Renting a room in a 'owner occupied house/apartment'

mood · 12-11-2010 9:47pm #1

I have a few rooms to look at next week and most are in 'owner occupied houses/apts'. Has anyone any idea what rights I would have under law if I took one of these owner occupied rooms?

lau1247 · 12-11-2010 10:46pm

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/renting_a_home/tenants_rights_and_obligations.html

Hayzooz · 12-11-2010 11:24pm

I'd avoid taking one of these rooms.

They're usually people who can't afford their mortgage and have no choice but to rent out a room.

As such, they are amateur, incapable landlords.

mikemac · 12-11-2010 11:26pm

Some are good

And some resent you watching "their" TV or oven or whatever.
And when they bring around friends you're expected to vacate the living room

OP, do you live in your room and go home at weekends?
As that's what some look for

The_Conductor · 13-11-2010 12:28pm

mood wrote: »

I have a few rooms to look at next week and most are in 'owner occupied houses/apts'. Has anyone any idea what rights I would have under law if I took one of these owner occupied rooms?

When you rent a room in an owner occupied house/apartment - you are living with the owner 'under licence' and tenancy laws do not apply to you. It would be up to the owner to decide on a list of rules that both you and they would abide by. They can ask you to leave without any notice- or similarly you can leave without notice, however normally it would be agreed amongst you that 2 weeks or a months notice would be served on the other party.

You have no rights as a tenant in an owner occupied house/apartment- however you also do not necessarily have the obligations of a tenant.

Rent allowance would not be acceptable, there is no tenancy lodged with the PRTB, you are entitled to claim a tax credit towards the 'rent' if you're working, and providing the gross 'rent' (which includes all bills) given to the landlord does not exceed 10k per annum- they do not have to pay tax on it (they do need to declare it however in an annual personal tax return).

There are pros and cons associated with living with an owner- the big pro is if anything at all goes wrong in the house, it would normally be fixed immediately

Personally I wouldnt like to live with an owner occupier- I enjoy my own space too much, however, thats only a personal viewpoint, I have many colleagues and friends who are only too happy to do so (mostly because of work commitments far away from home- and they travel home at weekends etc- but not always so).

S.

The_Morrigan · 13-11-2010 12:59pm

Hayzooz wrote: »

I'd avoid taking one of these rooms.

They're usually people who can't afford their mortgage and have no choice but to rent out a room.

As such, they are amateur, incapable landlords.

Bit harsh I must say, I've dealt with plenty of "professional" landlords who are incapable over the years I was renting.

I am an owner occupier and I rent out my spare room. I have a guy here who pretty much has the run of the apt as I'm not here much.
I can afford my mortgage, but as I'm rarely home I have a tenant more so for security reasons and company.
When he came to view the room there was a sit down over a cuppa and we chatted through house rules, rent, bills etc.

OP, as SMccarrick said there are pros and cons and you just need to talk to the person honestly and get a feel for them and their house rules etc. Don't write them off before you've met them.

mood · 13-11-2010 1:18pm

Most place to rent where I live are owner occupied. Any I have view that aren't are very much like 'student' houses - in bad need of painting, cleaning stained carpets and not homely at all.

I'll view it and have a chat and see how I feel then.

The_Conductor · 13-11-2010 1:53pm

Hayzooz wrote: »

As such, they are amateur, incapable landlords.

They are not landlords.
They are ordinary folk, letting a room in their home.
Likewise, the person taking the room is not a tenant.
Neither party are bound by tenancy law- alongside any of the rights or obligations it may infer on either of them.

Just because you or a friend may have had a bad experience in a situation like this- does not mean that someone else entering into a similar agreement would experience something similar.......

mood · 13-11-2010 2:08pm

So, considering neither party are bound by tenancy law what right (if any) would the house/apt owner or I have?

The_Morrigan · 13-11-2010 2:18pm

mood wrote: »

So, considering neither party are bound by tenancy law what right (if any) would the house/apt owner or I have?

To be honest it all comes down to common courtesy and the individuals involved.
Some owner occupiers may like to write everything down in an agreement, others just deal with everything on a day to day basis.
For instance, in my case my lodger pays an all inclusive rate so I don't have to bother dividing up the bills - but that was a mutual agreement before he moved in.
We also dealt with the issue of what happened if anything broke, needed repairs etc. Obviously he has to tell me if there is something up cos I may not notice it and I've given the assurance I will deal with it to the best of my ability or call in a professional to deal with it. We have also agreed that if he breaks anything, he replaces it or pays to get it repaired - that is obviously excluding anything that is not his fault, I'm talking about instances whereby he knocks something over and it smashes or he burns the crap out of my pots and they can't be used again.

In a nutshell it takes communication and common sense from both parties.
I mean I don't have a knicker fit when he wants to watch the footie, I can watch tv in my room, but on the flip side he also watches tv in his room when the girls are over for a bottle or three of wine and a few dvd's.

quietsailor · 13-11-2010 2:28pm

lau1247 wrote: »

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/renting_a_home/tenants_rights_and_obligations.html

There is a big difference between renting a room in a house where the landlord lives and renting a room in a house where the landlord DOESN'T live.

Your going to create problems for someone in the future who rents a room off an owner occupier thinking the PRTB rules apply to them by posting that link. The PRTB rules don't apply in owner occupier situations, the Revenue class the 2 types of renting differently as you have to pay tax on all income as a landlord but only on rental income above 10,000 in the case of an owner occupier, AFAIK the PRTB were originally set up by the revenue to monitor landlords.

The PRTB rules only apply to the non-domiciled landlord, in the owner occupier case its up to you and the person(s) you are sharing with (not just the landlord) to write down a set of rules and all stick to them.

And before you jump on me saying I don't know anything about this in the last 12 months I've been
1. a tenant
2. a landlord
3. I'm now living in my own house with 2 people renting rooms (owner occupier)

In the 3rd case we drew up a list of rules for the owner occupier scenario that are basically the old lease modified - noise, cleanliness, contents of the rooms, duties of the landlord, duties of the tenants etc.

As far as I'M concerned I'm sharing the house with 2 other people,as if we were all renting someone elses house together. The fact I'm the owner is immaterial when it comes to the TV/sitting room usage/cleaning etc - we all share equally.

The only time the fact I own the house comes up is when the rent is due or something needs to be fixed - both scenarios get my instant undivided attention

mood · 13-11-2010 2:29pm

smccarrick wrote: »

Rent allowance would not be acceptable, there is no tenancy lodged with the PRTB, you are entitled to claim a tax credit towards the 'rent' if you're working, and providing the gross 'rent' (which includes all bills) given to the landlord does not exceed 10k per annum- they do not have to pay tax on it (they do need to declare it however in an annual personal tax return).

This worries me. If anything were to happen my job (and lets face it anything is possible in the current climate) I would have no where to live!!! It seems a silly rule.

Hayzooz · 13-11-2010 2:37pm

smccarrick wrote: »

They are not landlords.
They are ordinary folk, letting a room in their home.
Likewise, the person taking the room is not a tenant.
Neither party are bound by tenancy law- alongside any of the rights or obligations it may infer on either of them.

Just because you or a friend may have had a bad experience in a situation like this- does not mean that someone else entering into a similar agreement would experience something similar.......

Yeah, yeah all well and good and politically correct as usual, but given a choice I would rent from a landlord who knows what he's doing, not from a chancer who can't pay his loans.

The_Conductor · 13-11-2010 2:45pm

Hayzooz wrote: »

Yeah, yeah all well and good and politically correct as usual, but given a choice I would rent from a landlord who knows what he's doing, not from a chancer who can't pay his loans.

You have no idea whether he/she can pay his or her loans. Many people rent a room out in their house to help fund a lifestyle they like to have- nothing whatsoever to do with an ability to repay their mortgage. I rented out a room in my home for a few years- and I was on a higher salary then than I'm on now- but I went on 4-5 foreign holidays a year, whereas now we have a baby and value our privacy more, and can survive on a lower income (and continue to pay all our bills and mortgage as they arise).

Certainly some people are in trouble with their mortgage- but to make a blanket claim that the reason many/most homeowners who let a room in their home are in mortgage difficulty really is not a valid inference.

The_Conductor · 13-11-2010 2:48pm

mood wrote: »

So, considering neither party are bound by tenancy law what right (if any) would the house/apt owner or I have?

The person who is taking the room is living with the owner 'under licence' and would agree to be bound by any rules they choose to impose on them. The owner- it is their private residence, and what they say goes. If a dispute arises between the person taking the room and the home owner- it is the perogative of the homeowner to ask the person to leave, and they can do so without notice. Normally a set of rules (House rules) would be agreed between the two in advance.

quietsailor · 13-11-2010 2:53pm

Hayzooz wrote: »

Yeah, yeah all well and good and politically correct as usual, but given a choice I would rent from a landlord who knows what he's doing, not from a chancer who can't pay his loans.

Bo**ix, unless you know what the circumstances are for each and every owner occupier then retract the statement I've bolded above.

In my own case I'm sick of renting poky little apartments which are all I can afford around UCC on the money I've budgeted. I don't want to house share as the majority of the house shares available are with 17-20 yr old and I'm 34, that is too big a difference in mentality for a peaceful house.

Instead I choose to live in my own house instead of renting it out to students and I choose to house share because the house is big enough and I like the company.

I'm LOSING money by doing this. I was financially better off last year to rent the house to students and find somewhere else to live myself.

So p*ss off and stop making grandiose sweeping statements about my circumstances,you know nothinbg about me.

John Mason · 13-11-2010 4:52pm

smccarrick wrote: »

Rent allowance would not be acceptable, there is no tenancy lodged with the PRTB, you are entitled to claim a tax credit towards the 'rent' if you're working, and providing the gross 'rent' (which includes all bills) given to the landlord does not exceed 10k per annum- they do not have to pay tax on it (they do need to declare it however in an annual personal tax return).

i dont think this is right, my lodger lost their job and they got rent allowance, i received a cheque every month toward the rent. i had to give them a letter saying that they rented a room from me and stating how much the rent was, i also had to show a copy of me deeds or a letter from my lender.

i have to say, if i had a choice , i would use an owner occupied house, say the heating breaks the owner is going to fix it fast, as they live there but if you are chasing a landlord, it could take forever.

i know my lodgers have the run of the house, we sitting in the sitting room together watching tv somethings we will do our shopping together or cook together etc.

mood · 13-11-2010 5:44pm

irishbird wrote: »

i dont think this is right, my lodger lost their job and they got rent allowance, i received a cheque every month toward the rent. i had to give them a letter saying that they rented a room from me and stating how much the rent was, i also had to show a copy of me deeds or a letter from my lender.

i have to say, if i had a choice , i would use an owner occupied house, say the heating breaks the owner is going to fix it fast, as they live there but if you are chasing a landlord, it could take forever.

i know my lodgers have the run of the house, we sitting in the sitting room together watching tv somethings we will do our shopping together or cook together etc.

Thats interesting. I'll make a few phone calls next week to confirm this just to be 100% sure just in case the worse came to the worse (fingers crossed it won't).

matamoros1965 · 13-11-2010 9:57pm

+1 on the previous posts about decent rent a room "landlords". A girl living with me now has asked can she claim back some money from the Revenue for the rent she's paid, will this impact me tax wise? Between two people, I don't get more than the allowed amount for a person who rents rooms, I didn't realise that you had to include that on your tax return as income, I am a PAYE employee. Any help/advice would be appreciated.

The_Conductor · 14-11-2010 9:45am

matamoros1965 wrote: »

+1 on the previous posts about decent rent a room "landlords". A girl living with me now has asked can she claim back some money from the Revenue for the rent she's paid, will this impact me tax wise? Between two people, I don't get more than the allowed amount for a person who rents rooms, I didn't realise that you had to include that on your tax return as income, I am a PAYE employee. Any help/advice would be appreciated.

You do have to do a tax return- ring the helpline for your tax district or hop onto Revenue Onlines website and download the PAYE return form- I think rental income is on the second last page.

She is entitled to contact Revenue for a credit, yes, and providing you haven't gone over the limit with gross receipts (incl. contributions for any bills) you are fine. You can retrospectively submit amended tax returns over 4 years to reflect the rent-a-room income.

um7y1h83ge06nx · 14-11-2010 1:36pm

My 2 cents.

People don't just rent out rooms because they are stuck.

I rent rooms in my house because I like the company. Of course it's brilliant that it contributes towards my mortgage as well. Even when rates were high I was able to pay the mortgage on my own (and thank god for that).

One thing I have noticed from talking to people is that things get a bit more difficult with owner occupiers if they haven't always rented rooms. They would have gotten used to living on their own and might not adjust well to new people moving in. But that's a bit of a generalisation of course.

I myself have never had the whole house to myself, there would always be at least one other living with me at any time, even when I first moved in I had someone lined up to move in too.

The big plus with living with an owner occupier is that things will definitely get fixed faster than the traditional landlord, tenant arrangement. Still at the end of the day, it all depends on the person and luck.

John Mason · 14-11-2010 3:55pm

matamoros1965 wrote: »

+1 on the previous posts about decent rent a room "landlords". A girl living with me now has asked can she claim back some money from the Revenue for the rent she's paid, will this impact me tax wise? Between two people, I don't get more than the allowed amount for a person who rents rooms, I didn't realise that you had to include that on your tax return as income, I am a PAYE employee. Any help/advice would be appreciated.

simple answer, if you receive less then 10,000e a year in rent, it wont be effect you in anyway.

if you earn over 10,000e you need to pay tax.

you still have to submit a tax return though

irishguy · 14-11-2010 8:30pm

To be honest if you treat the house/owner with respect you will be fine. Also chances are you will be able to live in a house thats much nicer furnished and all the extras you wouldn't normally get in a rented house.

Worst case scenario you just move out.

myxi · 15-11-2010 1:54pm

irishguy wrote: »

To be honest if you treat the house/owner with respect you will be fine. Also chances are you will be able to live in a house thats much nicer furnished and all the extras you wouldn't normally get in a rented house.

Worst case scenario you just move out.

I moved in with an owner/occupier about 2 months ago. I read a load of posts on boards about how horrible owner/occupiers can be and how they want you to live in your room etc. I have found the total opposite! The girl I live with is renting a room because she felt the apartment was too big and empty for just her.

I have to say we are getting on really well. Both of us are busy people so we're not both sitting watching telly all night every night which works out well! We have different working hours/cooking dinner times so it's going very smoothly.

I wouldn't rule out living with an owner/occupier outright because they tend to keep the place much nicer than a rented house with a landlord! Hope you find somewhere OP!

Hayzooz · 17-11-2010 12:37am

OP from reading this thread, you've got four options.

1. You can rent a room from hard-up types that can't pay their mortgage.

2. You can rent a room to subsidise someone's 3 to 4 to 5 holidays a year that they used to take until they had a baby ....blah blah life story...no one's listening.....zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

3. You can rent a room from those that rent rooms out in their own homes because they like the company. They have so little friends, that they charge people for company. Like Norman Bates.

4. Rent your own place from a proper landlord.

Choose: 4

um7y1h83ge06nx · 17-11-2010 10:18am

Ohh the burn!!

The_Conductor · 17-11-2010 11:26am

On that note, I think this thread has served its purpose. OP- if you'd like me to reopen this thread, please PM me.

Regards,

SMcCarrick

Renting a room in a 'owner occupied house/apartment'

Comments