one zone independent if the other. Turn down landing and fire the kitchen stat. See what heats and where. Do the opposite. If there is only a single motorised valve is it 2 or 3 port? You mention a humongous tank, I'm guessing this more than a HW cylinder, it may be a thermal store which can give heat to to the rads as well as hot water. No need to worry about this yet. If you can heat two areas independently with the current stats you have 2 true zones. A ir B or both It may be that you have a system where you can turn off just one zone, heating A or both but not B on its own. The kitchen stat might control the firing and timer, the landing stat just the zone upstairs when the kitchen timer is on

skerry · 14-11-2017 11:09am

deezell wrote: »

skerry wrote: »

....
There is a pretty formidable tank in the hotpress which I'm told is servicing 3 zones. There's solar panels too which are giving some hot water to the system. There's also a standard temp dial in the hotpress to control water temp and one downstairs in the press to control heating temp. As far as I know there is a motorized valve in the hotpress too........
There is a digital Danfloss TP5 thermostat in the kitchen (pictured below) and a more basic dial thermostat on the landing with just temperature control. I presume these give stat control of zone valves and boiler firing?......
Do you think it would just be a case of replacing the stats in the kitchen and landing with smart stats or does it sound like there's more to it than that?.

Sounds straightforward enough. The TP5 is a timer and stat, 2 wire connection so a straight swap out with the tado. Similarly the other stat can be replaced in the same way, it seems that there is timer control in the kitchen. Try and establish how the house is zoned. Rather than wreck your head studying the pipework, just see if you can heat one zone independent if the other. Turn down landing and fire the kitchen stat. See what heats and where. Do the opposite. If there is only a single motorised valve is it 2 or 3 port? You mention a humongous tank, I'm guessing this more than a HW cylinder, it may be a thermal store which can give heat to to the rads as well as hot water. No need to worry about this yet. If you can heat two areas independently with the current stats you have 2 true zones. A ir B or both It may be that you have a system where you can turn off just one zone, heating A or both but not B on its own. The kitchen stat might control the firing and timer, the landing stat just the zone upstairs when the kitchen timer is on

Thanks again for the info.

So you reckon the TP5 downstairs is controlling the timing of the system to come on and switch off as well as the temperature downstairs? Makes sense if it does as I found it odd that there was no timer to control switching the heating on and off.

Haven't moved in yet but hoping to be in next week so only got heating oil ordered yesterday. I will spend a bit of time experimenting with the system as you said and see what way the zones are and if they can work independently of each other.

I'll have a look at the motorised valve when I'm there this evening or tomorrow and see how many ports are coming off it and I'll check the type of tank it is too. I'm guessing the tank is a thermal store as I remember the rads being slightly warm to the touch on one of the warmer days I was doing work in the house.

I think I'll go ahead and order one of the V2's this evening and see how I fare with it as it seems like the system will benefit from it whether the zones are true zones or not.

deezell · 15-11-2017 9:01am

V2 new on Maplin UK down to £84, still £79 'used', but both now collect only. Amazon still have V2 for £129, £70 less than V3. Maybe it will drop on Black Friday to previous £100 price.

skerry · 15-11-2017 9:27am

deezell wrote: »

V2 new on Maplin UK down to £84, still £79 'used', but both now collect only. Amazon still have V2 for £129, £70 less than V3. Maybe it will drop on Black Friday to previous £100 price.

I was going to go for the new V2 but noticed they only do click and collect on it. Took the plunge on a pre-owned V2 last night as its by far the cheapest option. Hopefully have it next week and can get someone to install it for me and see how it works out.

Did a bit of research on the Danfoss TP 5 that's already in there and it seems it's able to programme on/of and temperatures also as you mentioned. Will be out in the house this evening now so will try mess around and see what way the zones are.

deezell · 15-11-2017 12:33pm

Looks like you got the last delivered one. There's one in a Slough Maplin for collect and that seems to be it.

skerry · 15-11-2017 12:57pm

deezell wrote: »

Looks like you got the last delivered one. There's one in a Slough Maplin for collect and that seems to be it.

I seen that earlier. I was about to email them to see if they could cancel the order so I could order again and avail of the £10 voucher for purchases over £80 for Black Friday deals but I saw they weren't offering delivery anymore so abandoned that plan.

Hopefully it arrives now, haven't got a dispatch mail yet.

skerry · 15-11-2017 10:59pm

deezell wrote: »

Looks like you got the last delivered one. There's one in a Slough Maplin for collect and that seems to be it.

Just got dispatch mail for Tado there so its on the way, happy days.

Might be back for more advice once it arrives. Not sure to get an electrician to install or to chance it myself.

Hopefully it's a straightforward swap-out with the Danfloss TP5 thats in there at the moment.

deezell · 16-11-2017 12:00am

skerry wrote: »

Just got dispatch mail for Tado there so its on the way, happy days....
Hopefully it's a straightforward swap-out with the Danfloss TP5 thats in there at the moment.

TP5 is a 2 wire connection, Common and N/O wires, straight swap to the tado. Just make sure to knock off boiler mains as more than likely there's 220v on one wire. If you can use a phase tester screwdriver you'll be ok. Careful now as Fr. Dougal would say.

Home heating automation

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