eircom Announces fibre roll out

hellboy99 · 28-07-2011 4:56pm

Sponge Bob wrote: »

eircoms EXISTING fibre network is extensive and half of all exchanges already have fibre. Generally 1gbit minimum. From here ( tick box on right to see detail)

I think you will find that a lot of people in these "NFN" areas are having problems even getting 3MB speeds.

TheMilkyPirate · 28-07-2011 4:59pm

So what does this mean exactly, Will i be able to enjoy fibre broadband in wexford town soon?

Sponge Bob · 28-07-2011 5:01pm

hellboy99 wrote: »

I think you will find that a lot of people in these "NFN" areas are having problems even getting 3MB speeds.

Absolutely, if NGN ...ADSL2+ is introduced then speeds can drop for some customers...not rise.

godskitchen · 28-07-2011 5:20pm

poisonedstream wrote: »

Yes exactly. You paid for a service. You look enviously upon towns. Move to one and get proper broadband or continue to enjoy clean air.

I am guessing you would have said the same thing if you were around in the 50's when rural electrification was happening.......

Want water? Move to a town!
Want electricity? Move to a town!

I guess the people that supply your food everyday have no need for broadband?

Want food? Move to the countryside and grow your own.

pat13wx · 28-07-2011 5:28pm

If only rural dwellers, such as myself and 1000s of others would welcome such a scheme if it actually went nationwide.

Solair · 28-07-2011 5:31pm

We need proper serious fixed point wireless services in rural areas.

Wired product, i.e. DSL, cable tv and fibre products like FTTH or FTTC can only work in towns. They can work in pretty small towns, but when it comes to rural one off housing and very low density population areas, wireless technologies are the only viable options for those areas.

We need to develop an actual policy of getting fibre to local transmission mast sites in these areas.

Eircom will drive fibre development in areas where they compete with UPC, so you can expect to see this fibre service in Dublin, Cork, Limerick, Galway etc first.

The reality is that those are also the areas with the population densities to support such technology.

We need joined-up-thinking on broadband and rolling out appropriate technologies in each type of area.

Fibre to home is simply never going to be a possibility in rural one-off-housing etc.

D'Peoples Voice · 28-07-2011 5:54pm

Praetorian wrote: »

To me the obvious targets for Eircom should be the large towns and areas of cities that UPC haven't targeted. UPC's own rollout seems to have stagnated.

+1 ......except i just wonder if we are being too hard on Eircom.

As regards the choice of Dublin 1,2 & 3, that would be........unusual choice for a residential product - as opposed to Tallaght, Swords, Clonee or Blanchardstown I would have thought.

But what two postcodes in Dublin would have the highest density of apartment blocks? Arguably Dublin 1 & Dublin 2. Perhaps this would help to keep down the rollout costs - would anyone agree with that suggestion?

Also what two postcodes would have the highest density of businesses, arguably Dublin 1(IFSC) & 2 (Stephens Green/Merrion Square/South Docks). I've no idea how the rollout of the residential product affects the business product, but I'm sure there are some synergies - could anyone confirm this?

Onikage · 28-07-2011 6:45pm

Didn't Eircom propose a €500million fibre project 3 years ago? So long as the govt put in €150million? Why, yes they did...

http://www.siliconrepublic.com/strategy/item/10658-government-will-not-fund-ei

Sponge Bob · 28-07-2011 6:57pm

Onikage wrote: »

Didn't Eircom propose a €500million fibre project 3 years ago? So long as the govt put in €150million? Why, yes they did...

http://www.siliconrepublic.com/strategy/item/10658-government-will-not-fund-ei

In 2008 they wanted govt money to install VDSL (rather than fibre back then) in towns of 10000 population minimum, and then not even all of them. They wanted a subsidy to remain competitive with UPC.

Just so people know, the combined number of premises in towns with a population of 1500 or more is roughly 1m. Below is a list of all these towns in 2006, there were roughly 180 or them. If you do all of these you get your 1m premises.

Anywhere smaller can forget VDSL Fibre and indeed they can forget bog standard ADSL unless they already have it. Some smaller towns will get ADSL2+ which is what the NGN upgrades amounts to.

http://census.cso.ie/Census/TableViewer/tableView.aspx?ReportId=76513

Greater Dublin Area
Cork City Limerick City Galway City Waterford City Towns 10,000 population and over Drogheda Dundalk Swords Bray Navan (An Uaimh) Ennis Tralee Kilkenny Carlow Naas Sligo Droichead Nua Mullingar Wexford Letterkenny Athlone Celbridge Clonmel Balbriggan Malahide Leixlip Portlaoighise Killarney Greystones Tullamore Carrigaline Castlebar Arklow Cobh Maynooth Ballina Mallow Wicklow Midleton Towns 5,000 - 9,999 population Tramore Enniscorthy Skerries Shannon Portmarnock Laytown-Bettystown-Mornington Longford Ashbourne Dungarvan Rush Athy Cavan Nenagh New Ross Thurles Kildare Ratoath Gorey Tuam Trim Youghal Monaghan Ballinasloe Portarlington Buncrana Carrick-on-Suir Edenderry Fermoy Bandon Dunboyne Donabate Westport Ceannanus Mór Lusk Passage West Newcastle West Birr Tipperary Roscommon Towns 3,000 - 4,999 population Clane Roscrea Ardee Loughrea Carrickmacross Listowel Ballybofey-Stranorlar Clonakilty Kilcock Kinsale Mountmellick Blessington Sallins Kinsealy-Drinan Macroom Oranmore Dunshaughlin Cahir Mitchelstown Bantry Kilcoole Duleek Athenry Carrick-on-Shannon Castleblayney Tower Tullow Monasterevan Clara Towns 1,500 - 2,999 population Kilcullen Rathluirc (or Charleville) Cashel Rathcoole Carrigtwohill Muinebeag Gort Kilrush Ballyshannon Claremorris Newtownmountkennedy Boyle Kill Stamullen Blarney Templemore Donegal Skibbereen Castleisland Kinnegad Athboy Enfield Ballinrobe Bailieborough Bundoran Abbeyfeale Prosperous Carndonagh An Daingean Kanturk Cootehill Moate Enniskerry Castlerea Bunclody-Carrickduff Ballina (North Tipperary) Rathnew Annacotty Thomastown Callan Clones Kingscourt Baltinglass Virginia Ballaghaderreen Rathangan Ballyhaunis Kenmare Ballyjamesduff Crosshaven Sixmilebridge Banagher Killorglin Castlebridge Abbeyleix Clogherhead Dunmore East Newmarket-on-Fergus Portrane Castlecomer-Donaguile Dunmanway Newcastle Swinford

ashleey · 28-07-2011 7:09pm

'And in tomorrow's paper, Eircom renounce yesterday's renouncement of the announcement from a few year's back that they hope to deliver following an announcement soon....'

thefinalstage · 28-07-2011 7:39pm

godskitchen wrote: »

I am guessing you would have said the same thing if you were around in the 50's when rural electrification was happening.......

Want water? Move to a town!
Want electricity? Move to a town!

I guess the people that supply your food everyday have no need for broadband?

Want food? Move to the countryside and grow your own.

You think all our food is Irish? Lol. If I wanted open space I would move to the country. What I am saying is there are certain downsides and benefits.

It's simply that eircom is a private company now. The government subsidises them to give you a telephone line the same way as they subsidised the roll out of water lines and electricity. They are not subsidising broadband roll out. So unless you pay for it to be installed you are getting whatever eircom choose to provide.

paulm17781 · 28-07-2011 8:15pm

I remember posting about this when Eircom started marketing "NGN". People here told me it would never happen, not pessimisticly, it was stated as fact. Oh look....

Sponge Bob · 28-07-2011 9:16pm

paulm17781 wrote: »

People here told me it would never happen, not pessimisticly, it was stated as fact. Oh look....

And what??? UPC can market 20mbits to all but 3 or 4% of their enabled users. The remainder only qualify for 12mbits. 25% of eircom DSL customers qualify for max 3mbits.

UPC pass around 600,000 premises with a MINIMUM 20mbit speed. They are still enabling homes at a rate of at least 30,000 a year. UPC only really started to eat strongly into eircom in 2009..now 1000s a month are switching to them.

eircom are proposing to enable 100,000 homes and businesses in a year which is nowhere in the big scheme of things and most will qualify for 'up to' 40mbits VDSL services. Most can get faster UPC services already. They claim to have a plan to do 300,000 a year over the following 3 years to bring the total to 1m premises. This message is aimed at their bondholders with whom they are negotiating to get the money to stay in the game.

eircom are a lot more serious about broadband but that is because over half of all revenue generating eircom lines carry broadband nowadays. They have drastically dropped prices on national ethernet packages ( leased line equivalents) . You can get 300mbit+ pretty much nationally for the cost of a 2mbit leased line in 2006.

I got quoted this week for 1gbit + of level 2 national transit off four sites ( all four with fibre presentation) collectively to a dublin datacentre for less than €100k a year..the lot. I wouldn't even have bothered ringing them 6 months ago. One site is in a rural village.

This is a negotiating ploy aimed at their bondholders as much as everything else.

DonJose · 28-07-2011 9:39pm

Sponge Bob wrote: »

eircom are a lot more serious about broadband but that is because over half of all revenue generating eircom lines carry broadband nowadays. They have drastically dropped prices on national ethernet packages ( leased line equivalents) . You can get 300mbit+ pretty much nationally for the cost of a 2mbit leased line in 2006.

I am desperate to get a highspeed broadband for my home based software business. I've live in Mullingar, 300 meters from an e|net MAN, UPC service a housing estate 400 meters from my housing estate but have no plans to connect to our estate. The fastest broadband connection I can get is 3mb, it takes me several hours a day to update my website. I am desperate to get either UPC or Eircom fiber to my estate.

How much do these national ethernet packages cost and how would one go about ordering it?

Big Lar · 28-07-2011 10:40pm

DonJose wrote: »

How much do these national ethernet packages cost and how would one go about ordering it?

I would like to know also, and how much ?

10belowzero · 28-07-2011 11:21pm

Hi to sponge bob + tbc - the trial in Wexford and Sandyford have exceeded all expectation's too date,from what I hear, the announcement today about the fibre roll out came out of the blue.
The word among staff is that it is the E.S.O.P (staff) are investing the initial 100 million euro's , with further money earmarked , when all the financial negotiation's are over , I have to say we have waited year's to hear this news , it's just brilliant .
What I do know about the trial is that, it's not being done on the cheap , the very latest transmission equipment and fibre cable advailable on the market is being used , no expence has been spared and the roll out is being kept in house and is all being done by eircom tech's /support team's.
The trial is testing/experimenting with various method's of distribution as well as various transmission and c.p.e equipment covering (FTTC) + (FTTH).
More than that , I can not say,for obvious reason's , but the speed of the roll out , is not ambitious , if the right resource's are put in place , which I believe they will be,this time and the announcement today is by no mean's hype or a publicity stunt.
A huge amount of time , effort and money has been put in to these 2 trial's , which are still on going , the success of them to date , is a credit to the tech's , the support team's, the researcher's in logistic's and the excellent planner's in our planning area as well as the training div, which again prove's that eircom staff can meet (and I bet exceed) the fibre roll out target's .
Today is a good news day for all eircom staff , (even as we say goodbye to hundred's of staff over the next month or so ),it is also good news for the country as a whole , any improvement in our national comm's network has to be welcomed and it only make's good business sense ,that the final product will be priced to be competitive and affordable or people and business will just not buy the product , it's as simple as that , so yes today's announcement is welcome news for us all.

(p.s - tbc ,I'm sorry ,I did't mean to hijack your tread earlier)

DonJose · 29-07-2011 12:01am

10belowzero if you are looking for anybody to test the FTTH in Mullingar give me a buzz, I'm already an eircom customer and just 300 meters from the e|net MAN line

jimmycrackcorm · 29-07-2011 12:59am

It's thanks to upc that eircom is taking this step as it is clear that they will be in no position to compete with upc in the future otherwise.

On another note though, I remember when upc announced their investment that it was also €100m so it seems that amount will still leave much of the country with 3mb adsl and no piratebay either!

clohamon · 29-07-2011 9:23am

10belowzero wrote: »

The word among staff is that it is the E.S.O.P (staff) are investing the initial 100 million euro's , with further money earmarked , when all the financial negotiation's are over , I have to say we have waited year's to hear this news , it's just brilliant .

Paul Donovan, Eircom’s chief executive, said the cash-strapped company would fund the investment from its own resources. “We can fund this from free cash flow,” he said. “We have roughly €400 million in cash on hand.”

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2011/0729/1224301561129.html

Sponge Bob · 29-07-2011 9:49am

DonJose wrote: »

I am desperate to get a highspeed broadband for my home based software business.
How much do these national ethernet packages cost and how would one go about ordering it?

Ring a reseller like Strencom. You will need to get fibre from your home to the exchange as part of the order unless they can bond some copper pairs together.

NIMAN · 29-07-2011 12:02pm

I look forward to getting Eircom Fibre Optic Broadband up here in NW Donegal in maybe ................ 2050.

Pity I'll probably be 6ft under by then:D

DonJose · 29-07-2011 12:17pm

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Ring a reseller like Strencom. You will need to get fibre from your home to the exchange as part of the order unless they can bond some copper pairs together.

Thanks fpr that, I'm 2km from the exchange in a straight line according to Next Generation Wholesale Ethernet coverage map. I would be delighted to get a 100mb but I'm sure the costs would be staggering.

NIMAN · 29-07-2011 12:25pm

Is this not a big risk for Eircom, considering their debt situation?

Its all well and good trying to get 100mb speeds, but will people pay for it? If the cost of rolling it out is massive, then the monthly charge will have to be massive, and many will not pay for it.

At the end of the day, there is a cut off point in terms of the top speed needed. We'd all love 100mb, but for a lot of general surfing (which many people do) somewhere between 3mb and 8mb is fine.

They might be trying to supply for a market that doesn't exist.

Sponge Bob · 29-07-2011 12:53pm

NIMAN wrote: »

.

They might be trying to supply for a market that doesn't exist.

They have to have an offering in the 20mbit to 40mbit range....which they don't. They must get cabinets with VDSL gear rolled out near the customer to do this. These speeds require 2km line length at most and ideally sub 1km.

The entiire cabinet is made in a factory and costs around €30-50k ( depending on volumes ordered) nowadays. Add in fibre backhaul/electriicty and other civils and you are ready to go.

each cabinet will service say 2-300 VDSL connections or indeed ADSL2 if required. This one in the UK will do 128-200 lines.

NIMAN · 29-07-2011 1:06pm

As someone who can get only 3mb max at present where I live, I would much prefer them to install the necessary gear to make maybe 10mb - 20mb a possibility, rather than reaching for figures in multiples of that.

Lets walk before we run. Otherwise we will just trip up.

Sponge Bob · 29-07-2011 1:10pm

DonJose wrote: »

I would be delighted to get a 100mb but I'm sure the costs would be staggering.

I was surprised at how reasonable the costs were ( by eircom standards) for the fibre tails from the exchange. Nothing to stop you getting a quote for a level 2 ethernet point to point as long as you know where both ends are to go. You pick up the IP connection/DHCP in the datacentre.

If you need 100mbit symmetric you need fibre. Thats that.

Sponge Bob · 29-07-2011 1:13pm

In a rural area they have to spread a 30k investment across 50 lines, in an urban area the same investment will upgrade 250 lines. Therefore it is 20% of the cost.

Donegal actually has a lot of fibre, relatively speaking. see. That is what is required to handle the cabinet backhaul.

bastados · 29-07-2011 1:18pm

Two words that dont go well together..Broadband and Eircom.

Freddie59 · 29-07-2011 1:25pm

10belowzero wrote: »

Hi to sponge bob + tbc - the trial in Wexford and Sandyford have exceeded all expectation's too date,from what I hear, the announcement today about the fibre roll out came out of the blue.
The word among staff is that it is the E.S.O.P (staff) are investing the initial 100 million euro's , with further money earmarked , when all the financial negotiation's are over , I have to say we have waited year's to hear this news , it's just brilliant .

What I do know about the trial is that, it's not being done on the cheap , the very latest transmission equipment and fibre cable advailable on the market is being used , no expence has been spared and the roll out is being kept in house and is all being done by eircom tech's /support team's.

The trial is testing/experimenting with various method's of distribution as well as various transmission and c.p.e equipment covering (FTTC) + (FTTH).
More than that , I can not say,for obvious reason's , but the speed of the roll out , is not ambitious , if the right resource's are put in place , which I believe they will be,this time and the announcement today is by no mean's hype or a publicity stunt.

A huge amount of time , effort and money has been put in to these 2 trial's , which are still on going , the success of them to date , is a credit to the tech's , the support team's, the researcher's in logistic's and the excellent planner's in our planning area as well as the training div, which again prove's that eircom staff can meet (and I bet exceed) the fibre roll out target's .

Today is a good news day for all eircom staff , (even as we say goodbye to hundred's of staff over the next month or so ),it is also good news for the country as a whole , any improvement in our national comm's network has to be welcomed and it only make's good business sense ,that the final product will be priced to be competitive and affordable or people and business will just not buy the product , it's as simple as that , so yes today's announcement is welcome news for us all.

(p.s - tbc ,I'm sorry ,I did't mean to hijack your tread earlier)

Mind if I ask - do you WORK for Eircom? See bold/underlined in your post)?:)

DonJose · 29-07-2011 1:25pm

Sponge Bob wrote: »

I was surprised at how reasonable the costs were ( by eircom standards) for the fibre tails from the exchange. Nothing to stop you getting a quote for a level 2 ethernet point to point as long as you know where both ends are to go. You pick up the IP connection/DHCP in the datacentre.

If you need 100mbit symmetric you need fibre. Thats that.

Roughly, what do you think it would cost to connect to the exchange that is 2km away.

eircom Announces fibre roll out

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