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Dublin routes news and general chat

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Comments

  • #122
    Fattes
    Registered Users Posts: 3,208 ✭✭✭Fattes


    JCX BXC wrote: »
    First, ask yourself what do they do with the 5 757's they will be replacing.

    They will go back to ASL 3 & 1 to Omni (I think) who own and operate the flights on contract for EI


  • #123
    IE 222
    Registered Users Posts: 1,670 ✭✭✭IE 222


    JCX BXC wrote: »
    First, ask yourself what do they do with the 5 757's they will be replacing.

    Well it's only 4 isn't it. They will obviously replace these but many of the DUB 757 routes have and are been upgraded to A330 now so my guess would be in 2 years time the 757 routes other than Shannon or Hartford might not cope with A321.

    Also I guess the 757s will stay until the final 4 arrive meaning the first 3 will be for expansion.


  • #124
    JCX BXC
    Registered Users Posts: 18,101 ✭✭✭✭JCX BXC


    Fattes wrote: »
    They will go back to ASL 3 & 1 to Omni (I think) who own and operate the flights on contract for EI

    Again, did not dispute this, however the plan is for the A321's LR to replace the 757's being used by EI.


  • #125
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,597 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    JCX BXC wrote: »
    Apologies, 4, thought it was 5 for some reason.

    I never implied that they own them, I don't understand your point, are you saying they'll be gone before the A321's arrive or are you just restating my point,

    They will go as the 321s arrive. Your point was asking what they'll do with them post 321. Nothing, as they won't have them


  • #126
    JCX BXC
    Registered Users Posts: 18,101 ✭✭✭✭JCX BXC


    L1011 wrote: »
    They will go as the 321s arrive. Your point was asking what they'll do with them post 321. Nothing, as they won't have them

    No, my point was what they do with the 757's now.


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  • #127
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,597 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    JCX BXC wrote: »
    No, my point was what they do with the 757's now.

    You didn't make that even vaguely clear


  • #128
    JCX BXC
    Registered Users Posts: 18,101 ✭✭✭✭JCX BXC


    L1011 wrote: »
    You didn't make that even vaguely clear

    I thought I did, obviously not.

    "First, ask yourself what do they do (present tense)* with the 5 (4)* 757's they (the A321's)* will be replacing."

    My point was that currently the 757's have no issues leaving during normal operating hours currently, and that I wasn't sure 3 more would make a difference. Apologies if this was unclear.


  • #129
    john boye
    Registered Users Posts: 1,491 ✭✭✭john boye


    IE 222 wrote: »
    Personally i cant see IE sending the whole 7 A321 state side within 2 hours or so of each other. My guess is they would stagger their departures throughout the day to allow for Euro services resulting in some earlier and later US flights.


    Keep in mind that the A321LRs will have a business class section which will take away much of the extra lift that the current A321s offer so I can't really see them on the SH network unless they were to sell biz seats which seems very unlikely. Will be interesting to see what eventually replaces the existing A321s, hard to see them ordering brand new A321NEOs.


  • #130
    IE 222
    Registered Users Posts: 1,670 ✭✭✭IE 222


    john boye wrote: »
    Keep in mind that the A321LRs will have a business class section which will take away much of the extra lift that the current A321s offer so I can't really see them on the SH network unless they were to sell biz seats which seems very unlikely. Will be interesting to see what eventually replaces the existing A321s, hard to see them ordering brand new A321NEOs.

    Yeah I know they'll have business included but that's why I was wondering would they look at reducing it slightly on some to keep craft more flexible for some Spanish summer routes. I know the A330 are larger but they do sell business seats on these don't they. It would seem wasteful having 7 frames lying around 6 or 8 hours of the day.


  • #131
    Locker10a
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 4,140 Mod ✭✭✭✭Locker10a


    IE 222 wrote: »
    john boye wrote: »
    Keep in mind that the A321LRs will have a business class section which will take away much of the extra lift that the current A321s offer so I can't really see them on the SH network unless they were to sell biz seats which seems very unlikely. Will be interesting to see what eventually replaces the existing A321s, hard to see them ordering brand new A321NEOs.

    Yeah I know they'll have business included but that's why I was wondering would they look at reducing it slightly on some to keep craft more flexible for some Spanish summer routes. I know the A330 are larger but they do sell business seats on these don't they. It would seem wasteful having 7 frames lying around 6 or 8 hours of the day.
    The issue is the new A321LRs will have the same capacity or thereabouts as the current A320s so while they may use a couple of them on shorthaul routes there's nothing much to be gained above A320 capacity. The only thing that you're really doing is confusing the shorthaul product be introducing a mix of business class seats scattered here and there on certain flights etc


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  • #132
    IE 222
    Registered Users Posts: 1,670 ✭✭✭IE 222


    Locker10a wrote: »
    The issue is the new A321LRs will have the same capacity or thereabouts as the current A320s so while they may use a couple of them on shorthaul routes there's nothing much to be gained above A320 capacity. The only thing that you're really doing is confusing the shorthaul product be introducing a mix of business class seats scattered here and there on certain flights etc

    Airbus suggest 190 economy and 16 business
    If possible I'd look at 208 economy 10 business on 3 or 4 of them. Obviously these number have yet to be agreed on. A320 is 172 I think.


  • #133
    john boye
    Registered Users Posts: 1,491 ✭✭✭john boye


    Airbus spec that I've seen is 185 in a 2-class config so not much of an increase and about 20 less than the current 321s. They wouldn't all be hanging around all day anyway; 2 would be based in Shannon and one would leave early on the early JFK (if that returns). Also I'm not sure there's much wiggle room to work the sun routes anyway. The Bradley and Washington routes leave approx 1230 and 1430; the early Faro and Malaga runs don't return until 1400-1430 approx. And they're largely (or completely, on the Malaga route) operated by the larger A330 anyway.


  • #134
    Locker10a
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 4,140 Mod ✭✭✭✭Locker10a


    john boye wrote: »
    Airbus spec that I've seen is 185 in a 2-class config so not much of an increase and about 20 less than the current 321s. They wouldn't all be hanging around all day anyway; 2 would be based in Shannon and one would leave early on the early JFK (if that returns). Also I'm not sure there's much wiggle room to work the sun routes anyway. The Bradley and Washington routes leave approx 1230 and 1430; the early Faro and Malaga runs don't return until 1400-1430 approx. And they're largely (or completely, on the Malaga route) operated by the larger A330 anyway.
    Yeah they are planned to be 186 seater aircraft, obviously including business class so not much above the current A320 which is 174Y. Personally I think Aer Lingus will use the additional frames to do extra early morning New York or Boston flights perhaps. Who knows maybe we'll see some routes from Shannon, Cork or even Belfast. Equally we might just see these aircraft being put on early morning flights between London or Brussels or Düsseldorf. And sold at a320 capacity, with upgrades being offered for a fee or to AerClub members with status.


  • #135
    Jamie2k9
    Registered Users Posts: 10,667 ✭✭✭✭Jamie2k9


    Indo have article about China service:
    China's Hainan Airlines is close to agreeing a direct scheduled flight from Dublin to Beijing for the upcoming winter season, according to a number of sources.

    Discussions have been under way for some time between the airline and Dublin Airport Authority (DAA) and the airline is close to finalising a schedule for the flights, the Sunday Independent has learned. The flight will operate on alternate days to Dublin and Edinburgh in Scotland and this has added complexity to the scheduling and slot negotiations, it is understood. Hainan Airlines is China's fourth-largest carrier and is owned by the huge HNA conglomerate, which also owns Dublin-based aircraft leasing firm Avolon.

    http://www.independent.ie/business/world/hainan-airlines-close-to-finalising-scheduling-on-beijingdublin-flights-36026037.html


  • #136
    IE 222
    Registered Users Posts: 1,670 ✭✭✭IE 222


    john boye wrote: »
    Airbus spec that I've seen is 185 in a 2-class config so not much of an increase and about 20 less than the current 321s. They wouldn't all be hanging around all day anyway; 2 would be based in Shannon and one would leave early on the early JFK (if that returns). Also I'm not sure there's much wiggle room to work the sun routes anyway. The Bradley and Washington routes leave approx 1230 and 1430; the early Faro and Malaga runs don't return until 1400-1430 approx. And they're largely (or completely, on the Malaga route) operated by the larger A330 anyway.

    I've read a few different articles that seems to suggest 206 typical seating in 2 class formation.

    I don't mean literally hanging around all day but they spend 6 to 7 hours on the ground. Even the DUB - JFK & BOS flights stay on the ground state side for up 5hrs before returning.


  • #137
    JCX BXC
    Registered Users Posts: 18,101 ✭✭✭✭JCX BXC


    In terms of expansion with the A321, I personally can't see any expansion outside Dublin, they're really only adding 3 frames to the fleet (as the 4 757's will be gone). They'll probably want all expansion there.

    Will the A321LR on order be able to reach ORD with a reasonable load does anyone know?


  • #138
    john boye
    Registered Users Posts: 1,491 ✭✭✭john boye


    IE 222 wrote: »
    john boye wrote: »
    Airbus spec that I've seen is 185 in a 2-class config so not much of an increase and about 20 less than the current 321s. They wouldn't all be hanging around all day anyway; 2 would be based in Shannon and one would leave early on the early JFK (if that returns). Also I'm not sure there's much wiggle room to work the sun routes anyway. The Bradley and Washington routes leave approx 1230 and 1430; the early Faro and Malaga runs don't return until 1400-1430 approx. And they're largely (or completely, on the Malaga route) operated by the larger A330 anyway.

    I've read a few different articles that seems to suggest 206 typical seating in 2 class formation.

    I don't mean literally hanging around all day but they spend 6 to 7 hours on the ground. Even the DUB - JFK & BOS flights stay on the ground state side for up 5hrs before returning.


    It was stated when the order was announced that the EI ones would have 186 seats. In any case, the B757s have 177 seats and the 321LR s would be unlikely to have too many more than that.


  • #139
    Marcusm
    Registered Users Posts: 10,183 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    IE 222 wrote: »
    I've read a few different articles that seems to suggest 206 typical seating in 2 class formation.

    I don't mean literally hanging around all day but they spend 6 to 7 hours on the ground. Even the DUB - JFK & BOS flights stay on the ground state side for up 5hrs before returning.

    I wonder would EI consider an add on domestic sector to another north Easter airport, day Pittsburgh, to use up the extra time. Clearly this would be more complex for a crewing perspective but given the frequency of EI flights to NYC (ie JFK and EWR), perhaps it could be worked into the crew schedule similar to how BA do in the Caribbean and elsewhere. Maybe not the obvious solution for a small airframe, I guess.


  • #140
    IE 222
    Registered Users Posts: 1,670 ✭✭✭IE 222


    john boye wrote: »
    It was stated when the order was announced that the EI ones would have 186 seats. In any case, the B757s have 177 seats and the 321LR s would be unlikely to have too many more than that.

    If that the configuration they gone for then fair enough. I wasn't aware they've chosen that but the potential is there for 206 seating.


  • #141
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,597 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Marcusm wrote: »
    I wonder would EI consider an add on domestic sector to another north Easter airport, day Pittsburgh, to use up the extra time. Clearly this would be more complex for a crewing perspective but given the frequency of EI flights to NYC (ie JFK and EWR), perhaps it could be worked into the crew schedule similar to how BA do in the Caribbean and elsewhere. Maybe not the obvious solution for a small airframe, I guess.

    Absolutely impossible to get sixth freedom rights from the US.


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  • #142
    IE 222
    Registered Users Posts: 1,670 ✭✭✭IE 222


    JCX BXC wrote: »
    In terms of expansion with the A321, I personally can't see any expansion outside Dublin, they're really only adding 3 frames to the fleet (as the 4 757's will be gone). They'll probably want all expansion there.

    Will the A321LR on order be able to reach ORD with a reasonable load does anyone know?

    And given the suggestions of expanding frequency on current routes there's not much room for expanding destinations. They seem to be leaving themselves short unless more A330s are due to come in as well. I'm sure Miami will be up to a daily service in 2 years time.


  • #143
    IE 222
    Registered Users Posts: 1,670 ✭✭✭IE 222


    Marcusm wrote: »
    I wonder would EI consider an add on domestic sector to another north Easter airport, day Pittsburgh, to use up the extra time. Clearly this would be more complex for a crewing perspective but given the frequency of EI flights to NYC (ie JFK and EWR), perhaps it could be worked into the crew schedule similar to how BA do in the Caribbean and elsewhere. Maybe not the obvious solution for a small airframe, I guess.

    Would this not fall into 6th freedom rights.


  • #144
    Marcusm
    Registered Users Posts: 10,183 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    L1011 wrote: »
    Absolutely impossible to get sixth freedom rights from the US.

    Wouldn't that be 8th freedom but in any event, I was omitting the right to fly passengers entirely within US.


  • #145
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,597 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Marcusm wrote: »
    Wouldn't that be 8th freedom but in any event, I was omitting the right to fly passengers entirely within US.

    Unless the existing DUB->US leg is yielding very poorly, there's nothing to be gained by a tag.


  • #146
    CoisFharraige
    Registered Users Posts: 215 ✭✭CoisFharraige


    Jamie2k9 wrote: »
    Indo have article about China service:



    http://www.independent.ie/business/world/hainan-airlines-close-to-finalising-scheduling-on-beijingdublin-flights-36026037.html


    Hainan were given a minimum-guarantee on seat purchases per-flight. Avolon and many other Dublin-based companies (mainly software developers who have PAs dealing with China) have quite a few people going over and back to China every day. It's a massive deal for the Chinese business people with regards to meeting everybody face-to-face and exchanging gifts. Hainan will definitely be carrying through with this route without a doubt.


  • #147
    JCX BXC
    Registered Users Posts: 18,101 ✭✭✭✭JCX BXC


    Why has it taken so long in that case? I've been hearing the same "imminent" for years.


  • #148
    JCX BXC
    Registered Users Posts: 18,101 ✭✭✭✭JCX BXC


    http://corporate.ryanair.com/news/ryanair-launches-dublin-s18-schedule-5-new-routes-to-marrakech-munich-naples-paphos-stuttgart/?market=ie

    So, 5 new routes. Marrakech (2 wkly), Munich (2 daily), Naples (5 wkly), Paphos (2 wkly) & Stuttgart (daily)

    At least the spat with charges they had last year with the DAA seems not to have affected this year's routes.

    Interesting to see Munich most in my opinion, I understand this will be their first route to Munich, and I had not heard much talk of them applying for slots etc that I heard for Amsterdam and Frankfurt.


  • #149
    haro124
    Closed Accounts Posts: 684 ✭✭✭haro124


    And not to transavia ending their short lived service to Munich


  • #150
    VG31
    Registered Users Posts: 3,390 ✭✭✭VG31


    haro124 wrote: »
    And not to transavia ending their short lived service to Munich

    They are closing their base in Munich completely, it's not just the Dublin route.


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  • #151
    JCX BXC
    Registered Users Posts: 18,101 ✭✭✭✭JCX BXC


    Munich on sale from the 29th of October? I don't remember this being announced for the winter season!


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