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21-12-2018, 10:06   #16
DS86DS
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Liberal Leftists today are anything but Liberal. They get their beliefs from the Frankfurt School of thought and other quasi Communist organisations.

The Classical Liberalism of Voltaire and Thomas Jefferson meant freedom in all areas of life, including Freedom of Speech and Freedom of the Press.

Leftists today not only hate these freedoms, but hate great men like Voltaire and Jefferson as evil old white men.

Thankfully though we now have the internet, and are not dependent for all of our news from the Liberal mainstream media. Though Leftists are now looking to censor dissenting opinions on the internet as well. Just look at what happened to Alex Jones and Infowars.

Leftists are all about censorship, virtue signalling and witch hunting.
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21-12-2018, 10:09   #17
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There seems to be a trend of those who claim to be liberal but are completely intolerant of those who dont share their own world outlook. They are liberal as long as you agree with them but if anyone so much as strays from their own group think they are attacked, slandered and censored. Why are so many self proclaimed liberals in favour of tighter censorship laws and clamping down on freedom of speech, which is an essence of a true liberal society. Surely being liberal means supporting free speech whether you agree with it or not. The fact is liberalism is about supporting free speech and expression and opposing censorship which is the exact opposite to what so many who claim to be on the liberal spectrum have proposed. It seems liberalism has been hijacked by SJWs and college students, in favour of identity politics which is anything but liberal. Its time real liberals stood up and defended the true liberal values of freedom of speech and democracy.

you really need to read this. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance
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21-12-2018, 10:11   #18
Chips Lovell
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Liberals? SJWs?

There seems to be a trend of Irish people who get caught up in American culture wars BS.
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21-12-2018, 10:22   #19
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It can also be a cover for bullying. The social justice bully. As in, latching onto genuine social causes and using them as a shield for abusive bullying behavior. The causes themselves give power. By exploiting genuine social causes it provides a bully a ready made deterrent from those who might react, argue or attempt to debate them, the benefit being that the person reacting is actually calling the bully to account for their poison but that reality can be readily distorted into being an attack on the social cause itself. Such cover allows toxic individuals free reign to be toxic individuals and get away with flagrant, incendiary behavior.

We saw a good example of this with the Margaret Cash affair. There is a homeless problem clearly. Any one questioning that this might be a publicity stunt was pounced on. Anyone going against the homeless crisis diddums and giving some critical opinions seemed to be automatically someone who didn't care about the homeless crisis/was a hateful person criticizing a mother/hated travellers etc.

Last edited by valoren; 21-12-2018 at 10:33.
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21-12-2018, 10:29   #20
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Since when has all this talk of liberals and conservatives become a thing? Do families sit around discussing liberals vs conservatives at dinner or do friends hang out in the pub discussing left vs right policies? Does this kind of thing really keep people up at night?

Dear god. I consider myself a bit of a boring arsehole but I look at what people posting online seem to think as normal conversation and suddenly I feel better about myself.
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21-12-2018, 10:40   #21
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Since when has all this talk of liberals and conservatives become a thing? Do families sit around discussing liberals vs conservatives at dinner or do friends hang out in the pub discussing left vs right policies? Does this kind of thing really keep people up at night?

Dear god. I consider myself a bit of a boring arsehole but I look at what people posting online seem to think as normal conversation and suddenly I feel better about myself.
I think a lot of people are binging on nonsense US fake news sites like InfoWars and it's turning their brains into mush.
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21-12-2018, 10:43   #22
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Since when has all this talk of liberals and conservatives become a thing? Do families sit around discussing liberals vs conservatives at dinner or do friends hang out in the pub discussing left vs right policies? Does this kind of thing really keep people up at night?

Dear god. I consider myself a bit of a boring arsehole but I look at what people posting online seem to think as normal conversation and suddenly I feel better about myself.
Its mostly losers who spend too much time on 4chan.
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21-12-2018, 10:46   #23
DS86DS
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Liberals? SJWs?

There seems to be a trend of Irish people who get caught up in American culture wars BS.
Maybe because we are now suffering a culture war of the Left on Irish tradition and nationhood?

Liberal and SJWs are terms used in many countries including Ireland.... Americans don't have some kind of ownership of the terms.
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21-12-2018, 10:47   #24
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People should stop with the f*cking labeling already.
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21-12-2018, 10:48   #25
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Maybe because we are now suffering a culture war of the Left on Irish tradition and nationhood?

Liberal and SJWs are terms used in many countries including Ireland.... Americans don't have some kind of ownership of the terms.
The ‘left’ being just normal people living their lives?
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21-12-2018, 10:48   #26
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Originally Posted by DS86DS View Post
Liberal Leftists today are anything but Liberal. They get their beliefs from the Frankfurt School of thought and other quasi Communist organisations.

The Classical Liberalism of Voltaire and Thomas Jefferson meant freedom in all areas of life, including Freedom of Speech and Freedom of the Press.

Leftists today not only hate these freedoms, but hate great men like Voltaire and Jefferson as evil old white men.

Thankfully though we now have the internet, and are not dependent for all of our news from the Liberal mainstream media. Though Leftists are now looking to censor dissenting opinions on the internet as well. Just look at what happened to Alex Jones and Infowars.

Leftists are all about censorship, virtue signalling and witch hunting.
Voltaire was a staunch advocate of "Enlightened Absolutism" - i.e absolute rule by a well educated monarch advised by a philosopher - such as himself. An Absolute Monarch for those unsure of what the term means is a monarch who is not bound by the law as he (or she) embodies the law. It's a bit of mental gymnastics up there with the RCC's "mental reservations".

Thomas Jefferson was able to find time to write all his fine words as the slaves he owned were doing all the actual work of providing him with an income. He has many African American descendants today - seems impregnating women you literally owned was ok according to Jefferson's world view.

There are the best examples you could find?
A man who believed absolute and inherited power was the best way to govern and a man who was so hypocritical that when he wrote of all men being born equal he was able to deny the humanity of the black men (and women and children - including the ones he fathered) he owned.

The believed in Freedom in all areas of life me hole.

The rest of your post is even more poorly thought out and not worth responding to.
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21-12-2018, 10:50   #27
Chips Lovell
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I've never heard anyone use these terms offline. It's a sure-fire sign that you're spending too much time online and not enough living in the real world.
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21-12-2018, 11:04   #28
Bannasidhe
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Maybe because we are now suffering a culture war of the Left on Irish tradition and nationhood?

Liberal and SJWs are terms used in many countries including Ireland.... Americans don't have some kind of ownership of the terms.
Do you mean those lefties like James Connelly who literally began the Rising the lead to this Irish Nationhood you are banging on about?

Or those Ulster Presbyterian lefties who first conceived of an Irish Republic?*

Maybe it's that certainly not a rightie Robert Emmet with his dreams of a united Ireland who is proving to be such a bad influence? *

You might wish to stop learning history off the internet or at least learn it from sites that have .edu in their address rather than .altrightbolex

*about as contemporary as Voltaire or Jefferson so according to your previous example of top blokes we can use them.
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21-12-2018, 11:06   #29
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There seems to be a trend of those who claim to be liberal but are completely intolerant of those who dont share their own world outlook. They are liberal as long as you agree with them but if anyone so much as strays from their own group think they are attacked, slandered and censored. Why are so many self proclaimed liberals in favour of tighter censorship laws and clamping down on freedom of speech, which is an essence of a true liberal society. Surely being liberal means supporting free speech whether you agree with it or not. The fact is liberalism is about supporting free speech and expression and opposing censorship which is the exact opposite to what so many who claim to be on the liberal spectrum have proposed. It seems liberalism has been hijacked by SJWs and college students, in favour of identity politics which is anything but liberal. Its time real liberals stood up and defended the true liberal values of freedom of speech and democracy.
True free speech is an illusion. Even in the United States.

We all have thoughts and opinions that others will disagree with and some thoughts and opinions that may be considered controversial.

Given the current climate, you have to weigh up whether or not it is prudent to express these opinions. This shouldn't apply if we had true freedom of speech.

When you consider that playing "fairytale of New York" and "Rudolph the red nosed Reindeer" are almost considered hate speech by some of the delicate souls that exist, you're probably wise to keep your opinions to yourself.
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21-12-2018, 11:07   #30
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The whole description of those on the left, and especially hard left, as liberals is something that has me bugged as well. I always thought those with a liberal outlook on life would be described as someone who would be of the idea of live and let live and don't interfere with someone's personal choices or their personal views.

Both sides, left and right, rarely, if ever, stand for that at all. It's always about what should be allowed, what should be banned, what should be said, what shouldn't be said with them.

Take the Bruce/Caitlyn Jenner scenario. Those on the right condemning him/her as some sort of destroyer of morality for having the cheek to talk about trans issues and women's and homosexual rights, all while in a dress. They would love nothing more than to see Jenner banned from TV.

Even more nauseating is the left, who refuse to acknowledge that he's not actually a woman, but a man with implanted tits. And while he speaks well about important issues, it doesn't change the fact that he's a man, even if he identifies as a woman, so crying foul over people actually pointing this out and wanting them banned for doing so is no different to the "ban him for the greater good" culture to those on the right.

It's not actually about freedom of speech or freedom of ideas and thoughts, it's about control of them for their own ideology.

Whereas a genuine liberal couldn't give a f*ck either way, they would say Jenner may be a man but he's his own self, let Jenner have his tits and call himself what or who he wants, its his body and as long as he's not hurting anyone then who really cares.

Last edited by randd1; 21-12-2018 at 11:11.
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