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Police shootings, vigilante shootings, and Black Lives Matter

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Comments

  • #92
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 9,950 ✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Overheal wrote: »
    Yet black people are treated unfairly when they are interacted with by police because of these preconceived notions. "Oh a black person, good chance they're a criminal." "A white person, nothing unusual there"

    An empty generalisation, devoid of context and substance.


  • #93
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 9,950 ✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    rossie1977 wrote: »
    50% of arrests for violent crime which isn't the same thing..

    The vast majority of murders are by people who know each other either family members, friends or neighbours. So yes it's mostly black people killing black people, whites killing whites, hispanics killing hispanics.

    Violent crime tends to be associated more with poorer neighbourhoods anyway, same with countries. Outside the US every highly developed nation has low homicide rates. In Europe the poorest nations like Moldova and Estonia the homicide rate is much higher.




    The vast majority of people in us prisons aren't there for violent crime though. Majority are there for drug offences. You are 12 times more likely to be convicted of a crime and sent to prison if caught with drugs in the US if you are black instead of white!

    50% of murders, according to FBI data. That's not something to be had waved away. The violence seen in black communities is endemic and largely ignored by politicians in favour of stoking outrage


  • #94
    rossie1977
    Registered Users Posts: 11,341 ✭✭✭✭rossie1977


    Once again violence and crime tends to be endemic to poorer neighbourhoods not black neighbourhoods in particular.

    The argument that politicians in the US ignore crime is nonsense. Nowhere on earth has a bigger prison population per capita than the US. The American police are basically militarized in nature and the US is quickly becoming a police state.. that doesn't happen without the full backing and financial support of politicians on both sides.

    Instead of dealing with the actual issues and causes of crime ie poverty, lack of education, facilities etc the US governments have continued to arm police with more weapons, built more prisons and arrested more citizens.


  • #95
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 20,712 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    AbusesToilets wrote: »
    I'm sure the members of their own communities, who have seen their businesses destroyed might have something to say.

    To call black people in the US oppressed is laughable. They live in one of the best societies in the world, that's statistically safer than at anytime previously. They enjoy numerous privileges and advantages afforded them under the auspices of equality.

    Those uppity black lads should just shut up and count their blessings?

    You realise that people said exactly the same sort of tripe during the civil rights movement in the 60s.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




  • #96
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,104 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Brian? wrote: »
    Those uppity black lads should just shut up and count their blessings?

    You realise that people said exactly the same sort of tripe during the civil rights movement in the 60s.

    And 100 years before that. They even fought a war over it. Trump supports the side that lost.


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  • #97
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 9,950 ✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Brian? wrote: »
    Those uppity black lads should just shut up and count their blessings?

    You realise that people said exactly the same sort of tripe during the civil rights movement in the 60s.

    It wasn't Uppity Blacks claiming they are oppressed, it was posters on here. Please tell me how you feel they are oppressed? Having worked extensively in countries where the government actually oppresses it's citizens, I can say it's an utterly fallacious argument.


  • #98
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 20,712 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    AbusesToilets wrote: »
    It wasn't Uppity Blacks claiming they are oppressed, it was posters on here. Please tell me how you feel they are oppressed? Having worked extensively in countries where the government actually oppresses it's citizens, I can say it's an utterly fallacious argument.

    Oppression isn’t some sort of binary situation. There are degrees.

    How are they oppressed? They’re six times more likely to be shot dead by the police than white men. I think that’s the most salient point for this thread.

    Nice deflection by the way. Your point of “why are people complaining, they’ve never had it better” is comically bad. Fallacious some might say.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




  • #99
    everlast75
    Registered Users Posts: 18,955 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    everlast75 wrote: »
    This guy has Carlson and Coulter painting him out to be a hero. You have Gaetz calling for more.

    You have this guy front and centre at a Trump rally.

    As ridiculous as it sounds, whilst he won't be invited, expect words from DJT both sides-ing the incident.

    The above post was about the shooter.

    And here you have it

    https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1300079126783688713?s=09


  • #100
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 9,950 ✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Brian? wrote: »
    Oppression isn’t some sort of binary situation. There are degrees.

    How are they oppressed? They’re six times more likely to be shot dead by the police than white men. I think that’s the most salient point for this thread.

    Nice deflection by the way. Your point of “why are people complaining, they’ve never had it better” is comically bad. Fallacious some might say.

    Again that statistic that conveniently ignores why they might be more likely to be shot ( by black and Hispanic officers to boot). You, undoubtedly, posit that to racism. I would say it's due to the higher levels of criminality on their communities, specifically violent crime.

    As to your second, US society is safer than it has ever been historically. Crime and murder rates have been falling for decades. That's all easily verifiable, unlike many of the generalisations you are prone to issuing.


  • #101
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 20,712 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    AbusesToilets wrote: »
    Again that statistic that conveniently ignores why they might be more likely to be shot ( by black and Hispanic officers to boot). You, undoubtedly, posit that to racism. I would say it's due to the higher levels of criminality on their communities, specifically violent crime.

    Some if is due to higher crime rates among minority communities. The statistic doesn't "conveniently ignore" anything, it's a number incapable of feeling.

    As to your second, US society is safer than it has ever been historically. Crime and murder rates have been falling for decades. That's all easily verifiable, unlike many of the generalisations you are prone to issuing.

    By this logic no would ever protest anything, each generation has it better because the last generation made positive changes to improve society. If everyone just sat on their hands now and did nothing there would be zero progression.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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  • #102
    Gerry Hatrick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 552 ✭✭✭Gerry Hatrick


    Brian? wrote: »
    It would be extremely short sighted to think this is about the people murdered recently by police officers. The protesters are angry because this has been happening unseen for decades. The police are murdering black men because that’s what they’ve always done and always gotten away with it.

    This is the first generation where everyone walks around with a video camera in their pocket, so a light is being shone on the problem. Imagine how it feels to know this had been happening and you’ve been ignored for decades.

    If I was an African American I’m not sure I’d be as restrained as these protesters.

    Black people represent 12.7% of the American population but are responsible for 52% of the crime. The protesters instead of being angry at white people need to look in the mirror and ask the hard questions.


  • #103
    everlast75
    Registered Users Posts: 18,955 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    Gerry Hatrick wrote: »
    Black people represent 12.7% of the American population but are responsible for 52% of the crime. The protesters instead of being angry at white people need to look in the mirror and ask the hard questions.

    Would you hire a black person?

    OP - based on my statistic that they are now likely to commit crime, absolutely not!

    Also OP - Jesus, why don't they get a job and stop committing crime!?


  • #104
    everlast75
    Registered Users Posts: 18,955 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    https://twitter.com/WarOnDumb/status/1299714854819893249?s=19

    There's only one way this is going, and that's trump and his minions pushing violence ahead of November, and that's because he can't win on the economy.

    There's only one side calling for a reduction in violence. Enough of this both sides nonsense.


  • #105
    Mongfinder General
    Registered Users Posts: 1,993 ✭✭✭Mongfinder General


    Water John wrote: »
    And 100 years before that. They even fought a war over it. Trump supports the side that lost.

    Wasn't Abraham Lincoln a republican?


  • #106
    StringerBell
    Registered Users Posts: 14,017 ✭✭✭✭StringerBell


    Mongfinder General wrote: »
    Wasn't Abraham Lincoln a republican?

    Trump doesn't support republicans

    "People say ‘go with the flow’ but do you know what goes with the flow? Dead fish."



  • #107
    Retr0gamer
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 50,777 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Those cops know it's not like the movies where one shot and someone is down. If Blake reaches the front seat and has a gun he will likely get shots away before he can be stopped. He is a big strong man.

    Cops who are out on the beat every day are not going to let things get that close to disaster or else they know one day they will be killed in the line of duty.

    The cops that shot Blake will not be convicted.

    Shoot first, ask questions later. I don't think that's regarded as proper policing. So they shot Blake because he might have been going for a gun.

    Let's not even go into the three children in the line of fire.
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  • #108
    Retr0gamer
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 50,777 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Mongfinder General wrote: »
    Wasn't Abraham Lincoln a republican?

    Yes. But the racists lost the war.
    Untitled Image




  • #109
    Mongfinder General
    Registered Users Posts: 1,993 ✭✭✭Mongfinder General


    StringerBell wrote: »
    Trump doesn't support republicans

    You've got that the wrong way round. He's the Leader of the Republican Party. Not the Jim Crow law supporting Democrat party.


  • #110
    Mongfinder General
    Registered Users Posts: 1,993 ✭✭✭Mongfinder General


    .


  • #111
    Mongfinder General
    Registered Users Posts: 1,993 ✭✭✭Mongfinder General


    Retr0gamer wrote: »
    Yes. But the racists lost the war.

    You mean the Democrats who voted against the 13th amendment?


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  • #112
    rossie1977
    Registered Users Posts: 11,341 ✭✭✭✭rossie1977


    Gerry Hatrick wrote: »
    Black people represent 12.7% of the American population but are responsible for 52% of the crime. The protesters instead of being angry at white people need to look in the mirror and ask the hard questions.

    The numbers are not correct and even if they were those are convictions and once again a black man is 12 times more likely to be convicted and sent to prison than a white person if both are caught with the same drugs on them...

    Nobody is blaming white people. People are blaming the over the top reactions of the police in the US towards black people. The police have taken it upon themselves to be judge, jury and executioner.


  • #113
    rossie1977
    Registered Users Posts: 11,341 ✭✭✭✭rossie1977


    Mongfinder General wrote: »
    You've got that the wrong way round. He's the Leader of the Republican Party. Not the Jim Crow law supporting Democrat party.

    Yet Trump and his supporters are the one protesting the removal of the Jim Crow era statues and flying confederate flags...


  • #114
    Gerry Hatrick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 552 ✭✭✭Gerry Hatrick


    everlast75 wrote: »
    Would you hire a black person?

    OP - based on my statistic that they are now likely to commit crime, absolutely not!

    Also OP - Jesus, why don't they get a job and stop committing crime!?

    Not having a job is a reason to commit a crime now is it?


  • #115
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 9,950 ✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Retr0gamer wrote: »
    Shoot first, ask questions later. I don't think that's regarded as proper policing. So they shot Blake because he might have been going for a gun.

    Let's not even go into the three children in the line of fire.

    You're talking about the guy who had just broken in to a woman's apartment, sexually assaulted her in her sleep and stole her car keys? Who fought police when they tried to arrest him, was unsuccessfully tazered, and refused to stop from opening his car door, despite having guns drawn on him?

    Those poor kids


  • #116
    Gerry Hatrick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 552 ✭✭✭Gerry Hatrick


    rossie1977 wrote: »
    The numbers are not correct and even if they were those are convictions and once again a black man is 12 times more likely to be convicted and sent to prison than a white person if both are caught with the same drugs on them...

    Nobody is blaming white people. People are blaming the over the top reactions of the police in the US towards black people. The police have taken it upon themselves to be judge, jury and executioner.

    Again wrong. SOME police have taken it upon themselves.

    Why is it okay for you to paint the police all with the same brush but if someone wrongfully accuses black people of all being violent and criminals you'd have a hissy fit.


  • #117
    Retr0gamer
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 50,777 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    AbusesToilets wrote: »
    You're talking about the guy who had just broken in to a woman's apartment, sexually assaulted her in her sleep and stole her car keys? Who fought police when they tried to arrest him, was unsuccessfully tazered, and refused to stop from opening his car door, despite having guns drawn on him?

    Those poor kids

    And was unarmed, not yet convicted of anything and with his three children.
    Untitled Image




  • #118
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 9,950 ✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Retr0gamer wrote: »
    And was unarmed, not yet convicted of anything and with his three children.

    He had a weapon. I'm glad you can ignore his actions on the day. Am I allowed to do whatever I want if a child is present?


  • #119
    everlast75
    Registered Users Posts: 18,955 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    Gerry Hatrick wrote: »
    Not having a job is a reason to commit a crime now is it?

    How fantastic never to have experienced poverty, prejudice or desperation.


  • #120
    GreeBo
    Registered Users Posts: 27,007 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    AbusesToilets wrote: »
    He had a weapon. I'm glad you can ignore his actions on the day. Am I allowed to do whatever I want if a child is present?

    He didnt *have* a weapen, there was a weapon in the car.

    There is no doubt that he made some bad decision, but none of them should have resulted in being shot 7 times.

    If it did then Irish people would be shot by the hundreds daily while in the US.


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  • #121
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 9,950 ✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    GreeBo wrote: »
    He didnt *have* a weapen, there was a weapon in the car.

    There is no doubt that he made some bad decision, but none of them should have resulted in being shot 7 times.

    If it did then Irish people would be shot by the hundreds daily while in the US.

    What was he doing when he was shot, again? What was he doing prior to getting shot?


This discussion has been closed.
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