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Strange verbs

  • 05-11-2015 10:32pm
    #1
    sryanbruen
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭


    Is there any other strange verbs I should know about other than the following?

    Tá a fhios ag - To know
    Tá ___ ag - To have
    Teastíonn(ím, ímid) ___ ó - To want

    Please let me know others!

    Like for past tense of "To know" do you simply say "bhí a fhios ag" - doesn't seem right to me :confused:.

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Comments

  • #2
    deirdremf
    Registered Users Posts: 1,871 ✭✭✭deirdremf


    sryanbruen wrote: »
    Is there any other strange verbs I should know about other than the following?

    Tá a fhios ag - To know
    Tá ___ ag - To have
    Teastíonn(ím, ímid) ___ ó - To want

    Please let me know others!

    English is full of verbs that take on another meaning when you use them with a preposition - as are most other European languages.
    For instance, you have
    put
    put on
    put off
    take
    take on
    take off
    And many many more.
    Like for past tense of "To know" do you simply say "bhí a fhios ag" - doesn't seem right to me confused.png.
    It is correct. e.g.
    Bhí a fhios agam go mbeadh fearg ar mo bhean.


  • #3
    sryanbruen
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭sryanbruen


    deirdremf wrote: »
    English is full of verbs that take on another meaning when you use them with a preposition - as are most other European languages.
    For instance, you have
    put
    put on
    put off
    take
    take on
    take off
    And many many more.


    It is correct. e.g.
    Bhí a fhios agam go mbeadh fearg ar mo bhean.

    The first doesn't answer my question :mad:. The second, ceart go leor, go raibh maith agat!

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  • #4
    FWVT
    Closed Accounts Posts: 922 ✭✭✭FWVT


    sryanbruen wrote: »
    The first doesn't answer my question :mad:. The second, ceart go leor, go raibh maith agat!

    Do you expect someone to list out a list of all the verbs in Irish? Irish is no different to English or other languages, as Deirdre said, so you will just pick them up as you come across them (note the many different uses of the verbs "pick" and "come" in that sentence).


  • #5
    sryanbruen
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭sryanbruen


    FWVT wrote: »
    Do you expect someone to list out a list of all the verbs in Irish? Irish is no different to English or other languages, as Deirdre said, so you will just pick them up as you come across them (note the many different uses of the verbs "pick" and "come" in that sentence).

    Yeah like they did here

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=75167774. And no I don't expect you to list ALL verbs with prepositions in Irish, just even a few that I haven't mentioned will do.

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  • #6
    pog it
    Registered Users Posts: 2,912 ✭✭✭pog it


    Try to get a copy of Nancy Stenson's grammar book with exercises. There was a good list of Irish verbs taking prepositions in it.
    But a lot of grammar books will have a section on this specifically.

    I know people don't bother with extra books like this one when in secondary school but they are really worth looking at if you want to get grasp of language or just be extra sure of B1 hons, or higher. I'd say the top schools are advising this or circulating this kind of material to students but it is accessible to all.


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  • #7
    sryanbruen
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭sryanbruen


    Do you know of any imperfect tense verbs? Like

    Rugadh - was born
    Leagadh - knocked down
    Tugadh - (don't know the English)

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  • #8
    Insect Overlord
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 30,856 Mod ✭✭✭✭Insect Overlord


    That's the saorbhriathar/an briathar saor.

    It can be formed with the following endings:
    - in the Aimsir Chaite with adh/eadh (for an Chéad Réimniú) and aíodh/íodh (for an Dara Réimniú)
    - in the Aimsir Láithreach with tar/tear (for an Chéad Réimniú) and aítear/ítear (for an Dara Réimniú)
    - in the Aimsir Fháistineach with far/fear (for an Chéad Réimniú) and ófar/eofar (for an Dara Réimniú)
    - in the Modh Coinníolhach with faí/fí (for an Chéad Réimniú) and ófaí/eofaí (for an Dara Réimniú)


  • #9
    sryanbruen
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭sryanbruen


    An File wrote: »
    That's the saorbhriathar/an briathar saor.

    It can be formed with the following endings:
    - in the Aimsir Chaite with adh/eadh (for an Chéad Réimniú) and aíodh/íodh (for an Dara Réimniú)
    - in the Aimsir Láithreach with tar/tear (for an Chéad Réimniú) and aítear/ítear (for an Dara Réimniú)
    - in the Aimsir Fháistineach with far/fear (for an Chéad Réimniú) and ófar/eofar (for an Dara Réimniú)
    - in the Modh Coinníolhach with faí/fí (for an Chéad Réimniú) and ófaí/eofaí (for an Dara Réimniú)

    Oh yeah sorry but do you know of any particular ones that should help me with essays or stories?

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  • #10
    Insect Overlord
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 30,856 Mod ✭✭✭✭Insect Overlord


    sryanbruen wrote: »
    Oh yeah sorry but do you know of any particular ones that should help me with essays or stories?

    That's a strange request. There are so many verbs in the language! The ones that would be helpful for a story or essay would depend entirely on the subject/theme of the composition.

    If you were really to press me for an answer, I'd say work on the Briathra Neamhrialta first. Irish, thankfully, only has 11 irregular verbs. They tend to be used rather frequently (e.g. to be, to do, to go, to get/find, to say) This page might be a good starting point. http://www.nualeargais.ie/foghlaim/irregular.php?teanga=


  • #11
    sryanbruen
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭sryanbruen


    An File wrote: »
    That's a strange request. There are so many verbs in the language! The ones that would be helpful for a story or essay would depend entirely on the subject/theme of the composition.

    If you were really to press me for an answer, I'd say work on the Briathra Neamhrialta first. Irish, thankfully, only has 11 irregular verbs. They tend to be used rather frequently (e.g. to be, to do, to go, to get/find, to say) This page might be a good starting point. http://www.nualeargais.ie/foghlaim/irregular.php?teanga=

    I know the Briathra Neamhrialta very well except for the Modh Coinníollach which I haven't learnt yet! The main subject I will use for almost any composition is I had an accident after describing the nice day it was and an ambulance took me to the hospital.

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  • #12
    Insect Overlord
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 30,856 Mod ✭✭✭✭Insect Overlord


    That reminds me, the Junior Cert is a disaster. Using one rote-learned story for any title is so educationally pointless. There no long-term benefit in it at all.

    /rant


  • #13
    sryanbruen
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭sryanbruen


    An File wrote: »
    That reminds me, the Junior Cert is a disaster. Using one rote-learned story for any title is so educationally pointless. There no long-term benefit in it at all.

    /rant

    I know, I definitely agree with that. I love learning Irish and I tried to talk sense into the Minister For Education twice and still no reply. I wish Irish weren't so horrifically taught and which is why students go leaving school not knowing a clue about Irish. You:

    *Are forced to learn Poetry and Proses in which students haven't a clue what they're writing or reading.
    *Don't learn all the Grammar you should know - for example, Comparative and Superlative adjectives.
    *Are forced to listen to a tape which is hard to understand and plus you put your answers down in Irish..?

    Two sections of the JC that I agree with whilst the rest are literally crap:

    *Litir - could be a bit better though
    *Trialacha Teanga Comthéacsula - could be more grammar questions, however.

    Ceapadóireacht could be a lot better also and you shouldn't write every story or essay on an accident that happened to you - I like writing interesting stories with not the same subject all the time. Like for my own time, I wrote an Irish poem called 'Cá nDeachaigh Tú'? - Where did you go? and it is about my nanny whom has left us for 3 years now and she was a very important friend to us all - especially me - everybody agrees, I am not just saying that. How did I write this poem in Irish? Because I taught myself the sentences!! and not school - this shows how bad the teaching of Irish is!

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  • #14
    pog it
    Registered Users Posts: 2,912 ✭✭✭pog it


    Find yourself a good grinds teacher and ask in advance for this help specifically so that they can prepare and you can save money.

    You are going about this in the right way in having unusual words and verbs in addition to all of the general stock vocab you would you use anyway. Examiners will be impressed with this (provided you are ticking all the other boxes, but you already know that :)).

    And you will leave school with better Irish and more importantly learning skills that will be more useful than the language itself. If you can, maybe start a learning blog or make your own custom grammar book, will help you write this stuff to your memory.


  • #15
    sryanbruen
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭sryanbruen


    pog it wrote: »
    Find yourself a good grinds teacher and ask in advance for this help specifically so that they can prepare and you can save money.

    You are going about this in the right way in having unusual words and verbs in addition to all of the general stock vocab you would you use anyway. Examiners will be impressed with this (provided you are ticking all the other boxes, but you already know that :)).

    And you will leave school with better Irish and more importantly learning skills that will be more useful than the language itself. If you can, maybe start a learning blog or make your own custom grammar book, will help you write this stuff to your memory.

    My own grammar book, something like this... I am doing?

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  • #16
    pog it
    Registered Users Posts: 2,912 ✭✭✭pog it


    Seriously.. that is brilliant. You have a grammar and exercise book in one going there. That is even better than just compiling a general reference book of grammar.

    Also, never let any other students get you down about being studious should that surface for you at any point. Kids are vindictive in their jealousy and it gets nastier nearer exam times and after junior cert. Tell them nothing about your extra studies such as this. They won't get it and may persecute you later for it. I took my teacher's advice when I was learning French in school and got myself a verbs book, just a pocket one with lists of conjugations, and that was incredibly helpful. So just swot away but be cute about it, unlike me lol

    Also learning the gender of nouns will go a long way as well, most people never bother with this so they don't know how or when to change the spelling of the noun after the article 'an' (the). Different rules apply to nouns starting with a vowel, and nouns in the plural, so check them all out, they are easy to memorise with small amount of practice.

    Also, the rules around prepositions will help too. Something as simple as knowing how to correctly change the noun after a preposition and article... e.g. leis an gcarr, as an ngeata, etc. and then with plural form as na, leis na, etc.- no change to noun following after this.


  • #17
    sryanbruen
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭sryanbruen


    Is there a verb in Irish for the english counterpart "To turn"?

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  • #18
    Insect Overlord
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 30,856 Mod ✭✭✭✭Insect Overlord


    sryanbruen wrote: »
    Is there a verb in Irish for the english counterpart "To turn"?
    "Cas" http://www.teanglann.ie/en/gram/cas

    There's an option half-way down that page that lets you see the conjugation of the verb in different tenses.


  • #19
    sryanbruen
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭sryanbruen


    An File wrote: »
    "Cas" http://www.teanglann.ie/en/gram/cas

    There's an option half-way down that page that lets you see the conjugation of the verb in different tenses.

    Go raibh mile maith agat, An File!

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  • #20
    An gal gréine
    Registered Users Posts: 941 ✭✭✭An gal gréine


    Also there is
    Tiontaigh


  • #21
    Acciaccatura
    Registered Users Posts: 428 ✭✭Acciaccatura


    To answer your original question, I'll give you some verbs that I can think of requiring more than one grammar component:

    "I miss him/it" - "Braitheann sé uaim" (the verb "braith" + noun + the appropriate "ó")

    Note the differences here:
    "I know a person" - Tá aithne agam ar Seán (literally, something along the lines of "I have recognition of Seán")
    "I know that you have a cat"/"I know THAT, I'm not stupid" - Tá a fhios agam go bhfuil cat agat/Tá a fhios agam é sin, níl mé dúr.
    "I know Bohemian Rhapsody on the piano"/"I know the conditional tense" - Tá "Bohemian Rhapsody" ar eolas agam ar an bpianó/ Tá an Modh Conniollach ar eolas agam

    The differences between "I am ____" with adjectives vs. nouns is always, ALWAYS confused. I'm clearing it up now (maybe you already know it)
    "I am cold"/"I was young" - "Tá mé fuar"/ "Bhí mé óg"
    "I am a student"/ "I was a doctor" - "Is dalta mé"/"Ba dochtúir mé" (You can also use the phrase "Tá mé i mo dhochtúir" to say "I am a doctor")

    Everyone else is right, though, you will pick it up as you go along. It's nice to immerse yourself in books, TG4, Radió na Gaeltachta, tuairisc.ie and analyse anything you don't understand. Don't get too bogged down in the nitty-gritty of grammar, it will come :)


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  • #22
    hullaballoo
    Administrators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 18,707 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭hullaballoo


    I was always taught, "Is [noun] é"..."Tá sé [adjective]."

    It was helpful that my teacher was from West Belfast, a catholic version of Paisley and would repeat the two over and over while banging the desk like a drum. Maybe picture that, and you won't have a problem with it in future. Unless of course you have difficulty telling a noun from an adjective in a split-second, which wouldn't be that unusual these days.


  • #23
    Acciaccatura
    Registered Users Posts: 428 ✭✭Acciaccatura


    Ooh, I just thought of more verbs:

    "Ag baint le___" - Dealing with _____
    "Baineann an scéal leis an téama seo" - "The story deals with this theme" (common sentence in Irish essays)

    "Bhain mé mo chóta díom" - I took my coat off me

    Same verb (bain), but when used with a different preposition (in this case, "de"), it can have a totally different meaning. This principle applies to lots of verbs, that they must be used with the correct prepositional pronoun.

    "Féach", for example, is the verb "to look" but it must be used in conjunction with "ar", and not just translated directly. In English we say "I looked at the telly" and might be inclined to translate it as "D'fhéach mé ag an teilifís", but this is wrong. The Irish phrase is "I looked on the telly" ( "D'fhéach mé ar an teilifís" ), and you really just have to accept that that is how it's said in Irish and that it's totally normal. Being aware of different phrasing meaning the same thing might help you remember what preposition goes with which verb.

    Inis + do - "insíonn sí dom" - she tells me
    Deir + le - "Deireann sí liom" - she says to me
    Bhuail + nothing - "Bhuail mé Seán" - I hit Seán
    Bhuail + le - "Bhuail mé le Seán" - I met Seán

    Again, you'll pick this up as you go along, so don't worry :)


  • #24
    sryanbruen
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭sryanbruen


    Is there a verb in English that Bain is used for most frequently? It seems like there are about 100 translations of the verb! :confused:

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  • #25
    Comhairleoir
    Registered Users Posts: 45 ✭Comhairleoir


    sryanbruen wrote: »
    Is there a verb in English that Bain is used for most frequently? It seems like there are about 100 translations of the verb! :confused:

    There are. It's like Get. See http://www.focloir.ie/en/search/ei/adv?q=bain&inlanguage=ga&searchin=&pos=&subject=&style=

    You can also register for the corpus (corpas.focloir.ie), do a word sketch, and find out what words go with each other the most (collocations).

    For example, here are some common words that go with Bain. The higher the number the higher, the frequency.


    úsáid 1327 10.94
    geit 359 10.24
    leas 657 10.18
    taitneamh 310 9.9
    sult 220 9.44
    triail 187 9.13
    feidhm 359 8.72
    preab 111 8.58
    stangadh 81 8.17
    craobh 120 7.91
    sásamh 65 7.7
    stad 65 7.68
    díoltas 57 7.53
    tairbhe 57 7.47
    tuisle 46 7.36
    céim 75 7.28
    cloigeann 55 7.26
    sásaigh 35 6.85
    greim 48 6.82
    mí-úsáid 34 6.81
    cál 35 6.64
    pléisiúr 29 6.62
    anáil 31 6.59
    sprioc 29 6.52
    cuspóir 33 6.5


  • #26
    sryanbruen
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭sryanbruen


    How do you express ownership in Irish? Plus if you wouldn't mind.... is this grammatically correct?

    Bhí triúr fir i gcúl an veain Gardaí. Bhí an fhuinneog bainc a bhriseadh. D'aimsigh na Gardaí gunnaí sa bhainc. Bhí céasadh ar aon duine, buíochas le Dia. Bhí eagla ar oibrí amháin an bainc. Bhí an scéal a d'inis don Gardaí. Ghlac na Gardaí na fir do chúirt. D'fhág gach duine an limistéar agus chuaigh siad abhaile. Nuair a bhfuair mé abhaile, d'inis mé gach duine an scéal. Bhí osna faoiseamh orainn mar a bhí mé sábháilte. Tháinig ar an nuacht ina dhiadh tamaill. Dúirt siad go raibh an triúr fear go príosúin. Bhí gach duine sábháilte ansin, buíochas le Dia.

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  • #27
    sryanbruen
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭sryanbruen


    sryanbruen wrote: »
    How do you express ownership in Irish? Plus if you wouldn't mind.... is this grammatically correct?

    Bhí triúr fir i gcúl an veain Gardaí. Bhí an fhuinneog bainc a bhriseadh. D'aimsigh na Gardaí gunnaí sa bhainc. Bhí céasadh ar aon duine, buíochas le Dia. Bhí eagla ar oibrí amháin an bainc. Bhí an scéal a d'inis don Gardaí. Ghlac na Gardaí na fir do chúirt. D'fhág gach duine an limistéar agus chuaigh siad abhaile. Nuair a bhfuair mé abhaile, d'inis mé gach duine an scéal. Bhí osna faoiseamh orainn mar a bhí mé sábháilte. Tháinig ar an nuacht ina dhiadh tamaill. Dúirt siad go raibh an triúr fear go príosúin. Bhí gach duine sábháilte ansin, buíochas le Dia.

    Anybody, please what is the verb To own in Irish?

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  • #28
    Insect Overlord
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 30,856 Mod ✭✭✭✭Insect Overlord


    sryanbruen wrote: »
    Anybody, please what is the verb To own in Irish?

    I could have sworn I'd answered this question for you before, but I can't find the post!

    There is no verb in Irish for "own".

    You can either use the Tuiseal Ginideach (by combining the thing that is owned, and the genitive spelling of the owner/second noun) or by using the preposition "le".


  • #29
    Comhairleoir
    Registered Users Posts: 45 ✭Comhairleoir


    sryanbruen wrote: »
    Anybody, please what is the verb To own in Irish?

    Cuireadh na triúr fear i gcúl veain na nGardaí. Bhí fuinneog an bhainc briste. D'aimsigh na Gardaí gunnaí sa bhanc. Níor gortaíodh aon duine, buíochas le Dia. Bhí eagla ar oibrí bainc amháin. D'inis sí an scéal (céard a tharla) do na Gardaí. Tugadh na fir os comhair na cúirte. D'fhág gach duine an áit agus chuaigh siad abhaile. Nuair a tháinigmé abhaile, d'inis mé an scéal do gach duine. Ligeamar go léir osna faoisimh mar a bhí mé slán sábháilte. Thosaigh an nuacht tamall ina dhiaidh sin. Dúirt siad go raibh gur cuireadh na triúr fear i bpriosún. Bhí gach duine sábháilte ansin, buíochas le Dia.


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