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Limerick-Foynes Rail Line
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It won't all be for Ireland apparently. Foynes according to the report is a really deep dock capable of ships that other countries further into Europe can't take so I reckon the idea would be to dock in Foynes, transport the cargo by road and rail to Rosslare and Dublin and let smaller ships continue on onto the continent.
The biggest constraints are the panama and suez canals, anything that can fit through these can fit into Rotterdam, Le Harve, Felixstowe, Southampton, Hamburg etc. already.
Ship from China to Foynes, train to Rosslare, ship to France, train up to Rotterdam or Germany = Stupidest idea ever.0 -
You'd have to be able to run trains directly onto the continent through the UK, which is a great idea but firstly, there's a bit missing and secondly, our trains are the wrong size.0
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yep, they can forget continental traffic, IF a deep water port was needed on the west Coast of Europe, Milford Haven could take whatever they could throw at it AND is rail linked. They've never done that so I imagine that's because it's a non-starter.0
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They only thing that may work would be if those larger vessels were to use Foynes to drop off their Ireland bound cargo en-route to Europe.0
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flyingsnail wrote: »They only thing that may work would be if those larger vessels were to use Foynes to drop off their Ireland bound cargo en-route to Europe.
but would that amount justify the massive investment outlined? And would the massive ships that improvements to the Panama Canal implies really divert to a port half way up the west of Ireland to drop off just a few containers?0 -
Can you really not see why such plans are MAD?Out of curiosity how's that?
OK short version....invest billions in expanding Foynes Port....invest millions improving rail and road to Rosslare and Dublin....pay to unload ship...pay to load train/truck/....haul to east coast port.....pay to unload train/truck....load on to ship.....sail to Wales...unload and load on to train or truck....haul to destination in UK/Europe....all extra costs over just sailing the first ship to the UK or European ports in the first place. QED0 -
That is why I said it may work. It would entirely depend on what level of traffic they could produce.but would that amount justify the massive investment outlined? And would the massive ships that improvements to the Panama Canal implies really divert to a port half way up the west of Ireland to drop off just a few containers?0 -
It won't all be for Ireland apparently. Foynes according to the report is a really deep dock capable of ships that other countries further into Europe can't take so I reckon the idea would be to dock in Foynes, transport the cargo by road and rail to Rosslare and Dublin and let smaller ships continue on onto the continent.
I think people have the wrong end of the stick here. Goods bound for Ireland or perhaps UK will unload at Foynes. Goods bound for other European locations would probably be transshipped (literally) on to smaller vessels. So smaller vessels might go to Mediterranean destinations or Baltic destinations, say Italy or Sweden. This might well be as economic as unloading at Rotterdam and sending by land over the Alps.
This kind of thing happens at Singapore, which is an island.0 -
I think people have the wrong end of the stick here. Goods bound for Ireland or perhaps UK will unload at Foynes. Goods bound for other European locations would probably be transshipped (literally) on to smaller vessels. So smaller vessels might go to Mediterranean destinations or Baltic destinations, say Italy or Sweden. This might well be as economic as unloading at Rotterdam and sending by land over the Alps.
This kind of thing happens at Singapore, which is an island.
why would you need the rail line then? or the upgraded road?0 -
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Aren't the Chinese govt planning a high speed rail between Beijing and Germany(ultimately to London) that'll carry heavy freight much faster than container ships, granted they probably have less capacity than ships but a single train could probably do about 20 trips back and forth in the time it takes one ship to go from China to Rotterdam.
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2013/0211/1224329906186.html0 -
I think people have the wrong end of the stick here. Goods bound for Ireland or perhaps UK will unload at Foynes. Goods bound for other European locations would probably be transshipped (literally) on to smaller vessels. So smaller vessels might go to Mediterranean destinations or Baltic destinations, say Italy or Sweden. This might well be as economic as unloading at Rotterdam and sending by land over the Alps.
This kind of thing happens at Singapore, which is an island.
Ships to and from china already stop at Greece, Italy and Spain, so thats a dead duck.
Ships often transfer 4000 containers in one go in felixstowe, why would they unload them all in Foynes and load them back on again when could go direct in the first place?
Remember Foynes tried containers a few years ago and dropped it again pretty quick.0 -
I didn't post that as 'my idea of how it would work' I just posted my understanding of the report.
I know feck all about logistics.
The following and only the following is my opinion on the matter.
I think it makes sense to build a decent port away from major population dense areas. Look at Dublin port, they needed to bore a tunnel to the dock to stop trucks clogging up the City Centre,and that can't have been cheap to do.
In Foynes you wouldn't have such issues, population is low out there, plenty of green land to CPO and build whatever roads are needed to hook up to the M7 (my only concern with that at the minute would be the bog section of the motorway might not hold up well to an increase in heavy goods traffic.) Rail is already in place so all is needed is to modernise the lines and you're off to the east.0 -
Transport via ship is cheaper than individually by truck, so why would they dock in Foynes to transport all the goods to Dublin by truck?
That's incredibly silly.0 -
Join Date:Posts: 5745
And no one has mentioned the implications of the long term reduction in the availability of cheap oil to run these massive ships.
If the choice is to use expensive oil, or cheaper electricity from other (renewable) sources, then that will be a factor, and LONG TERM, as has been suggested by me and others, the Shannon Estuary area could become a hub for both freight and passengers IF the LONG TERM investment in high speed rail links to Europe (and beyond) were put in place.
I could spend a lot longer going into the specific details of this, but I am only going to put one more thought here.
GLOSSARY
LONG TERM. A period of time significantly in excess of the life of one government, and definitely outside of the normal thinking of most politicians, and significantly above the re-election threshold of all of the politicians
Ireland has to start working and thinking LONG TERM in terms of the position and influence that Ireland wants to have among the near neighbours of the EU, and the United States, let alone the rest of the world.
If China thinks a long distance rail link to Europe is essential to their long term growth, then maybe we should be asking if something similar may well not be needed here in Western Europe to deal with trade from the US, and other places.
Just because Ireland is a small island on the periphery of Europe, that does not mean that Ireland cannot have a significant and relevant role for much more of Europe than it has formely had. The Shannon Estuary area, which includes the Shannon Airport area, can offer a huge potential as a major hub for the time when oil is no longer as freely available as it is now. That would be for both cargo and passengers.
Some of the things needed behind this concept will require some radically different thinking about "economics", cost benefit justification, return on investment, and all the other bean counter phrases that have been used for years to kill projects.
Ireland has to have a good reason for Europe and the USA to invest here, and that has to go beyond cheap(er) labour than in other places. We HAVE to be able to offer services that either add value, or provide a service that has advantages in the LONG TERM for all of Europe.
That means looking beyond parish pump level politics, and the next election, or three, and making decisions that really ARE in the interest of the PEOPLE of Ireland, not just the politicians and developers, which is all we saw for the last 10 years.
The investment required to make a project of this scale work is indeed massive, but if properly planned, prepared, managed and implemented, it could well provide the lift that is required to get the economy moving again. That alone has to be a good reason to consider a project of this nature, something of this magnitude is required to get the country moving again.Shore, if it was easy, everybody would be doin it.😁
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so swap expensive oil used to power cheaper ships and instead use electric railways powered by electricity produced by even more expensive oil and gas and coal.Irish Steve wrote: »And no one has mentioned the implications of the long term reduction in the availability of cheap oil to run these massive ships.
If the choice is to use expensive oil, or cheaper electricity from other (renewable) sources, then that will be a factor, and LONG TERM, as has been suggested by me and others, the Shannon Estuary area could become a hub for both freight and passengers IF the LONG TERM investment in high speed rail links to Europe (and beyond) were put in place.
I could spend a lot longer going into the specific details of this, but I am only going to put one more thought here.
GLOSSARY
LONG TERM. A period of time significantly in excess of the life of one government, and definitely outside of the normal thinking of most politicians, and significantly above the re-election threshold of all of the politicians
Ireland has to start working and thinking LONG TERM in terms of the position and influence that Ireland wants to have among the near neighbours of the EU, and the United States, let alone the rest of the world.
If China thinks a long distance rail link to Europe is essential to their long term growth, then maybe we should be asking if something similar may well not be needed here in Western Europe to deal with trade from the US, and other places.
Just because Ireland is a small island on the periphery of Europe, that does not mean that Ireland cannot have a significant and relevant role for much more of Europe than it has formely had. The Shannon Estuary area, which includes the Shannon Airport area, can offer a huge potential as a major hub for the time when oil is no longer as freely available as it is now. That would be for both cargo and passengers.
Some of the things needed behind this concept will require some radically different thinking about "economics", cost benefit justification, return on investment, and all the other bean counter phrases that have been used for years to kill projects.
Ireland has to have a good reason for Europe and the USA to invest here, and that has to go beyond cheap(er) labour than in other places. We HAVE to be able to offer services that either add value, or provide a service that has advantages in the LONG TERM for all of Europe.
That means looking beyond parish pump level politics, and the next election, or three, and making decisions that really ARE in the interest of the PEOPLE of Ireland, not just the politicians and developers, which is all we saw for the last 10 years.
The investment required to make a project of this scale work is indeed massive, but if properly planned, prepared, managed and implemented, it could well provide the lift that is required to get the economy moving again. That alone has to be a good reason to consider a project of this nature, something of this magnitude is required to get the country moving again.0 -
Perhaps one should look into the economics of container transport before talking about LONG TERM and rising oil costs.
Indeed, perhaps one should look into the efficiency improvements in newer container ships coming online in the next few years before talking about LONG TERM.0 -
Those huge container ships use less fuel per container than previous ships,(if running fully loaded), tend to be slower too as this uses less fuel,
Can't see these vast point to point ships running Ireland to the far east , especially as many continental and British ports are already upgrading to cope with post Panamax vesselsSlava ukraini 🇺🇦
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Markcheese wrote: »Those huge container ships use less fuel per container than previous ships,(if running fully loaded), tend to be slower too as this uses less fuel,
Can't see these vast point to point ships running Ireland to the far east , especially as many continental and British ports are already upgrading to cope with post Panamax vessels
Yes I agree. In any Port situation whether from the US or Via Panama or whatever, it would obviously be cheaper to bypass Ireland. The Uk already has it's infrastructure in place to the Continent and a port in West Wales (milford Haven already can take ULCCs I think and they are big) would beat Foynes any day.0 -
Join Date:Posts: 5745
Clearly wasting my time trying to find projects that might inject something useful into the irish Economy, the west clearly doesn't want to do anything that might upset the nice peaceful status of their quiet backwater.
Not my problem,. but when the oil does become really scarce, and the rest of the world is travelling on Electric trains powered by things like Tidal, wind and ( like it or not) Nuclear, the west can carry on in its isolation.
A project in America is exploring the feasibility of a trans atlantic tunnel that would travel in a vacuum at unimaginable speeds by present standards, using a version of contactless maglev propulsion. That's real long term thinking, what I was proposing in comparison is next week thinking, but it's still too hard for too many people.
Maybe that's why the country is in the state it is, too many beancounter mentalities in places to kill anything that's remotely "risky".
Even things like transatlantic travel for passengers are going to become harder than they are now, for the same reasons, oil is not an infinite resource, and we're not seeing significantly available viable alternatives to oil that don't threaten food production and the like. High speed rail to the Shannon Estuary area bringing and taking freight and passengers by cheaper means than oil powered aircraft or ships, then use the oil where there is no viable alternative for now. Social conscience? Not really, more a case of recognising that the present profligate waste of energy resources is not sustainable.Shore, if it was easy, everybody would be doin it.😁
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OK so one day this tunnel may be feasible, but even when it is, it wont be coming to Ireland. What would be the point?
Ships are cheaper and more energy efficent than trains....do you not think a tidal or wave powered ship might be less pie-in-the-sky than a vacuum powered trans-atlantic tunnel? Certainly a Nuclear Powered shiops are already a reality.Nothing in this line will ever involve going via the West of Ireland though.
If you ask me, many people who suuport the Port of Foynes development do so because they want to see the rail line re-opened for no better reason than they can Phot it in action.0 -
I have another idea, in fact I have 2. We should drill a hole through the earth from Ireland and out at china. We can drop containers through it.
Then I got an even better idea, we can catapult them express mail through it and use spirit of Ireland turbines to wind up the catapults.
No less feasible than some of the plans being mooted here.0 -
1) Long term, integrated, strategic thinking is indeed a vital thing, one which Ireland completely lacks partially because we're a democracy and partially because we're an island of small minded fools.
2) We need reasonable, achievable projects which deliver real benefit, not pie-in-the sky.
A lot of people have mentioned a rail link with the UK, this is something we could in fact achieve if we put the necessary resources into it and would deliver real benefit to the economy by de-isolating us but there should be no illusions about delivering goods to our ports for transshipment. Freight is a slow, bulk operation that concentrates on the bottom line, if you can move massive amounts of freight by ship for dirt cheap then you do it, if it has to go overland, you put it on a train. Therefore if you need to ship huge amounts of freight to Europe you deliver it right into the heartland at Rotterdam and send it by rail from there. Having a rail link to Europe would largely facilitate freight coming from Europe.0 -
Join Date:Posts: 5745
a vacuum powered trans-atlantic tunnel? /QUOTE]
It might help if you read what I posted.
The trans atlantic tunnel would not be vacuum POWERED, it would run in vacuum, in order to acheive the very high speeds necessary to make it viable. The power would be electric Maglev, contactless magnetic levitation, already operating in a number of places, the new aspect is the absence of air outside the transport vehicle, in order to reduce the friction losses generated otherwise by the speeds. That's the futuristic aspect of this proposal.
How do you propose to capture wave energy on a ship that's being moved by wave energy that's opposing the energy being output by the engines.
The vast majority of nuclear ships are either military, or government operated or controlled. The chances of many civilian powered ships is not high, given the restrictions that are relevant to nuclear non proliferation.
So, regardless of the size of the ship, how do you propose to operate it if oil is not available, or is incredibly expensive to purchase?
I'm not overly bothered that Milford Haven, or Rotterdam, or other ports are upgrading to handle larger ships. A new purpose designed custom made facility will always be cheaper, more efficient and more effective than an upgrade of an old existing facility, the upgrade will always result in some compromises due to the location.
Shannon Estuary would not be a port for Ireland. It would be a port for Europe that happens to be located on the West coast of Ireland, with high speed rail links direct to Europe
Yes, it depends on the change in availability of oil, and the resulting rise in price relative to other energy sources. Based on the way oil prices have changed over my lifetime, and the lack of discovery of new resources, we have to recognise that oil is finite, and burning it for energy is a poor use of the product, as a planet, we have to find better ways of producing energy for transportation. That may be space based solar panels, or new concepts of nuclear that come out of Cern, or better use of wind wave and tidal, or concepts of all of these,
There are new concepts being introduced to charge electric buses using current loops in the ground while they are on the move, or standing at stops. Is it so hard for people to see than the shortest sea crossing will be the most economic, and using (comparatively by that time) cheaper rail for onward distribution will be a more acceptable long term plan.
If oil is no longer cheaper than using alternatives, and as I mentioned yesterday, China sees their route to Europe as being via high speed rail, then maybe we should be looking a lot more aggressively at what opportunities would open up for Ireland in that changed environment. If the cheapest route to Europe from the USA is via the west coast of Ireland, for freight or passengers, then maybe we should be preparing for that time.
It may not last for a long time, but there was a time when Shannon was fundamental to travelling across to the USA because the aircraft of the time could not get to the USA from anywhere else.
The problem with Shannon was that for a long time, people would not recognise that times had moved on, and things like the Shannon stop over distorted the realities until the government were forced to remove it. If Shannon airport was being built today, if it could even be justified, it would be nothing like the size that it is, and would have nothing like the facilities that it does, it would be similar in size and facilities to Kerry, or Knock. That may not be too popular an opinion, but on the basis of traffic levels, that's the reality.
So, having said that, Shannon airport is there, and can handle aircraft that are way larger than the area justifies. So, let's find ways of using what's there that are attractive to users across Europe. The Shannon Estuary could become the harbour of choice for freight in 20 to 30 years time if the right decisions are made, and the right europe wide facilities are put into place.
That will be because trains will be the method of choice for short and medium haul passenger and freight, and air will be the choice for cross ocean passengers, and urgent freight, with ships being the choice for bulk freight. Things like flying freight from the USA to Europe to then send things back to the UK or Ireland will no longer happen, due to the costs.
Make no mistake about it, unless there is a miracle in the next few years in energy production, things like a weekend flight to Spain with Ryanair will become a weekend train to Spain, the journey times will be longer, but not in the way they are now, train speeds will have increased to make them a viable alternative to air transport.
Ireland can be a part of the new world, or can ignore the changes to come, and live on the periphery of it all, but the accident of geography could give Ireland an opportunity to be much more closely linked to Europe than it has ever been before, and the advantages from that would be very much in Ireland's long term interests, as it would reduce ireland's isolation. That should be good for everyone.
That's why I've added to the Foynes thread. The vision needs to be much larger and longer term than it is right now, but at least there is a vision, rather than a head in the sand attitude that is only negative about the potential for Ireland in the long term.
If Ireland wants to be, Ireland can be more than the agricultural supplier to Europe, we can also be a pivotal part of the new transport structure that will develop as the usage of oil changes.Shore, if it was easy, everybody would be doin it.😁
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rainbowdash wrote: »I have another idea, in fact I have 2. We should drill a hole through the earth from Ireland and out at china. We can drop containers through it.
Then I got an even better idea, we can catapult them express mail through it and use spirit of Ireland turbines to wind up the catapults.
No less feasible than some of the plans being mooted here.
what you're proposing is a gravity train - doesn't need any external power source, clearly the future of intercontinental travel!0 -
Irish Steve wrote: »
it's total pie in the sky Star Trek fantasy. If such technology exists at some stage why would it be routed via Ireland. ? It just doesn't make any sense to do that. We ALL know that!a vacuum powered trans-atlantic tunnel? /QUOTE]
It might help if you read what I posted.
The trans atlantic tunnel would not be vacuum POWERED, it would run in vacuum, in order to acheive the very high speeds necessary to make it viable. The power would be electric Maglev, contactless magnetic levitation, already operating in a number of places, the new aspect is the absence of air outside the transport vehicle, in order to reduce the friction losses generated otherwise by the speeds. That's the futuristic aspect of this proposal.
How do you propose to capture wave energy on a ship that's being moved by wave energy that's opposing the energy being output by the engines.
The vast majority of nuclear ships are either military, or government operated or controlled. The chances of many civilian powered ships is not high, given the restrictions that are relevant to nuclear non proliferation.
So, regardless of the size of the ship, how do you propose to operate it if oil is not available, or is incredibly expensive to purchase?
I'm not overly bothered that Milford Haven, or Rotterdam, or other ports are upgrading to handle larger ships. A new purpose designed custom made facility will always be cheaper, more efficient and more effective than an upgrade of an old existing facility, the upgrade will always result in some compromises due to the location.
Shannon Estuary would not be a port for Ireland. It would be a port for Europe that happens to be located on the West coast of Ireland, with high speed rail links direct to Europe
Yes, it depends on the change in availability of oil, and the resulting rise in price relative to other energy sources. Based on the way oil prices have changed over my lifetime, and the lack of discovery of new resources, we have to recognise that oil is finite, and burning it for energy is a poor use of the product, as a planet, we have to find better ways of producing energy for transportation. That may be space based solar panels, or new concepts of nuclear that come out of Cern, or better use of wind wave and tidal, or concepts of all of these,
There are new concepts being introduced to charge electric buses using current loops in the ground while they are on the move, or standing at stops. Is it so hard for people to see than the shortest sea crossing will be the most economic, and using (comparatively by that time) cheaper rail for onward distribution will be a more acceptable long term plan.
If oil is no longer cheaper than using alternatives, and as I mentioned yesterday, China sees their route to Europe as being via high speed rail, then maybe we should be looking a lot more aggressively at what opportunities would open up for Ireland in that changed environment. If the cheapest route to Europe from the USA is via the west coast of Ireland, for freight or passengers, then maybe we should be preparing for that time.
It may not last for a long time, but there was a time when Shannon was fundamental to travelling across to the USA because the aircraft of the time could not get to the USA from anywhere else.
The problem with Shannon was that for a long time, people would not recognise that times had moved on, and things like the Shannon stop over distorted the realities until the government were forced to remove it. If Shannon airport was being built today, if it could even be justified, it would be nothing like the size that it is, and would have nothing like the facilities that it does, it would be similar in size and facilities to Kerry, or Knock. That may not be too popular an opinion, but on the basis of traffic levels, that's the reality.
So, having said that, Shannon airport is there, and can handle aircraft that are way larger than the area justifies. So, let's find ways of using what's there that are attractive to users across Europe. The Shannon Estuary could become the harbour of choice for freight in 20 to 30 years time if the right decisions are made, and the right europe wide facilities are put into place.
That will be because trains will be the method of choice for short and medium haul passenger and freight, and air will be the choice for cross ocean passengers, and urgent freight, with ships being the choice for bulk freight. Things like flying freight from the USA to Europe to then send things back to the UK or Ireland will no longer happen, due to the costs.
Make no mistake about it, unless there is a miracle in the next few years in energy production, things like a weekend flight to Spain with Ryanair will become a weekend train to Spain, the journey times will be longer, but not in the way they are now, train speeds will have increased to make them a viable alternative to air transport.
Ireland can be a part of the new world, or can ignore the changes to come, and live on the periphery of it all, but the accident of geography could give Ireland an opportunity to be much more closely linked to Europe than it has ever been before, and the advantages from that would be very much in Ireland's long term interests, as it would reduce ireland's isolation. That should be good for everyone.
That's why I've added to the Foynes thread. The vision needs to be much larger and longer term than it is right now, but at least there is a vision, rather than a head in the sand attitude that is only negative about the potential for Ireland in the long term.
If Ireland wants to be, Ireland can be more than the agricultural supplier to Europe, we can also be a pivotal part of the new transport structure that will develop as the usage of oil changes.0 -
Join Date:Posts: 5745
it's total pie in the sky Star Trek fantasy. If such technology exists at some stage why would it be routed via Ireland. ? It just doesn't make any sense to do that. We ALL know that!
I never said the ultra high speed rail would link to or through Ireland, the plan for that proposed it would route from New York to London. I would agree, the chances of that type of system coming to Ireland is low, but that is still not what I am saying.
This sort of transport is probably 100 years in to the future, as there are a considerable number of complex technical issues to resolve, but I have no doubt that in that time scale, things WILL change, when the Wright Brothers made their first flight, no one expected that within 100 years, aircraft longer than that flight and capable of carrying over 500 passengers would be capable of flying half way round the world non stop. The engines are very different, much more powerful, and efficient, and the electronics are way beyond anything that could have been imagined 100 years ago. What has not change however is the dependence on oil based fuel, and that is the underlying and imovable problem that has to be resolved.
Between now and then, and the ultra high speed service is aimed primarily at passenger service, due to the eventual cost of oil, as a result of availability, the movement of goods will transfer from water to rail, maybe not rail as we know it now, and certainly not rail as we know it in Ireland.
When that happens, to minimise the use of oil, water transport will only be used for the shortest possible distance, in that scenario, Ireland IS well placed to provide the hub that will transfer the bulk containers from ship to rail for onward distribution to where ever they are going in Europe.
There will also be air transport, but not as we know it now, unless a new and reliable energy source of comparable power content to oil is found, and that source cannot impact on food production across the planet, for obvious reasons. So far, it's not happened, trials of some ideas have been made, but right now, the alternatives to Jet Fuel are not as powerful as Jet fuel, and impact on food production, or suffer from other limitations, and have a significant oil impact or content in their production.
So, New Higher speed rail direct from London, or Paris, or Brussels, or Amsterdam, to West Ireland, and then air to Boston, or somewhere in that area, the shortest route possible by air, and rail the other side.
It will not be popular, and will be resisted by many governments, but unless they are prepared to make massive sacrifices, that is the way it will end up going, unless a viable and high volume alternative to oil is found, and found relatively soon. I have also seen discussions about a rail link from Asia to the west coast of the USA, going via Russia and Alaska, as the distance between the 2 is relatively small. Massive international costs for all concerned, but it is being looked at very seriously, for the same reasons, rail will still be viable.
Maybe local manufacturing will become more common again, with smaller plants making products closer to the consumer, but there are certain raw materials like Aluminium ore, and other fundamentals that do not occur in every country, so they are still going to be shipped either as raw materials or as finished products to countries that need them. There will still need to be movement of foods such as grain that grow in some parts of the world but not others,
We are also going to have to find alternative ways to heat houses, among other things, again, oil and gas will be too valuable to be used for something so mundane in the global scale of things. Solar, wind, tide, geothermal, all of them are going to have to play their part, even nuclear is not the long term answer, as radioactive fuel is hard to find initially, and has long term issues that cannot be ignored.
This is not Star Trek, this is the reality of some of the changes that will happen with the reduction in the availability of oil, and gas, the present world demands are not sustainable long term, so some very dramatic and socially significant changes will have to happen.
Travel in Ireland will be much more rail based, I can see a time when most of the motorways will have rail tracks laid in what is now the "fast" lane, and trains will move goods that are moved by truck at the moment, because trucks will no longer be an appropriate use of oil, local distribution will then be made by electric powered vehicles at a local level.
I'm not a Green, far from it, I have very little time for their politics, as they simply don't have the vision to change things, most of the time, all they want is more taxes and to not do much other than discourage travel, especially long haul travel.
What I do know is that people are creative and inventive, and ways to overcome the long term issues will be found, I am saying that the European community needs to be looking at the way they want the community to develop, and plan accordingly.
That's so far beyond parish pump politics, brown envelopes and so much else that is to be despised it's not even funny, and a lot of what I am talking about is way beyond most politicians radar, they only ever are looking at the implications of their actions in terms of the next election, but we owe it to our grandchildren to leave them a world they can live in, some of the social changes that are going to have to happen over the next 100 years need to start happening now, as they will take that 100 years to come to full completion.
Ireland will be part of that, if we have any sense.Shore, if it was easy, everybody would be doin it.😁
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Christ , if it keeps going like this it'll take 100 years to read the posts on this thread,
Anywho , foynes rail-link ??
What's left of it ? Would it be feasible in an Irish context for bulk transport, I assume ore ?? What does foynes currently handle any way , grain, bauxite , coal ?
I guess there's a reason the rail link was pulled in the first place.. can't see current plans changing that ....Slava ukraini 🇺🇦
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the context of the re-opening plan is a multiple billion re-development. That would imply a lot more than the new Ore flow that has been discussed0
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An interviewee on the radio recently casually mentioned this line was to be re-opened as part of greater discussion on the western rail corridor, but I can't find any official announcement. Has there been anymore developments or was the interviewee stating speculation as fact?0
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