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02-02-2019, 21:09   #1
AllForIt
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Pool: New Rules, Old Rules

After a long time of not playing pool in pubs I've gotten back into it of late.

I'm quite surprised by the interest in pool in my local town. I have found out recently to my surprise, there are leagues going on etc and quite a few pubs with pool tables kept to a high standard with good pub cues as well. Last I knew pool had died off but not so. A resurgence perhaps.

Anyway I have noticed there is such a thing as New Rules. As far as I understand New Rules say than when you pot a ball you have to hit a cushion with the cue ball after you pot a ball otherwise that's a foul.

I find this New Rule thing to be completely absurd. Someone is passing told me it was to stop ppl snookering but I don't quite get what this means. It just seems wrong in so my ways like for example if your dead straight on the object ball and to get position you need to stop the white dead at contact, you can't play that shot. The New Rule seems to me to go against break building if you could call it that in Pool.

I'm not quite sure if my understanding of New Rules is complete. Perhaps there is more too it that I outlined but I haven't been able to find anything more about this online so maybe someone in the know here could help.
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03-02-2019, 10:47   #2
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Originally Posted by AllForIt View Post
After a long time of not playing pool in pubs I've gotten back into it of late.

I'm quite surprised by the interest in pool in my local town. I have found out recently to my surprise, there are leagues going on etc and quite a few pubs with pool tables kept to a high standard with good pub cues as well. Last I knew pool had died off but not so. A resurgence perhaps.

Anyway I have noticed there is such a thing as New Rules. As far as I understand New Rules say than when you pot a ball you have to hit a cushion with the cue ball after you pot a ball otherwise that's a foul.

I find this New Rule thing to be completely absurd. Someone is passing told me it was to stop ppl snookering but I don't quite get what this means. It just seems wrong in so my ways like for example if your dead straight on the object ball and to get position you need to stop the white dead at contact, you can't play that shot. The New Rule seems to me to go against break building if you could call it that in Pool.

I'm not quite sure if my understanding of New Rules is complete. Perhaps there is more too it that I outlined but I haven't been able to find anything more about this online so maybe someone in the know here could help.
I haven’t played pool in the bones of a decade but my understanding of that rule is that it applies only when not potting a ball...
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04-02-2019, 16:53   #3
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Pretty sure the rule is a ball must make contact with a cushion after impact or successfully pot.
Depends on the rule set your playing here is two sets of rules both cover the scenario you are talking about but it's not the white ball specifically that needs to hit the rail.

http://www.epa.org.uk/images/rules/W...les%202015.pdf

http://blackballinternational.com/wp...ball-Rules.pdf
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04-02-2019, 23:11   #4
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If I’m reading it correctly sounds like the same rule that is in place in the snooker shootout. If a ball doesn’t strike a cushion then it’s deemed a foul with ball in hand. The exception is when a ball is potted. That’s what it sounds like anyway.
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18-02-2019, 22:57   #5
AllForIt
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Originally Posted by cintec View Post
Pretty sure the rule is a ball must make contact with a cushion after impact or successfully pot.
Depends on the rule set your playing here is two sets of rules both cover the scenario you are talking about but it's not the white ball specifically that needs to hit the rail.

http://www.epa.org.uk/images/rules/W...les%202015.pdf

http://blackballinternational.com/wp...ball-Rules.pdf
Hi yes I got some clarification to this in the pub the other day and you are correct.

The reason for my confusion is that the rules were described to me as 'new rules' where the correct term is "World Rules" which is why when I searched for 'new rules' online it didn't yield any results.

I notice there are some other changes too for example there is no D in baulk on some tables, just a baulk line where the white can placed anywhere behind it after a foul.

But yeah, the rules are not as bad as I initially understood. Either the object or the cue ball must touch a cushion, not the cue ball every time which was wrongly explained to me or I simply misunderstood. This apparently stops ppl rolling up behind a ball to snooker (as that would be a foul now) and makes that kind of defensive play in order to gain 2 shots more difficult. Good idea really cause those types of players who constantly snooker are very irritating.
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18-02-2019, 23:08   #6
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Originally Posted by AllForIt View Post
Either the object or the cue ball must touch a cushion, not the cue ball every time which was wrongly explained to me or I simply misunderstood. This apparently stops ppl rolling up behind a ball to snooker (as that would be a foul now) and makes that kind of defensive play in order to gain 2 shots more difficult. Good idea really cause those types of players who constantly snooker are very irritating.
So you can't just gently roll the cue ball up behind (and touch) your own ball in order to snooker your opponent but you can still play the cue ball off a cushion to essentially make the same shot and snooker your opponent?

If true I guess the objective of the rule change is to make snookering more difficult in order to promote quicker gameplay and/or reward more positive gameplay whilst retaining the ability to snooker but only through the execution of higher skilled shot making?
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18-02-2019, 23:14   #7
 
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I haven't played pub pool in a long time but we had some mental rules, the worst being no back table on the black. So opponent pots the white, I still have red or yellow left I can shoot back table from the D, if I'm on the black I can only shoot down the table from the D, or sidewards if possible.

I will never understand the one shot on the black rule when an opponent fouls. Why one shot!? They foul, you should have the same advantage you've had throughout the rest of the game!
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18-02-2019, 23:24   #8
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So you can't just gently roll the cue ball up behind (and touch) your own ball in order to snooker your opponent but you can still play the cue ball off a cushion to essentially make the same shot and snooker your opponent?
Yes, exactly. You can still snooker but you'd have to hit a cushion with the white first which would be a more difficult shot than a simple roll up.

Edit: Joe points out below that hitting off a cushion first isn't valid either. The white has to hit a cushion after it has struck your object ball, not before.

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If true I guess the objective of the rule change is to make snookering more difficult in order to promote quicker gameplay and/or reward more positive gameplay whilst retaining the ability to snooker but only through the execution of higher skilled shot making?
Yes in the current couple of pups I play in all the players are quite good and would never play a snooker unless it really was the only option, if there was no pot on or chance of a double. In other venues I've played in in the past where there were more random players some would just snooker you to death to win cause they weren't capable potters, so those types are screwed with new rules.

Last edited by AllForIt; 18-02-2019 at 23:57.
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18-02-2019, 23:41   #9
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Originally Posted by Je_suis_Jean View Post
So you can't just gently roll the cue ball up behind (and touch) your own ball in order to snooker your opponent but you can still play the cue ball off a cushion to essentially make the same shot and snooker your opponent?

If true I guess the objective of the rule change is to make snookering more difficult in order to promote quicker gameplay and/or reward more positive gameplay whilst retaining the ability to snooker but only through the execution of higher skilled shot making?
That shot you describe would still be called a foul. The cue ball must first make contact with the object ball and then either strike a cushion or fall into a pocket. No expert on pool rules, mind, but that’s how ive always understood it anyway.
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19-02-2019, 08:41   #10
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Yes, exactly. You can still snooker but you'd have to hit a cushion with the white first which would be a more difficult shot than a simple roll up.

Edit: Joe points out below that hitting off a cushion first isn't valid either. The white has to hit a cushion after it has struck your object ball, not before.



Yes in the current couple of pups I play in all the players are quite good and would never play a snooker unless it really was the only option, if there was no pot on or chance of a double. In other venues I've played in in the past where there were more random players some would just snooker you to death to win cause they weren't capable potters, so those types are screwed with new rules.
It's 20 years since I used to play a bit so things have obviously changed quite a lot. When we played competitions games could be quite chess like in that having a good safety game was seen as an equally important skill to an ability to pot so games could take some time as the players played a bit of cat and mouse with each other. If a pot wasn't on or you wanted to develop a ball into a more playable position you could opt to snooker your opponent in order to win two shots which, assuming you were playing the "carry" rule generally meant you should have a decent chance of finishing the game.

I guess the changes are encouraged to distinguish pool as primarily a rapid fire potting and positioning game which is as unrelated to snooker as possible.

I think I'd miss the old drawn out crafty style games though, particularly with auld lads who may not have the potting skills any more but were often demons at safety having grown up playing billards and could grind you down until out of frustration you played a stupid shot giving them two shots and the game!!

So under the new rules if I have a straight red into the corner and the natural shot to play is to stun the white so it lines up the final red into the other corner I can no longer play that and instead have to somehow manoeuvre the white to hit off a cushion after striking the first red into the pocket?

It could take decades for these new rules to be accepted and implemented down the country where I still on occasion when visiting family come across the head wrecking rules KERSPLAT mentioned earlier where you can't play back table on the black, have only one shot on the black if the opponent fouls or even if he deliberately fouls and no free ball etc. IMO those rules are designed purely to make it possible for rubbish players to fluke or cheat a win. Mini rant over!!
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19-02-2019, 09:07   #11
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No if you successfully pot it's a legal shot and you dont need to hit a cushion. If you don't pot a ball needs to make contact with the cushion after contact.
Shots still carry it's just called two visits.
Everyone has their own rules as long as the two players agree it's no harm if not go with the world rules less arguments.
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19-02-2019, 21:25   #12
AllForIt
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Originally Posted by Je_suis_Jean View Post
It's 20 years since I used to play a bit so things have obviously changed quite a lot. When we played competitions games could be quite chess like in that having a good safety game was seen as an equally important skill to an ability to pot so games could take some time as the players played a bit of cat and mouse with each other. If a pot wasn't on or you wanted to develop a ball into a more playable position you could opt to snooker your opponent in order to win two shots which, assuming you were playing the "carry" rule generally meant you should have a decent chance of finishing the game.

I guess the changes are encouraged to distinguish pool as primarily a rapid fire potting and positioning game which is as unrelated to snooker as possible.

I think I'd miss the old drawn out crafty style games though, particularly with auld lads who may not have the potting skills any more but were often demons at safety having grown up playing billards and could grind you down until out of frustration you played a stupid shot giving them two shots and the game!!

So under the new rules if I have a straight red into the corner and the natural shot to play is to stun the white so it lines up the final red into the other corner I can no longer play that and instead have to somehow manoeuvre the white to hit off a cushion after striking the first red into the pocket?

It could take decades for these new rules to be accepted and implemented down the country where I still on occasion when visiting family come across the head wrecking rules KERSPLAT mentioned earlier where you can't play back table on the black, have only one shot on the black if the opponent fouls or even if he deliberately fouls and no free ball etc. IMO those rules are designed purely to make it possible for rubbish players to fluke or cheat a win. Mini rant over!!
When I started playing pool in the mid-nineties in a pub in London where there was a competition every Monday worth £100 in winers prize money which attracted some very sharp pool players who had years of experience and brought their own cues, those players were impossible to beat if you played a defensive snookering game. Two guys particularly if one didn't win the other would. That was my first experience of playing really good players where you would be lucky to get 2 turns at the table and on the odd occasion none if they cleared up from the break off shot!

It took me over a year to win the comp beating both of those players on the path to winning. Played a masse in the final with a thick tipped pub cue which threw my opponent : ). I decided the only way to beat them was to go for every pot at the first available opportunity because if you didn't and got defensive you'd invariable loose anyway. I've played that way ever since and am not interested in getting bogged down in tactical play unless the situation requires it.

I'm actually back in the country now and have taken up pub pool after some many years of absence from it and this is where I have come across the new World Rules which most ppl here seem to prefer.
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