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To Dairy startup OR not

  • 30-09-2020 8:19am
    #1
    badgerhowlin
    Registered Users Posts: 651 ✭✭✭


    Hi,

    Currently running 30 head of weanling to Store, on 20ac of land.
    There is a total of 100 ac to be had off the auld lad but not for the next 4 years.
    Could get 40-50 in the next 2 years if I want.

    We use to be in dairy about 20 years ago.
    old milking parlour is still standing. Pit, frame, and shell is still there. It was a 6 unit parlour
    Land is all in one block.

    Thinking of going with 40 head of cows and growing it from there.
    Buying a 2nd hand 10-12 unit milking machine.
    Probable extend the current parlour to fit the new machine.


Comments

  • #2
    _Brian
    Registered Users Posts: 18,473 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    This conversation came up yesterday at work.

    It’s hard not to move that way if you’ve the block of land and have the appetite for it. In reality everything else is standing still or going backwards as regards income.

    Is organic milk an option at the moment??


  • #3
    Sacrolyte
    Registered Users Posts: 851 ✭✭✭Sacrolyte


    What age range is the old lad?


  • #4
    Grueller
    Registered Users Posts: 5,100 ✭✭✭Grueller


    badgerhowlin wrote: »
    Hi,

    Currently running 30 head of weanling to Store, on 20ac of land.
    There is a total of 100 ac to be had off the auld lad but not for the next 4 years.
    Could get 40-50 in the next 2 years if I want.

    We use to be in dairy about 20 years ago.
    old milking parlour is still standing. Pit, frame, and shell is still there. It was a 6 unit parlour
    Land is all in one block.

    Thinking of going with 40 head of cows and growing it from there.
    Buying a 2nd hand 10-12 unit milking machine.
    Probable extend the current parlour to fit the new machine.

    Before you buy a 2nd hand parlour price new ones. You might be surprised at how small the difference will be. I got a shock when I priced both ways and bought new.


  • #5
    badgerhowlin
    Registered Users Posts: 651 ✭✭✭badgerhowlin


    Sacrolyte wrote: »
    What age range is the old lad?

    He just turned 69.

    He hasnt been farming for the past 13 years. Well if you dont include him been out with me and the cattle every chance he gets and driving the tractor!


  • #6
    TooOldBoots
    Closed Accounts Posts: 604 ✭✭✭TooOldBoots


    Any other family members? They might have ideas with regards to the land too, or at least are looking for a share


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  • #7
    K.G.
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 3,034 Mod ✭✭✭✭K.G.


    Did you like milking cows before


  • #8
    badgerhowlin
    Registered Users Posts: 651 ✭✭✭badgerhowlin


    TooOldBoots wrote: »
    Any other family members? They might have ideas with regards to the land too, or at least are looking for a share

    There is a 6 of us. but none of them want anything to do with farming and all have their own homes.


  • #9
    badgerhowlin
    Registered Users Posts: 651 ✭✭✭badgerhowlin


    K.G. wrote: »
    Did you like milking cows before

    I didnt mind it but you know the mind of a teenager, there is more money to be made elsewhere.

    Now that I'm older, wont say wiser! I'm toying with the idea of getting back into them.

    But the amount to borrow is big. But I do have a few children and one is looking like he might be into farming but he is only 4 at the moment. I cant keep him off the farm.
    So if I was to go into it, I would be setting it up for him...


  • #10
    Morris Moss
    Registered Users Posts: 547 ✭✭✭Morris Moss


    badgerhowlin wrote: »
    I didnt mind it but you know the mind of a teenager, there is more money to be made elsewhere.

    Now that I'm older, wont say wiser! I'm toying with the idea of getting back into them.

    But the amount to borrow is big. But I do have a few children and one is looking like he might be into farming but he is only 4 at the moment. I cant keep him off the farm.
    So if I was to go into it, I would be setting it up for him...

    If that's the reason to get into milking forget about it, young lads can be mad about something and then out of nowhere have zero interest.


  • #11
    badgerhowlin
    Registered Users Posts: 651 ✭✭✭badgerhowlin


    Morris Moss wrote: »
    If that's the reason to get into milking forget about it, young lads can be mad about something and then out of nowhere have zero interest.

    O God no that NOT the reason, but it helps a little to know that there might be someone to take over the farm when I'm finished.

    Main reason is the Job I'm in, is great, pay is not bad, but everyday Im looking out the window Rain or wind or shine, thinking I would love to be out there doing stuff on the farm. and IF only I could turn back time and make a differnt choise.

    Then when i get home I take my time been outside(longer than i should) walking through the stock.

    When i have to get up Early for work its always a slog to get out of the bed, but when i have animals to feed, and farm work to be done its not hard at all to get out..


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  • #12
    Bazzer007
    Registered Users Posts: 198 ✭✭Bazzer007


    Grueller wrote: »
    Before you buy a 2nd hand parlour price new ones. You might be surprised at how small the difference will be. I got a shock when I priced both ways and bought new.

    I found if you can get a grant for a new parlour it would be the way to go as there's little in the difference compared to going secondhand. Without the grant, a new parlour would be costly going by the quotations I received. Clean up and test what you have and take it from there. The dairy equipment scheme closed in June not sure when it reopens.


  • #13
    Morris Moss
    Registered Users Posts: 547 ✭✭✭Morris Moss


    badgerhowlin wrote: »
    O God no that NOT the reason, but it helps a little to know that there might be someone to take over the farm when I'm finished.

    Main reason is the Job I'm in, is great, pay is not bad, but everyday Im looking out the window Rain or wind or shine, thinking I would love to be out there doing stuff on the farm. and IF only I could turn back time and make a differnt choise.

    Then when i get home I take my time been outside(longer than i should) walking through the stock.

    When i have to get up Early for work its always a slog to get out of the bed, but when i have animals to feed, and farm work to be done its not hard at all to get out..

    Ah that's fair enough so, just on the transfer of land, depending on what age you are I'd sort that out as soon as possible to avoid being roasted with tax.


  • #14
    K.G.
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 3,034 Mod ✭✭✭✭K.G.


    badgerhowlin wrote: »
    O God no that NOT the reason, but it helps a little to know that there might be someone to take over the farm when I'm finished.

    Main reason is the Job I'm in, is great, pay is not bad, but everyday Im looking out the window Rain or wind or shine, thinking I would love to be out there doing stuff on the farm. and IF only I could turn back time and make a differnt choise.

    Then when i get home I take my time been outside(longer than i should) walking through the stock.

    When i have to get up Early for work its always a slog to get out of the bed, but when i have animals to feed, and farm work to be done its not hard at all to get out..

    The next question can you afford to go milking. You would need to be able to put either the cows OR the facilities on the ground with no borrowing and is you r partner prepared to facilitate this move


  • #15
    badgerhowlin
    Registered Users Posts: 651 ✭✭✭badgerhowlin


    K.G. wrote: »
    The next question can you afford to go milking. You would need to be able to put either the cows OR the facilities on the ground with no borrowing and is you r partner prepared to facilitate this move


    I would probable be able to to 40k or so into it with farm savings and sale of stock. Would need to borrow rest.

    would need to borrow for
    10-15 heffiers
    milking machine, tank, cooling unit etc.
    Build new shed or expand existing shed.
    New water troughs and fencing,
    while im at it a 2nd hand tractor 100hp with loader would go a stray

    What we saying there 150k should cover that, and everything else i have missed and not put in...

    Wife could be brought around to the Idea.

    But it would all be hanging on getting another 200ac of land either leased of the auld lad like the current 20ac or get farm signed over completely, but he probable wont do that till the current lease to the neighbour ends in 3-4 years time


  • #16
    Sacrolyte
    Registered Users Posts: 851 ✭✭✭Sacrolyte


    Would the consideration of forming a dairy partnership with him bring him onside more?


  • #17
    wrangler
    Registered Users Posts: 11,055 ✭✭✭✭wrangler


    badgerhowlin wrote: »
    I would probable be able to to 40k or so into it with farm savings and sale of stock. Would need to borrow rest.

    would need to borrow for
    10-15 heffiers
    milking machine, tank, cooling unit etc.
    Build new shed or expand existing shed.
    New water troughs and fencing,
    while im at it a 2nd hand tractor 100hp with loader would go a stray

    What we saying there 150k should cover that, and everything else i have missed and not put in...

    Wife could be brought around to the Idea.

    But it would all be hanging on getting another 200ac of land either leased of the auld lad like the current 20ac or get farm signed over completely, but he probable wont do that till the current lease to the neighbour ends in 3-4 years time

    I think I heard somewhere that a lease to your/son daughter can't be tax free
    Which, if true, wouldn't be a help to your case


  • #18
    C0N0R
    Registered Users Posts: 1,923 ✭✭✭C0N0R


    wrangler wrote: »
    I think I heard somewhere that a lease to your/son daughter can't be tax free
    Which, if true, wouldn't be a help to your case

    Yes, you’re correct


  • #19
    Timmaay
    Registered Users Posts: 11,394 ✭✭✭✭Timmaay


    Grueller wrote: »
    Before you buy a 2nd hand parlour price new ones. You might be surprised at how small the difference will be. I got a shock when I priced both ways and bought new.

    Likes of a new barebones 12unit can be got for 1800/unit installed. Will rise up towards 4k/unit if you start adding on acrs, swing over arms etc. Plus 40% back on the tams grant. So price 2nd hand parlours accordingly. 2bh if someone offered me a 2nd hand parlour I'd nearly want it for free after I'd uninstalled it, brought it home and had for fix up all new rubber and whatever other issues that you'll get with transplanting something as awkward.


  • #20
    Sacrolyte
    Registered Users Posts: 851 ✭✭✭Sacrolyte


    Timmaay wrote: »
    Likes of a new barebones 12unit can be got for 1800/unit installed. Will rise up towards 4k/unit if you start adding on acrs, swing over arms etc. Plus 40% back on the tams grant. So price 2nd hand parlours accordingly. 2bh if someone offered me a 2nd hand parlour I'd nearly want it for free after I'd uninstalled it, brought it home and had for fix up all new rubber and whatever other issues that you'll get with transplanting something as awkward.

    Yep


  • #21
    blue5000
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,616 Mod ✭✭✭✭blue5000


    OP I gave up milking 14 years ago. The only way I'd consider going back is with a robot. Might be worth looking into one if your land is in one block. They're not cheap, but a second unit could be added later on if more land comes into the system.

    It can take as long to milk 40 cows in a bad setup as to milk 150 in a good setup. Time is the ultimate commodity.

    If the seat's wet, sit on yer hat, a cool head is better than a wet ar5e.



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