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01-08-2020, 07:26   #46
perfectkama
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invest in something less risky buy apple and gold
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01-08-2020, 13:08   #47
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invest in something less risky buy apple and gold
Lol Gold is probably the riskiest thing you can buy ... Take it from someone who knows
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01-08-2020, 13:37   #48
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invest in something less risky buy apple and gold

I'm hoping you are joking
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01-08-2020, 15:41   #49
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ok not gold tho am invest with a miner but risky, so well at least apple/amzn last 2 years no regrets property BTL "your havin alaugh"
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01-08-2020, 17:15   #50
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Go for it OP. It will pay off in the end.
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05-08-2020, 07:23   #51
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rule of thumb is the rent has to be twice the mortgage for the property to wash its own face. After tax you'll only keep half the rent payment.
Im not a property investor or landlord but a friend is and the way he looks at it, He makes roughly 2k a month on each of his properties, his mortgage is approx 1000 on each he pays his taxes he still makes about 150 a week profit from each pad. BUT after 30 years (his retirememnt age) he effectively has properties paid for ready for sale fully paid off. So long term isnt it a sweet deal? He has about 20 years to go on his 3 investment properties and that will be worth about even at current house prices over 1 Million Euros. They could be well worth 2 millions plus So he would have made a killing long term.
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05-08-2020, 08:30   #52
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Im not a property investor or landlord but a friend is and the way he looks at it, He makes roughly 2k a month on each of his properties, his mortgage is approx 1000 on each he pays his taxes he still makes about 150 a week profit from each pad. BUT after 30 years (his retirememnt age) he effectively has properties paid for ready for sale fully paid off. So long term isnt it a sweet deal? He has about 20 years to go on his 3 investment properties and that will be worth about even at current house prices over 1 Million Euros. They could be well worth 2 millions plus So he would have made a killing long term.
Ah the Sirens Call to Irish residential property. Sounds sweet, sounds appealing, but take care not to be smashed on the rocks while you follow the call.

The back of a fag packet maths that you'll pay off the mortgage over 20-30 years and own a property outright so you can make a killing in the long run just does not hold up when you look at the risk v return.

A typical yield (Gross rent / property cost) on an Irish property is about 8%. Maybe if you hunt around, you might get up to 10%. Sometimes you're only looking at 5-6%. The interest rate on a Buy2Let mortgage is about 4.5%. A cash buyer is making about 8% before costs and takes. The mortgage element is making about 3.5% before costs and taxes.

That's better than you'll do with deposit interest, but is not better than other risk investments such as stocks and shares. Speaking of risk, consider what happens your finances if you get a rogue tenant along your 30 year journey to your cash cow. 2 years of a non-paying tenant, even if your mortgage is 1k per month, is 24k of negative cash flow. Add in damage to property and legal costs, and you may have to sustain a 35k+ loss along the journey.

Investing 500 per month in anything over 30 years will leave you sitting pretty at the end of it.

OP. Go talk to an independent financial advisor. For a small fee they will discuss tax efficient investments such as pensions that will be better for you and your individual circumstances than putting your entire financial stability in the hands of some random tenant that may make an omelette out of your nest egg.
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05-08-2020, 09:03   #53
Irish_peppa
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Ah the Sirens Call to Irish residential property. Sounds sweet, sounds appealing, but take care not to be smashed on the rocks while you follow the call.

The back of a fag packet maths that you'll pay off the mortgage over 20-30 years and own a property outright so you can make a killing in the long run just does not hold up when you look at the risk v return.

A typical yield (Gross rent / property cost) on an Irish property is about 8%. Maybe if you hunt around, you might get up to 10%. Sometimes you're only looking at 5-6%. The interest rate on a Buy2Let mortgage is about 4.5%. A cash buyer is making about 8% before costs and takes. The mortgage element is making about 3.5% before costs and taxes.

That's better than you'll do with deposit interest, but is not better than other risk investments such as stocks and shares. Speaking of risk, consider what happens your finances if you get a rogue tenant along your 30 year journey to your cash cow. 2 years of a non-paying tenant, even if your mortgage is 1k per month, is 24k of negative cash flow. Add in damage to property and legal costs, and you may have to sustain a 35k+ loss along the journey.

Investing 500 per month in anything over 30 years will leave you sitting pretty at the end of it.

OP. Go talk to an independent financial advisor. For a small fee they will discuss tax efficient investments such as pensions that will be better for you and your individual circumstances than putting your entire financial stability in the hands of some random tenant that may make an omelette out of your nest egg.
Oh jesus i wont be investing in property ! I had some spare cash but there was no way i wanted to be chasing tenants I rented rooms in my own house that was bad enough i can only imagine chasing tenants who live an hours drive away if not more.
PS that same landlord with 4 properties (4 apartments all in same estate) His plan was to flip 2 or 3 of his apartments after 10 years to afford a nice 4 or 5 bed detached in Greater Dublin BUT his investments hamstrung him after the property crash so he is stuck now with 4 apartments. I can see that he likes to put a spin on it but that was never his plan to be stuck in an apartment at 45 with a wife and kid. I think his saving grace they are all on trackers. No landlord and property investment wouldnt be my thing
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05-08-2020, 10:43   #54
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Oh boy... this is always a problem with boards once it reaches around 30 posts upwards, it goes completely off topic.

I was not asking about an investment, I was talking about what to do with an EXISTING property once I move into this new cheaper one.

I'm not going to sell it, and I'm not going to leave it empty.

Hence rent it... and the question was "How much would I expect to get if renting it".

The answer was that it would roughly cover the cost of the mortgage of the new place I'm moving into, so win win. Anyway end of topic.
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05-08-2020, 10:47   #55
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Depends on how many bunk beds you can cram into the kitchen.
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05-08-2020, 11:10   #56
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Ah the Sirens Call to Irish residential property. Sounds sweet, sounds appealing, but take care not to be smashed on the rocks while you follow the call.

The back of a fag packet maths that you'll pay off the mortgage over 20-30 years and own a property outright so you can make a killing in the long run just does not hold up when you look at the risk v return.

A typical yield (Gross rent / property cost) on an Irish property is about 8%. Maybe if you hunt around, you might get up to 10%. Sometimes you're only looking at 5-6%. The interest rate on a Buy2Let mortgage is about 4.5%. A cash buyer is making about 8% before costs and takes. The mortgage element is making about 3.5% before costs and taxes.

That's better than you'll do with deposit interest, but is not better than other risk investments such as stocks and shares. Speaking of risk, consider what happens your finances if you get a rogue tenant along your 30 year journey to your cash cow. 2 years of a non-paying tenant, even if your mortgage is 1k per month, is 24k of negative cash flow. Add in damage to property and legal costs, and you may have to sustain a 35k+ loss along the journey.

Investing 500 per month in anything over 30 years will leave you sitting pretty at the end of it.

OP. Go talk to an independent financial advisor. For a small fee they will discuss tax efficient investments such as pensions that will be better for you and your individual circumstances than putting your entire financial stability in the hands of some random tenant that may make an omelette out of your nest egg.
Do you know any banks offering finance to purchase shares?


Your ROI on property is based on geared funds but your ROI on shares is based on invested funds only. That opens up a gulf and that is why property is attractive to small investors.
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05-08-2020, 11:22   #57
DubCount
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Oh boy... this is always a problem with boards once it reaches around 30 posts upwards, it goes completely off topic.

I was not asking about an investment, I was talking about what to do with an EXISTING property once I move into this new cheaper one.

I'm not going to sell it, and I'm not going to leave it empty.

Hence rent it... and the question was "How much would I expect to get if renting it".

The answer was that it would roughly cover the cost of the mortgage of the new place I'm moving into, so win win. Anyway end of topic.
This was completely on topic. Why not sell? Just because you already own the property already does not change the investment decision. You might be better off selling and making a different investment or even buying a different property with a better yield etc.

If you've already decided what to do, good luck to you. You will be one of a very select group of people deciding to become a landlord in the current market when you don't need to.
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05-08-2020, 11:46   #58
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This was completely on topic. Why not sell?
Location location location. No way I'm selling it as there's no chance I'd be able to afford it now if I were to try to buy it again, plus the area has gone up in value along with the property.

No ETF investment will be able to match the value appreciation, not to mention the rent income etc.

And before you ask I've also got the whole pension/ETF setup as well sorted separately so not going to invest any more for now.
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10-08-2020, 17:49   #59
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No ETF investment will be able to match the value appreciation

Just to add this is not true, I'm invested in some funds which would be considered low to medium risk and they are up 20-30% (after fees) in about 3 years. Since 2008, the S&P 500 is up over 300% even after the blip earlier this year. Long term the stock market always beats real estate. You are correct that it doesn't take into account the potential rental income (I do get some dividends through the funds but not 500 a month).
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10-08-2020, 18:19   #60
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Just to add this is not true, I'm invested in some funds which would be considered low to medium risk and they are up 20-30% (after fees) in about 3 years. Since 2008, the S&P 500 is up over 300% even after the blip earlier this year. Long term the stock market always beats real estate. You are correct that it doesn't take into account the potential rental income (I do get some dividends through the funds but not 500 a month).
Of course you are correct.

OP has his head set on being a LL. He is not interested in helpful investment advice - "Im not going to sell it" is already decided.

You only fully appreciate the downside of being an Irish LL when you've tried it for yourself.
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