How relevant to you is the controversy over feminism?

The Bill will further strengthen existing powers to constrain, restraint and criminalise those accused of domestic abuse. The escalating sequence of protection notices, protection orders and non-molestation orders can see a man ejected from his home with immediate effect and kept out of it without limit. The new Bill will make breaching the terms of a protection notice or protection order a criminal offence. These arrangements mean that a man may be formally branded a criminal, with a criminal record, and imprisoned, without ever facing trial or any other meaningful test of the accusations against him.

That's insane.

Sleepy wrote: »

Is it an issue that a woman can't venture anywhere she likes at any time of night and in any state of inebriation? Yes, being honest it is. I'd argue for anyone not forced to live in such areas it's a relatively minor one as such places are usually widely known and easily avoided but it's an issue of law and order. It's only an issue of gender if one is only concerned for the wellbeing of women (or have drunk the feminist koolaid that it's worse to be raped than murdered).

Is it though? Simple reality is that there are always going to be dodgy areas, and regardless of which gender is involved, to remain safe means taking precautions, or avoiding the area entirely. In every city, I have lived in, there have been areas which needed to be avoided. Even with towns, if not areas, there were certain times which were more risky than others.

It's not as if this is anything new. Being drunk places you at risk. Being female in certain areas places you at risk. Flirting with strangers places you at risk. It "shouldn't", but it does. That's reality... and has always been a reality.

The idea that women should be able to go anywhere and do anything there while drunk, ignores that men have always needed to be careful of what they do and where. Those who didn't ended up in trouble. Men getting drunk alone, walking around at night, would often have trouble. It's not like something major has changed based on genders.

Added to this though, is the nature and amount of crime has shifted over the last few decades. I can remember when my hometown (even with all it's problems) was relatively safe. Rape was extremely rare. Murder was very rare. Beatings happened a few times a year, but still not common. Nowadays, I wouldn't walk around my hometown at night alone, and even with others, I'd be careful.

I think the difference is that men accept that their environment contains risk, and danger. They rely on the law to mitigate that risk, but know that it's not going to disappear. Whereas many women seem to believe that those risks don't apply to them. I suspect it's due to how much they were protected in a traditional society, but with traditional society declining, towards more freedoms, they've retained the belief that they're still a protected group. Which is why when something negative happens it's much worse than when it happens to a male.

Well.. I do think it is an issue of gender, because of the expectation that women should be safer than men, while engaging in activities that are riskier than what men do.

Look. By the time men leave university, they know how to measure the risk to themselves from other men. We know how our behavior impacts on others, and there's a... measured risk when we want to insult or tweak others noses. We know that behavior often leads to violence, in one form or another, and we accept that. We either choose to behave that way or not. I chose not to, because my body is not built particularly well for fighting. Others I know who are more naturally suited, have adapted their way of life to include more tests of strength, willpower or whatever.

The problem is when we look at women in a modern setting. They have the freedom to do whatever they wish, and now, they're seeking to absolve themselves of the responsibility for their behavior. If you, as a woman, flirt with a number of strangers, leading them on, and then, insult them while leaving, what do you think is going to happen? You're going to be encouraging others towards anger, bitterness, etc, while relying on social norms to protect you. It's similar to how guys will insult or tweak others noses, whereas we're aware of the potential for violence, or negative reactions... women are being encouraged to believe that those negatives shouldn't ever manifest.

Even worse, consider the range of people who don't conform to social norms. We've had twenty-thirty years of people being encouraged to believe that being a freak is cool. That society's laws/expectations don't apply to them. That it's right to "be yourself" and put it to "the man". Disregard societys conditioning and be something else. Is it any surprise that some men will see that as permission to throw off the shackles that sought to prevent him towards violence, rape, or abuse?

There is such limited expectations surrounding the changes that various movements have encouraged within society. It's good "for some" to break from social norms... but others shouldn't, and more importantly, shouldn't do it in a way that's not approved by the first group.

Just as this belief that women should be able to act without consequence. If a woman is drunk, alone, and stumbling around with her tits hanging out, and worse yet, in a dodgy area (or time), shouldn't we, as a society, be calling this behavior out as being self-destructive? Instead, we're telling everyone that this should be the new social norm.. and "men" will magically all accept that, and respect it?

Meh. I swear that the retards have taken control of the circus, because this movement has become incredibly foolish.

Sleepy wrote: »

Oh, I think the feminist lobby are trying (and are arguably succeeding) to make it a gender issue along the very lines you highlight. I disagree with them: the real world is the real world regardless of whether you're a man or a woman. It's not always a nice place and there are people who will do you harm whether you've provoked them or not.

Those kind of feminists always remind me of the quip Jack Nicholson's character (a novelist) tells in "As Good as It Gets" when asked how he writes women so well: “I think of a man and I take away reason and accountability”. At the time, the joke was meant to portray his character as sexist. Nowadays? I think there's a growing number who believe this is the way they should be able to live their lives: free from being held accountable for their actions.

Pretty much. Have you had a look at the thread on "Almost all young women in the UK have been sexually harassed [MOD WARNING 1st POST]"?

It's a broad range of posters bending over backwards to excuse women from the behavior they engage in, while accusing others of victim blaming, and 'not listening" to women. It's utterly bizarre. They're so disconnected from reality, that they think by blaming men for everything, this is going to get better... No chance of them acknowledging the behavior of women as being a major factor in how men behave around them.

Last year, just before I returned to Ireland, I went out to the bar with a group of women, all friends who had boyfriends. A girls night out with me to drive them home later. Grand. They dressed up in style, and then proceeded throughout the night to flirt with every guy they encountered. Touching arms, legs, etc. Suggestive language, we all know the score. And as each guy thought he was "in", they shot him down, with a laugh among the group. It was predatory... but in their eyes, it was harmless fun. Although, I spoke to a few of the guys, trying to downplay their behavior, and more than a few of them were quite angry or even hurt by their behavior. Ahh but it was harmless... they were just lucky they didn't meet anyone dodgy, and that I was there to play fireman.

If a guy was to behave as they did, (which is unlikely considering the society we live in), he's be considered scum. And rightly so.. because it's mean spirited behavior, showing an ignorance for the harm that you can do to others.. but since women are supposedly sensitive, it means so much more when a guy misleads them..

I dunno. I'm actually a bit worried about the state of western culture regarding gender. Nobody wants to acknowledge the society that has been allowed to develop. Women are sex symbols. Everywhere you look there are images of sexiness in one form or another. The internet provides the avenue of instagram babes, camgirls, etc all presenting services for men (and women), with the models earning good money. We encourage our women to dress however they wish, and since they're apparently allowed to dress as provocative as they wish (social norms have declined about what's too flashy or sexy in public), many women reinforce the sexual image. Oh, sure women dress for themselves, but the reality is that perception of those watching, rules.

I think society is setting women up for a world of hurt. Not simply from "men" but from other women, in general. There are no social norms to restrict their behavior anymore, since anything that could do that is sexist.

Rant over.

Nokotan wrote: »

https://www.oxfamireland.org/provingit/issues-we-work-on

Women's Rights is included in their Issues We Work On section of their website so it appears they've moved past just beating poverty. I would think that beating poverty is a pretty big goal and it might be worth focusing on that.

Well, considering the representation of males as homeless, or the extreme end of poverty, you'd think they'd be placing the needs of males as being their priority. It's not as if there aren't dozens or more organisations aimed at helping women... oh no.. we need another, originally for both genders, decide to give priority to women in allocating their resources.

Deleted User wrote: »

Well.. I do think it is an issue of gender, because of the expectation that women should be safer than men, while engaging in activities that are riskier than what men do.

Look. By the time men leave university, they know how to measure the risk to themselves from other men. We know how our behavior impacts on others, and there's a... measured risk when we want to insult or tweak others noses. We know that behavior often leads to violence, in one form or another, and we accept that. We either choose to behave that way or not. I chose not to, because my body is not built particularly well for fighting. Others I know who are more naturally suited, have adapted their way of life to include more tests of strength, willpower or whatever.

The problem is when we look at women in a modern setting. They have the freedom to do whatever they wish, and now, they're seeking to absolve themselves of the responsibility for their behavior. If you, as a woman, flirt with a number of strangers, leading them on, and then, insult them while leaving, what do you think is going to happen? You're going to be encouraging others towards anger, bitterness, etc, while relying on social norms to protect you. It's similar to how guys will insult or tweak others noses, whereas we're aware of the potential for violence, or negative reactions... women are being encouraged to believe that those negatives shouldn't ever manifest.

Even worse, consider the range of people who don't conform to social norms. We've had twenty-thirty years of people being encouraged to believe that being a freak is cool. That society's laws/expectations don't apply to them. That it's right to "be yourself" and put it to "the man". Disregard societys conditioning and be something else. Is it any surprise that some men will see that as permission to throw off the shackles that sought to prevent him towards violence, rape, or abuse?

There is such limited expectations surrounding the changes that various movements have encouraged within society. It's good "for some" to break from social norms... but others shouldn't, and more importantly, shouldn't do it in a way that's not approved by the first group.

Just as this belief that women should be able to act without consequence. If a woman is drunk, alone, and stumbling around with her tits hanging out, and worse yet, in a dodgy area (or time), shouldn't we, as a society, be calling this behavior out as being self-destructive? Instead, we're telling everyone that this should be the new social norm.. and "men" will magically all accept that, and respect it?

Meh. I swear that the retards have taken control of the circus, because this movement has become incredibly foolish.

I've read this paragraph a few times. What are you talking about

Define "being a freak". How is it being encouraged in our society. Is there any data to suggest "being a freak" over the last 20-30 years has lead to higher incidence of violent crimes. The last 20-30 years starts with the 90's. The first thing that comes to mind with 90's culture was Britney Spears and boybands. How does "being a freak" lead to rape. That leap is enormous. You seem to live in an alternate reality to me. I literally don't know where you're coming up with this.