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Planning permission - repossession sale

  • 07-05-2020 5:10pm
    #1
    Niall O Laoghaire
    Registered Users Posts: 10 ✭


    Hi all
    We have sale agreed on a repossession sale with a mortgage. We have to get all the correct planning certs ourselves (in order to draw down the mortage cheque) & our survey says that the front door (currently flush with the outer wall) needs to restored to its original position about 1.5m back so there's a porch once again. No planning was obtained for this change. The current door position has been the same since at least 2009 and numerous houses on the road have the done the same thing. Should I be looking at a second opinion?

    The receivers are prepared to make the alteration but only if we pay for it

    Thx in advance Niall


Comments

  • #2
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,429 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Niall O Laoghaire wrote: »
    Hi all
    We have sale agreed on a repossession sale with a mortgage. We have to get all the correct planning certs ourselves (in order to draw down the mortage cheque) & our survey says that the front door (currently flush with the outer wall) needs to restored to its original position about 1.5m back so there's a porch once again. No planning was obtained for this change. The current door position has been the same since at least 2009 and numerous houses on the road have the done the same thing. Should I be looking at a second opinion?

    The receivers are prepared to make the alteration but only if we pay for it

    Thx in advance Niall

    It’s possible it was moved out (like 1000’s others) in line and if so, this should fall under the exempted development regulations for porches.

    You should just require an opinion on compliance with the exempted development regulations.

    Couple of hundred euro to an architect, engineer or surveyor should sort this with no works at all.


  • #3
    BryanF
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 10,140 Mod ✭✭✭✭BryanF


    What does you solicitor have to say? Does your bank/mortgage lender care?


  • #4
    Niall O Laoghaire
    Registered Users Posts: 10 ✭Niall O Laoghaire


    Thx for the replies, yes the bank wants exemption certs before they'll drawdown the cheque. The receivers will do nothing to expediate the process nor make any alterations to the house pre-sale, plus there are other conveyancing duties they are refusing to deal with as well.

    Advise from the solicitor is to get another survey opinion - more money down the drain.

    The whole process has been very disheartening, our solicitor told us that possession sales are difficult when there's a mortgage involved - better cash sales.


  • #5
    Metric Tensor
    Registered Users Posts: 3,724 ✭✭✭Metric Tensor


    Your solicitor is correct - possession and distressed sales do not match well with people getting mortgages because in general they are sold "warts and all" and hence the buyer is taking more risk. Cash buyers are able to accept the risk themselves but lending institutions don't want the risk and hence you end up in the situation you are in.

    To be honest, I'm surprised you got this far. Had you been a client of mine I would have told you to stay away from it completely unless you were a cash buyer.

    Is the porch the only non-compliant issue? If so, then a second opinion might help. If there are other non-compliances in terms of planning or building regulation compliance then you might be wasting your money pursuing it further.


  • #6
    Niall O Laoghaire
    Registered Users Posts: 10 ✭Niall O Laoghaire


    Thx Metric

    There's also a garden shed which exceeds 25 sq. m. I'm currently awaiting advise from the solicitor whether it's worth getting another survey - the only thing more the new surveyor can commit to is guaranteeing they are over 7 years old. My reading is that this is not adequate for the bank & they require 'clean' planning - exemptions & certs.

    The receivers will not do any building work pre-sale. Would it be worth asking them to try & apply for planning retention?

    Another issue is a title deed missing which my solicitor is trying to sort with the receivers solicitor.


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  • #7
    Niall O Laoghaire
    Registered Users Posts: 10 ✭Niall O Laoghaire


    Would be legal commitment to get planning retention or do repairs after the sale be enough for the bank?

    As you might of guessed we really want this house, near our daughter's school & friends, good price, nice neighbourhood...


  • #8
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,429 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Niall O Laoghaire wrote: »
    Thx Metric

    There's also a garden shed which exceeds 25 sq. m. I'm currently awaiting advise from the solicitor whether it's worth getting another survey - the only thing more the new surveyor can commit to is guaranteeing they are over 7 years old. My reading is that this is not adequate for the bank & they require 'clean' planning - exemptions & certs.

    The receivers will not do any building work pre-sale. Would it be worth asking them to try & apply for planning retention?

    Another issue is a title deed missing which my solicitor is trying to sort with the receivers solicitor.

    Retention permission required for shed.
    It will take 4-5 months to regularize.

    Allowing for survey, plans, lodgement and additional delays due to C19 regulations for public notice periods.


  • #9
    BryanF
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 10,140 Mod ✭✭✭✭BryanF


    Niall O Laoghaire wrote: »
    Would be legal commitment to get planning retention or do repairs after the sale be enough for the bank?

    As you might of guessed we really want this house, near our daughter's school & friends, good price, nice neighbourhood...

    Ask the bank that

    If you want it by it


  • #10
    Niall O Laoghaire
    Registered Users Posts: 10 ✭Niall O Laoghaire


    thanks for all the replies I'll post again when I have an update


  • #11
    searay
    Registered Users Posts: 436 ✭✭searay


    Niall O Laoghaire wrote: »
    thanks for all the replies I'll post again when I have an update

    On the front door, could you get an estimate for the cost of the work and if it’s not substantial, give the bank and undertaking to do the work post sale. You could also look for a price reduction from the receiver. In the current climate they might take it.

    The title deed is the key issue to get resolved and then you can make a call on the others.


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  • #12
    Niall O Laoghaire
    Registered Users Posts: 10 ✭Niall O Laoghaire


    Hi all
    Here is an update:
    a) We got a second survey & that surveyor said there was no problem with the porch, go figure!
    b) Title deeds - one was missing & after a bit of to & fro with between solicitors, the receivers got Title Deed Indemnity, so Counsel's opinion no t necessary.

    Our solicitor is now happy to go to the bank with all this & more, I'll post when we hear back from them,

    Cheers Niall


  • #13
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,429 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Niall O Laoghaire wrote: »
    Hi all
    Here is an update:
    a) We got a second survey & that surveyor said there was no problem with the porch, go figure!
    b) Title deeds - one was missing & after a bit of to & fro with between solicitors, the receivers got Title Deed Indemnity, so Counsel's opinion no t necessary.

    Our solicitor is now happy to go to the bank with all this & more, I'll post when we hear back from them,

    Cheers Niall

    Glad there’s other sensible surveyors out there to match what I said in post #2 :)


  • #14
    Niall O Laoghaire
    Registered Users Posts: 10 ✭Niall O Laoghaire


    Thought I'd give a postscript on this one. We have finally bought the house, six months after going sale agreed. I won't share the gory details but it turned into a slagging match between our solicitor & the vendor's solicitors over their right to sell the house 'Power of Sale'. Some last minute revelations got it over the line.


    So if anyone reaches this thread looking for advise on buying a repossessed house - make sure your solicitor has lots experience in this area & you really want the house. We did & the extra conveyancing time & cost plus massive stress were still worth it, but only just.


  • #15
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,429 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Best of luck and enjoy the new home.


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