[Article] Eircom to cut off Music File Sharers ..

Sevenie · 29-01-2009 2:01pm

Earlier posts suggest

http://hotspotshield.com/
or
Peerguardian2

They doesnt work if you are dl torrents, do they??

watty · 29-01-2009 2:02pm

Sudsy86 wrote: »

Eircom use a static IP address...Ur IP address never changes...Please stop stating stupid facts trying to make PPl believe they cannot be monitored...Infact yes they can...They dont need an exact time just ur STATIC IP which they check the log for the info being transfered from this...

But please dont be wrong its a Static IP and not a Dynamic...

Static or Dynamic is not relevant. Eircom's database/Logs tell them exactly which account uses which address at what time/date.

My IP (not eircom) is Dynamic. However I always get the same IP when I reboot. An IP that doesn't seem to change is not absolutely a static one.

Anyway re-read my explanation. It doesn't matter how the IP works as long as the 3rd party "spying" outfit logs the correct time/date.

lmimmfn · 29-01-2009 2:02pm

Sudsy86 wrote: »

Eircom use a static IP address...Ur IP address never changes...Please stop stating stupid facts trying to make PPl believe they cannot be monitored...Infact yes they can...They dont need an exact time just ur STATIC IP which they check the log for the info being transfered from this...

They use a group of static public ipaddresses( well utv do anyway, not been with eircom ), and private dynamic ipaddresses are given to users. Each public ip address is shared amongst X amount of users

On a seperate note, this was initiated by U2's manager( McGuinness or whatever he's called ) last year wasnt it?

PaddyTheNth · 29-01-2009 2:05pm

Sudsy86 wrote: »

Eircom use a static IP address...Ur IP address never changes...Please stop stating stupid facts trying to make PPl believe they cannot be monitored...Infact yes they can...They dont need an exact time just ur STATIC IP which they check the log for the info being transfered from this...

But please dont be wrong its a Static IP and not a Dynamic...

Eh? I think he's right dude. I'm pretty sure that my router at home gets allocated a dynamic address from a pool, and that you have to be a business customer to get a static IP, which is an add-on.

http://business.eircom.net/broadband/packages/businesslite/

Edit: That's not to say that it makes any difference in terms of eircom knowing who's using a particular IP at any given time.

PaddyTheNth · 29-01-2009 2:08pm

Sevenie wrote: »

Earlier posts suggest

http://hotspotshield.com/
or
Peerguardian2

They doesnt work if you are dl torrents, do they??

No. All you need to do is connect to the tracker, not to the anti-p2p agencies, who are perfectly able to change their IP in any case.

Scruff · 29-01-2009 2:11pm

my eyes are bleeding reading this thread. I think it would be a good idea for a moderator who knows what they are talking about to go through this thread and bin all the posts that are saying inaccurate ****e about IPs. Its only confusing the fook out of the children and the non tech savy.

Sudsy86 · 29-01-2009 2:11pm

PaddyTheNth wrote: »

Eh? I think he's right dude. I'm pretty sure that my router at home gets allocated a dynamic address from a pool, and that you have to be a business customer to get a static IP, which is an add-on.

http://business.eircom.net/broadband/packages/businesslite/

Edit: That's not to say that it makes any difference in terms of eircom knowing who's using a particular IP at any given time.

The router gives you a dynasmic ip address but your modem itself has a static IP adress...Ericom are a DSL service and do not Use a DHCP server...This is 1 of there main restrictions due to being an Analogue service...

watty · 29-01-2009 2:12pm

20goto10 wrote: »

I don't agree that heavy users are not liked. Heavy users pay for the top of the range products. Ban downloads and there is no need for anything other than a standard 1mb service.

What is a heavy user anyway? They have caps and fair usage policies, a heavy user would therefore be someone who breaks the fair usage policy. In which case they get throttled. There's no such thing as a heavy user.

If you download your Cap in a week and are throttled to 100kbps:
then the next 3 weeks is 1814400 seconds. That is 22Gbytes approximately.

Or 45GBytes @ 200kbps.

The majority of users never come near a 1/5th of cap.

so if cap is 15GBytes, thats 30Gbytes to 60Gbytes compared to 3Gbytes.

If you P2P at 1Mbps, 24 x7 that is 226Gbytes a month. Assuming my sums correct. Or 2 Terrabytes on a good 6Mbps download if 1/3rd traffic is upload.

Note that traffic is sum of upload and download, and if download and upload are equal, then a 100kBps throttle is 200kbps traffic and 45Gbytes. At 2/3rds, then 1Mbps traffic unthrottled is only 660Kbps download.

Of course there are heavy users, on some networks 10% users take 90% traffic.

Unfortunately LEGAL Sky (Kontiki), C4 and BBC p2p can eat this sort of bandwidth too. It could be cheaper for some ISPs to subsidize Tivo style PVRs on Satellite and/or DTT and/or Cable so that users can watch scheduled TV and VOD that was actually broadcast to their PVRs harddrive in the background by DVB rather than wasteful IP unicast.

lmimmfn · 29-01-2009 2:15pm

PaddyTheNth wrote: »

No. All you need to do is connect to the tracker, not to the anti-p2p agencies, who are perfectly able to change their IP in any case.

thats why we need TPB's new tracker http://torrentfreak.com/tpb-is-developing-a-new-bittorrent-tracker-071001/

Sudsy86 · 29-01-2009 2:15pm

watty wrote: »

If you download your Cap in a week and are throttled to 100kbps:
then the next 3 weeks is 1814400 seconds. That is 22Gbytes approximately.

Or 45GBytes @ 200kbps.

The majority of users never come near a 1/5th of cap.

so if cap is 15GBytes, thats 30Gbytes to 60Gbytes compared to 3Gbytes.

If you P2P at 1Mbps, 24 x7 that is 226Gbytes a month. Assuming my sums correct. Or 2 Terrabytes on a good 6Mbps download if 1/3rd traffic is upload.

Note that traffic is sum of upload and download, and if download and upload are equal, then a 100kBps throttle is 200kbps traffic and 45Gbytes. At 2/3rds, then 1Mbps traffic unthrottled is only 660Kbps download.

Of course there are heavy users, on some networks 10% users take 90% traffic.

Thats assuming you dont know how to get around throttling...

20goto10 · 29-01-2009 2:18pm

watty wrote: »

If you download your Cap in a week and are throttled to 100kbps:
then the next 3 weeks is 1814400 seconds. That is 22Gbytes approximately.

Or 45GBytes @ 200kbps.

The majority of users never come near a 1/5th of cap.

so if cap is 15GBytes, thats 30Gbytes to 60Gbytes compared to 3Gbytes.

If you P2P at 1Mbps, 24 x7 that is 226Gbytes a month. Assuming my sums correct. Or 2 Terrabytes on a good 6Mbps download if 1/3rd traffic is upload.

Note that traffic is sum of upload and download, and if download and upload are equal, then a 100kBps throttle is 200kbps traffic and 45Gbytes. At 2/3rds, then 1Mbps traffic unthrottled is only 660Kbps download.

Of course there are heavy users, on some networks 10% users take 90% traffic.

What I'm saying is they have a fair usage policy that polices this. I'm with BT and they allow 100GB in any given 1 month period before throttling you. So clearly, they are ok with people using this much, otherwise why do they allow it?

thebman · 29-01-2009 2:21pm

lmimmfn wrote: »

They use a group of static public ipaddresses( well utv do anyway, not been with eircom ), and private dynamic ipaddresses are given to users. Each public ip address is shared amongst X amount of users

On a seperate note, this was initiated by U2's manager( McGuinness or whatever he's called ) last year wasnt it?

Leave U2 out of this, Bono is a saint! St. Bono actually and his followers are pushing to have him promoted to god status.

The problem with legal downloads is DRM. The other problem is they are a rip off compared to CD's which even when they cost a little more are a physical copy with no restrictions.

Why would you pay more or the same for less?

They need an ad supported model and give the music away for free TBH. There isn't the money in music their used to be. Not in the long term anyway. This is the change over period. They can fight it all they like but their business model doesn't have the right to exist.

If the people want something else, the market will find a way. With P2P, it already had TBH. Sites like Last.fm allow independent artists to promote themselves for free and give away their music or charge fairly for it. Sites like that will become the new model once independent artists get the money to market themselves from the small sales they can push higher up without the need for the labels.

MTV Get off the air

See the latest rejects from the muppet show
Wag their tits and their dicks
As they lip-synch on screen
There's something I don't like
About a band who always smiles
Another tax write-off
For some schmuck who doesn't care

M.T.V. Get off the air
And so it was
Our beloved corporate gods
Claimed they created rock video
Allowing it to sink as low in one year
As commercial TV has in 25
"It's the new frontier," they say
It's wide open, anything can happen
But you've got a lot of nerve
To call yourself a pioneer
When you're too god-damn conservative
To take real chances.

Spear · 29-01-2009 2:22pm

Sudsy86 wrote: »

The router gives you a dynasmic ip address but your modem itself has a static IP adress...Ericom are a DSL service and do not Use a DHCP server...This is 1 of there main restrictions due to being an Analogue service...

Nonsense, Eircom use dynamic IPs for their residential customers. Only their business packages provide static IP's.

watty · 29-01-2009 2:22pm

Sudsy86 wrote: »

The router gives you a dynasmic ip address but your modem itself has a static IP adress...Ericom are a DSL service and do not Use a DHCP server...This is 1 of there main restrictions due to being an Analogue service...

Er... No all nonsense.
DSL (which is Digital) and Analogue (56k dialup) have nothing to do with it.
A DHCP server can give the same IP to the MAC it saw before on the Modem. Or not, depending on the account you have and the Whim of eircom.

But as explained before Dynamic/Static IP doesn't matter as all ISPs know which of their own customers have which IPs at what time & date.

zillmere · 29-01-2009 2:25pm

Sudsy86 wrote: »

The router gives you a dynasmic ip address but your modem itself has a static IP adress...Ericom are a DSL service and do not Use a DHCP server...This is 1 of there main restrictions due to being an Analogue service...

It doesn't matter if the dynamic address comes from a server or a router.

I am not sure what you are trying to say but it sounds wrong. Even if the IP address you get given doesn't seem to change, it is still dynamic because it may change.

As mentioned earlier, a static IP address is part of business BB & costs extra.

You can't set up smtp email or VPN's through a firewall with a changing public IP.

java · 29-01-2009 2:28pm

lmimmfn wrote: »

They use a group of static public ipaddresses( well utv do anyway, not been with eircom ), and private dynamic ipaddresses are given to users. Each public ip address is shared amongst X amount of users

eircom don't share public ip addresses. Each user gets their own ip, whether it be dynamic or static. Don't assume because UTV do something that all other isps are the same. Assumptions are not helpful.

zenno · 29-01-2009 2:29pm

BYE BYE eircom. looks like they will loose a ton of customers cause you can always go with another internet provider. the RIAA are idiots anyway i hope they collapse in business if they didn't charge so much for albums more people would be buying them instead of downloading them illegally. who the hell would want to be a customer of eircom anyway it's not even irish owned lol

thegoth · 29-01-2009 2:31pm

Ok Guys. Fact is that eircom will be cracking down on P2P. What solutions cans we use to get around this ?

Will something like freegate work for P2P ?

lmimmfn · 29-01-2009 2:33pm

java wrote: »

eircom don't share public ip addresses. Each user gets their own ip, whether it be dynamic or static. Don't assume because UTV do something that all other isps are the same. Assumptions are not helpful.

link please? or are you assuming? no ISP needs to give each and every user their own public ip address and considering the scarcity of them i would be very very surprised if eircom do

dbrowne9212 · 29-01-2009 2:35pm

lmimmfn wrote: »

link please? or are you assuming?

i've worked for a mojor Irish ISP and can confirm. the IP address you are assigned is not a shared public IP. It's mapped to your routers MAC address and that info is logged.

Cabaal · 29-01-2009 2:37pm

Right lads,
Eircom are doing nothing illegal here until proven otherwise!

If you don't want to be caught for downloading copyright material then don't download copyright material!! Its simple.

Its clearly stated in all ISP's Terms & Conditions that you should not download copyright material so its no surprise that your ISP will be pissed off if you do.

Eircom along with many other ISP#'s use dynamic IP's, they will charge each time you reconnect (most of the time). Eircom can tell who these IP's are assigned to so don't worry they can track you down if they need to

lmimmfn · 29-01-2009 2:38pm

dbrowne9212 wrote: »

i've worked for a mojor Irish ISP and can confirm. the IP address you are assigned is not a shared public IP. It's mapped to your routers MAC address and that info is logged.

cheers for the info, and apologies on my assumption, thats crazy though

20goto10 · 29-01-2009 2:40pm

thegoth wrote: »

Ok Guys. Fact is that eircom will be cracking down on P2P. What solutions cans we use to get around this ?

Will something like freegate work for P2P ?

Wow, my comment seems to have been deleted for saying use an alternative protocol

Calm down mods!

jor el · 29-01-2009 2:41pm

lmimmfn wrote: »

link please? or are you assuming? no ISP needs to give each and every user their own public ip address and considering the scarcity of them i would be very very surprised if eircom do

They do, as do the majority of Irish ISPs. Three are the only one I know of, that use a shared IP for all.

lmimmfn · 29-01-2009 2:43pm

jor el wrote: »

They do, as do the majority of Irish ISPs. Three are the only one I know of, that use a shared IP for all.

yeah, i seen that above, thats nuts though

velocirafter · 29-01-2009 2:43pm

I believe I am right in saying that this law only applies to P2P downloading, which to be honest is outdated and flooded with viruses. You should still be free to download using torrents and from storage sites.

dbrowne9212 · 29-01-2009 2:44pm

20goto10 wrote: »

Wow, my comment seems to have been deleted for saying use an alternative protocol Calm down mods!

my comment has been deleted for questioning how we will get around this. Moderators need to chill out here.

Yarnhall · 29-01-2009 2:45pm

Like it or not, downloading copyrighted material is illegal, what did you expect to happen, of course they're going to try and get their pound of flesh.

Interesting article here on some Dutch report

..that the average downloader buys more DVDs, music, and games than people who never download. Illegal downloaders represent 45 percent of consumers who purchase content legally

What ever your stance on file sharing, they're going about this the wrong way, I've no problem paying for music/movies, its how the publishers/record labels divvy the money out the creators that get me.

Edit: Current CD/DVD/BR prices are ridiculous, no wonder people try to download them.

velocirafter · 29-01-2009 2:45pm

ya they agreement is only with eircom, although it will probably spread to all ISPs in time

Cabaal · 29-01-2009 2:45pm

velocirafter wrote: »

I believe I am right in saying that this law only applies to P2P downloading, which to be honest is outdated and flooded with viruses. You should still be free to download using torrents and from storage sites.

If your ISP has received a report about you downloading any copyright material they are within their rights to follow up. The source does not matter

[Article] Eircom to cut off Music File Sharers ..

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