Building a fence higher than 2 metres

DeWanderer · 23-05-2020 3:44pm #1

Hello,

TLDNR: can I build a fence on my side of the boundary block wall higher than 2 metres (boundary between my garden and my neighbour's garden)?

Long version!:
I'm aware that the maximum height for a boundary wall or fence is 2 metres in between back gardens.

I've been having an issue with new neighbours, who moved in a few weeks ago. We're in neighbouring semi-detached houses in Dublin.

I don't want to go in to specifics but basically neither us nor our children feel comfortable in our back garden. The neighbour and his friends are the most undesirable you could meet. I'd normally have a friendly chat with people, but believe me, these are the sort where this is impossible.

There is a very low boundary wall and I intend making a higher "screen". It would need to be at least 3 metres high to be effective, due to the lay of the land.

If I build a fence entirely on my side of the boundary would this be against planning at 3 metres?

The fence posts would be concreted into the ground and possibly attached to the wall on my side. I'd probably start the timber panels a couple of feet off the ground, so that the block wall is still the obvious boundary. Also I'd not have the fence the entire length of the wall, as another clear indicator that the fence is not a marking of a new boundary (so that no one could ever knock the wall and claim some of my garden, claiming the fence is the new boundary).

Thanks

BryanF · 24-05-2020 5:50am

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2001/si/600/made/en/print#sched2

2m max height at rear of house. See class 5

DeWanderer · 24-05-2020 9:04am

BryanF wrote: »

2m max height at rear of house. See class 5

Thanks. I was hoping that if it was fully on my side of the boundary (in my garden) that it could be higher. I'll have to rethink.

sydthebeat · 24-05-2020 9:43am

DeWanderer wrote: »

Thanks. I was hoping that if it was fully on my side of the boundary (in my garden) that it could be higher. I'll have to rethink.

If its fully on your side, then it's not a boundary wall......

Nothing stopping you from applying for permission, or retention permission

GerardKeating · 24-05-2020 11:12am

DeWanderer wrote: »

I don't want to go in to specifics but basically neither us nor our children feel comfortable in our back garden.

Is the issue security or privacy ?

sydthebeat wrote: »

Nothing stopping you from applying for permission, or retention permission

If the "new neighbour and his friends" are as undesirableas the OP suggests, they might object

sydthebeat · 24-05-2020 11:32am

GerardKeating wrote: »

Is the issue security or privacy ?

If the "new neighbour and his friends" are as undesirableas the OP suggests, they might object

as they have the right to... everyone is the same in regards to their rights

thats doesnt at all mean that the development will be refused.

You can build a 3.0m high wall if youre building an extension and the neighbour cannot object, so there is no guarantee that a 3m high screen would be refused

Mellor · 24-05-2020 11:39am

DeWanderer wrote: »

I'm aware that the maximum height for a boundary wall or fence is 2 metres in between back gardens.

That's the height without permission.

There is no maximum possible those.
As suggested, app for permission and go higher if you need to.

GerardKeating wrote: »

If the "new neighbour and his friends" are as undesirableas the OP suggests, they might object

If they are as undesirable as suggest they won't even notice the application going in

DeWanderer · 25-05-2020 9:01am

Thanks for all of the replies. The main issue is privacy. Security hasn't become an issue, as of yet. I'll have a think about it and may go with 2m or put in an application for 2.5m or a bit higher.

JackMN · 28-05-2020 11:25am

DeWanderer wrote: »

Thanks for all of the replies. The main issue is privacy. Security hasn't become an issue, as of yet. I'll have a think about it and may go with 2m or put in an application for 2.5m or a bit higher.

Hi - what did you decide to do? I'm in a similar situation...

Doop · 28-05-2020 12:34pm

Mellor wrote: »

That's the height without permission.

If they are as undesirable as suggest they won't even notice the application going in

I think the above is a very relevant point here... I doubt they would be bothered to inform themselves that your fence is too high... I also cant imagine the county council get many applications for boundary walls within housing estate back gardens.. yet many are over 2m... curious isnt it...;)

Furthermore would you plant something like bamboo which is fast growing and will provide further screening?

Mellor · 28-05-2020 1:24pm

Doop wrote: »

II also cant imagine the county council get many applications for boundary walls within housing estate back gardens.. yet many are over 2m... curious isnt it...;)

Boundary walls as part of the original application are no limited to 2m. Only subsequent walls by owner.

golfhead · 28-05-2020 1:34pm

1. Is planning permission needed to build a wall higher than 2 metres even if your neighbours have no objection?

2. Is PP required if you want to build a 3m wall inside the boundary line and fully on your own property?

sydthebeat · 28-05-2020 1:50pm

golfhead wrote: »

1. Is planning permission needed to build a wall higher than 2 metres even if your neighbours have no objection?

2. Is PP required if you want to build a 3m wall inside the boundary line and fully on your own property?

1. Yes.

2. Yes.

On 2, the only way you can build a 3.0 m high wall is if it's part of an exempt extension

JackMN · 28-05-2020 2:02pm

sydthebeat wrote: »

1. Yes.

2. Yes.

On 2, the only way you can build a 3.0 m high wall is if it's part of an exempt extension

What about a situation where the ground in one garden is higher than the other? I want to put up a fence that will be 2m tall as measured by my neighbour, but 2.3m tall measured from the garden on my side...

Lumen · 28-05-2020 2:40pm

JackMN wrote: »

What about a situation where the ground in one garden is higher than the other? I want to put up a fence that will be 2m tall as measured by my neighbour, but 2.3m tall measured from the garden on my side...

That would be a 2.3m fence on your side, so requires planning.

You can, AFAIK, build a fence on top of a berm, as long as the berm is less than 1m tall. But I could be wrong on that, I think the regs are worded so as to be a little vague as to where the measurement starts.

JackMN · 28-05-2020 3:08pm

Lumen wrote: »

That would be a 2.3m fence on your side, so requires planning.

You can, AFAIK, build a fence on top of a berm, as long as the berm is less than 1m tall. But I could be wrong on that, I think the regs are worded so as to be a little vague as to where the measurement starts.

Thanks. I've no experience of the process involved so forgive the question: could I put it up at 2.3m as measured from my side and then apply for retention permission, rather than waiting for planning permission to come through? Do you think I should do a section 5?

The 0.3m is the what I need to break eye level contact with the neighbour.

Yellow_Fern · 31-05-2020 9:13pm

What happens when the ground varies a lot on the two sides of the wall?

Lumen · 31-05-2020 9:21pm

Yellow_Fern wrote: »

What happens when the ground varies a lot on the two sides of the wall?

The height is measured from the lowest point.

Yellow_Fern · 31-05-2020 9:28pm

Lumen wrote: »

The height is measured from the lowest point.

Woah that really is unfortunate. Thanks for the answer

TheW1zard · 01-06-2020 12:03am

What about putting fencing on top of the wall?
So say 500mm fence on a 2m wall?

sasta le · 01-06-2020 12:08am

Can you grow a bush or ivy?

Markcheese · 01-06-2020 12:22am

TheW1zard wrote: »

What about putting fencing on top of the wall?
So say 500mm fence on a 2m wall?

Then that'd be 2.5 meters ....
But as said above ,2 meter fence on a 1 meter eathen bank would probably be classes as 2 meters...

Plants growing up a 2 m fence could easy give you an extra 50 centimeters too... ( And break up a fence line so you don't feel walled in )

sydthebeat · 01-06-2020 1:48am

Yellow_Fern wrote: »

What happens when the ground varies a lot on the two sides of the wall?

You apply for permission.

Planning is not a zero sum game

Mellor · 01-06-2020 4:23am

Lumen wrote: »

The height is measured from the lowest point.

Do you have a reference for that?
It may well exist, but I don't remember any restriction in schedule 2

wotzgoingon · 01-06-2020 4:56am

Reminds me of a neighbour years ago put two extra blocks on the walls in his back garden. I'm pretty sure the wall when finished was over 2m. No planning permission and I doubt anyone informed the council.

Quantum Erasure · 01-06-2020 5:31am

sydthebeat wrote: »

1. Yes.

2. Yes.

On 2, the only way you can build a 3.0 m high wall is if it's part of an exempt extension

what counts as an extension...

Mellor · 01-06-2020 5:40am

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

what counts as an extension...

There's no specific definition of extension in the regulations. But I'd have thought it's a fairly unambiguous term. Not sure what angle you are getting at.

Quantum Erasure · 01-06-2020 5:45am

would just a wall count? (altough i see if over ground floor level it has to be at least 2m from any boundary, so kinda rules that out)

Lumen · 01-06-2020 6:48am

Mellor wrote: »

Do you have a reference for that?
It may well exist, but I don't remember any restriction in schedule 2

If the ground undulates and the fence is straight, the fence will vary in height, and the highest part needs to comply.

If one part contravenes, it needs planning.

Unless you jigsaw the top of the fence...

Even varying the ground level is dodgy, ISTR something about "original ground level".

Of course one could just ask the council....

Lumen · 01-06-2020 6:55am

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

would just a wall count? (altough i see if over ground floor level it has to be at least 2m from any boundary, so kinda rules that out)

The ultimate planning hack is a 4m pitched roof single storey shed, 50cm deep, for example. That will cover 50m of boundary and is exempted development.

Due to the narrow depth the rear wall can be over 3.5m tall.

Your neighbours will love you...

Mellor · 01-06-2020 9:07am

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

would just a wall count? (altough i see if over ground floor level it has to be at least 2m from any boundary, so kinda rules that out)

That wouldn't comply as it's not an extension. It's a wall external to the building

Building a fence higher than 2 metres

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