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Dublin Bus selling some of its VTs

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Comments

  • #122
    dublinman1990
    Registered Users Posts: 8,299 ✭✭✭dublinman1990


    I watched a YT video on the new tri-axle bus for Lothian just now. It showed the inside of the bus, after showing some outside clips of it, when it was going on the 11 route to Hyvot Bank. The red lighting inside is switched on on both decks all the time. It has 2 big displays on each deck of the bus; 1 of them shows the next stops on the route; the other display shows a video about Lothian's 100 anniversary. On the top deck the displays are stuck on the front window.

    The top deck also has a sun roof near the back to let in light during days of brighter weather.



    I just wished that Dublin Bus could have had some of them if the NTA gave approval to purchase them. These buses look very well when out on the road.


  • #123
    devnull
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 11,582 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    I'm sorry, but having two massive screens at the front upstairs is just having screens for screens sake - there is no need for two, one is plenty and it just obscures the view. That's just nonsensical.

    Also there doesn't seem to be an additional buggy space, have to say that that's a very poor choice of layout for a capital city on such a long vehicle - the front row of seats on the right should be taken out.

    Not a fan of the lighting either, give me proper white lighting any day which it's far easier to read in than red lights and the white spotlights that they are using.

    There's no disputing it's a beautiful looking bus, but it's a little style over substance in some areas to me. If the NTA would purchase some they'd hopefully go with a spec to address these issues.


  • #124
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Agreed devnull the interior is awful looking not sure what they were thinking with the red lights. It looks like a coach rather than an urban bus on the inside very much style over functionality not sure why tinted windows would ever be on a city bus.

    There wouldn't be a chance such a design would ever pass an NDA consultation considering the fuss they kicked up with the new TFI/GAI buses and rightly so as it is very disability unfriendly from the dark interior to the lack of segregated pram space and the fold down seats in the wheelchair bay which are a big no no as far as I'm concerned.

    They seem to have placed a big emphasis here on seated space which is the complete opposite of the direction the NTA are going as it looks likes they are focusing on buying buses with reduced seating and increased standing space. Afaik the Enviro 400XLB is just a stretched Enviro 400 and does not offer any increased power that an Enviro 500 would offer over an Enviro 400 or an ALX400 similar to the way the Streetlite Max is just a stretched Streetlite. For a new bus it already looks to be rattling around the dash similar to how an EV would.


  • #125
    devnull
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 11,582 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    Agreed devnull the interior is awful looking not sure what they were thinking with the red lights. It looks like a coach rather than an urban bus on the inside very much style over functionality not sure why tinted windows would ever be on a city bus.

    There wouldn't be a chance such a design would ever pass an NDA consultation considering the fuss they kicked up with the new TFI/GAI buses and rightly so as it is very disability unfriendly from the dark interior to the lack of segregated pram space and the fold down seats in the wheelchair bay which are a big no no as far as I'm concerned.

    They clearly wanted to go for the marketing claim of having 100 seats on the bus, if they didn't have the pull down seats and had an actual buggy space they would be on something like 95 seats and that wouldn't sound so good, but it saddens me that it is probably a bigger consideration than ensuring the bus service is properly accessible to all members of society.

    Unfortunately as with many things nowadays, sounding good in theory in a marketing campaign is deemed as being more important than actually being practical in reality. Personally I'd always go for a seperate buggy space and a wheelchair space over a couple more seats on a decker as it prevents the whole argument about wheelchair vs buggies that can cause a lot of tension for those who need to use a wheelchair.
    Afaik the Enviro 400XLB is just a stretched Enviro 400 and does not offer any increased power that an Enviro 500 would offer over an Enviro 400 or an ALX400 similar to the way the Streetlite Max is just a stretched Streetlite. For a new bus it already looks to be rattling around the dash similar to how an EV would.

    It's a stretched Enviro 400 MMC with a few changes, the MMC is a better bus than the original Enviro 400 (the EV) but it still inherits some of the issues that the original model had whilst fixing others.


  • #126
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Here is a photo of an ex db one.....


    Looks smashing...


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  • #127
    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime
    Registered Users Posts: 3,964 ✭✭✭Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime


    devnull wrote: »
    They clearly wanted to go for the marketing claim of having 100 seats on the bus, if they didn't have the pull down seats and had an actual buggy space they would be on something like 95 seats and that wouldn't sound so good, but it saddens me that it is probably a bigger consideration than ensuring the bus service is properly accessible to all members of society.

    Unfortunately as with many things nowadays, sounding good in theory in a marketing campaign is deemed as being more important than actually being practical in reality. Personally I'd always go for a seperate buggy space and a wheelchair space over a couple more seats on a decker as it prevents the whole argument about wheelchair vs buggies that can cause a lot of tension for those who need to use a wheelchair.



    It's a stretched Enviro 400 MMC with a few changes, the MMC is a better bus than the original Enviro 400 (the EV) but it still inherits some of the issues that the original model had whilst fixing others.

    We shouldn't have buggy spaces on buses anyway. 4 seats are better than 4 people standing just for the sake of a buggy

    Buggies shouldn't be allowed on a bus unfolded at anytime because they are too much of an annoyance to everyone.

    I think UK companies are doing better than us in the respect. We've done fine without spaces for them before and we sure well do it again


  • #128
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Buggies are a scourge.....

    Pain in both me b####.....


  • #129
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    punisher5112 wrote: »
    Here is a photo of an ex db one.....


    Looks smashing...

    With a nice DRL light upgrade, wonder if it managed to get double rear UK licence plates like it got with DB (highly unlikely).


  • #130
    dfx-
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 15,659 Mod ✭✭✭✭dfx-


    punisher5112 wrote: »
    Here is a photo of an ex db one.....


    Looks smashing...

    They got a good one in VT7 too. Not put off by the single door I notice.

    and neither are Lothian having been in Edinburgh this week.


  • #131
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »
    We shouldn't have buggy spaces on buses anyway. 4 seats are better than 4 people standing just for the sake of a buggy

    Buggies shouldn't be allowed on a bus unfolded at anytime because they are too much of an annoyance to everyone.

    I think UK companies are doing better than us in the respect. We've done fine without spaces for them before and we sure well do it again

    I don't see the harm in an unfolded buggy as long there isn't a conflicting wheelchair on the bus. The arrival of low floor buses and trams has certainly made public transport more accessible to people who wouldn't have nessecarily used it in the past including parents with small children, people with disabilities and the elderly. That can only be regarded as a positive surely.

    If you banned unfolded buggies you could create more hassle as I could see situations where drivers will not police such a rule meaning people will park buggies in the wheelchair space in the absence of a buggy space. These buses are massive and can well afford to have a buggy space. Whatever about the lack of an additional buggy space having a set of fold down seats in the wheelchair space could create serious issues.

    Also standing passengers typically take up less room than seated passengers so 4 seats may equal to 5 or 6 standee places. Despite their large size these buses can only take 2 more standing passengers than an SG which has room for 28 standees this has 30.

    I think we are doing better than most UK operators in terms of accessibility with separate buggy and wheelchair spaces, dual doors, bright interiors, bright easy to see from a distance livery and yellow handrails.


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  • #132
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    GM228 wrote: »
    With a nice DRL light upgrade, wonder if it managed to get double rear UK licence plates like it got with DB (highly unlikely).

    Double licence plates???


  • #133
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    dfx- wrote: »
    They got a good one in VT7 too. Not put off by the single door I notice.

    and neither are Lothian having been in Edinburgh this week.

    The bus appears to be used mostly for private hires rather than public service so there's no real need for dual doors. The Lothian buses in Edinburgh do have dual doors.


  • #134
    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime
    Registered Users Posts: 3,964 ✭✭✭Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    I don't see the harm in an unfolded buggy as long there isn't a conflicting wheelchair on the bus. The arrival of low floor buses and trams has certainly made public transport more accessible to people who wouldn't have nessecarily used it in the past including parents with small children, people with disabilities and the elderly. That can only be regarded as a positive surely.

    If you banned unfolded buggies you could create more hassle as I could see situations where drivers will not police such a rule meaning people will park buggies in the wheelchair space in the absence of a buggy space. These buses are massive and can well afford to have a buggy space. Whatever about the lack of an additional buggy space having a set of fold down seats in the wheelchair space could create serious issues.

    Also standing passengers typically take up less room than seated passengers so 4 seats may equal to 5 or 6 standee places. Despite their large size these buses can only take 2 more standing passengers than an SG which has room for 28 standees this has 30.

    I think we are doing better than most UK operators in terms of accessibility with separate buggy and wheelchair spaces, dual doors, bright interiors, bright easy to see from a distance livery and yellow handrails.

    I think the need of the many out weigh the need of the few here

    In no world should we be allowing an unfolded buggy on a packed bus resulting in an additional 6 people being left at a bus stop in the pissing rain

    Buggy should be folded in favor of capacity in an already struggling transport system


  • #135
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »
    I think the need of the many out weigh the need of the few here

    In no world should we be allowing an unfolded buggy on a packed bus resulting in an additional 6 people being left at a bus stop in the pissing rain

    Buggy should be folded in favor of capacity in an already struggling transport system

    It's laughable how many now buy buggies that can't be folded, they don't know how to, they don't want to fold which is an epidemic, they have so much stuffed into them it would take a week to clear out.

    The amount of disabled intending passengers I've had to leave behind due to the above....


  • #136
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »
    I think the need of the many out weigh the need of the few here

    In no world should we be allowing an unfolded buggy on a packed bus resulting in an additional 6 people being left at a bus stop in the pissing rain

    Buggy should be folded in favor of capacity in an already struggling transport system

    I wouldn't think that happens very often I'm think you'd find most people would happily fold up a buggy if asked politely by the driver or other passengers to make room I'm sure like in most things it's a minority that turn this into an issue. Perhaps if it is an issue then a rule could be introduced that buggies must be folded in the morning between 7 and 9 and in the evening between 4 and 7 similar to the way bikes are banned on trains at peak times.


  • #137
    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime
    Registered Users Posts: 3,964 ✭✭✭Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    I wouldn't think that happens very often I'm think you'd find most people would happily fold up a buggy if asked politely by the driver or other passengers to make room I'm sure like in most things it's a minority that turn this into an issue. Perhaps if it is an issue then a rule could be introduced that buggies must be folded in the morning between 7 and 9 and in the evening between 4 and 7 similar to the way bikes are banned on trains at peak times.

    I have many colleague tell me many stories of having to leave behind wheelchair users because users with buggies were too lazy / ignorant etc to fold a buggy. Including leaving a wheelchair user in the pissing rain after asking the person with buggy several times and explained the situation.

    The majority of users with buggies are not as generous as you seem to believe.

    Like I say, I prefer the UK system of a wheelchair space available but no buggy space.

    TransLink in the NI have a few buses which I found interestng of a single entry front door on a single deck city bus and a wheelchair door on the side for wheelchair entry. Stops any confusion of the space !


  • #138
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    I wouldn't think that happens very often I'm think you'd find most people would happily fold up a buggy if asked politely by the driver or other passengers to make room I'm sure like in most things it's a minority that turn this into an issue. Perhaps if it is an issue then a rule could be introduced that buggies must be folded in the morning between 7 and 9 and in the evening between 4 and 7 similar to the way bikes are banned on trains at peak times.

    Seriously, I've told you the complete opposite before....
    Many won't even answer when asked.


  • #139
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »
    I have many colleague tell me many stories of having to leave behind wheelchair users because users with buggies were too lazy / ignorant etc to fold a buggy. Including leaving a wheelchair user in the pissing rain after asking the person with buggy several times and explained the situation.

    The majority of users with buggies are not as generous as you seem to believe.

    Like I say, I prefer the UK system of a wheelchair space available but no buggy space.

    TransLink in the NI have a few buses which I found interestng of a single entry front door on a single deck city bus and a wheelchair door on the side for wheelchair entry. Stops any confusion of the space !

    But in the absence of a buggy space people will use the wheelchair space as a buggy space that what happens on the EVs, VTs and AXs which do not have a separate wheelchair and buggy spot as a ban on unfolded buggies would likely end up un enforced by drivers just like many other bans which is fair enough as the driver is there to drive the bus not enforce rules.

    I think most UK bus companies do not have bans on unfolded buggies anyway but just do not provide a separate space for them.


  • #140
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    punisher5112 wrote: »
    Seriously, I've told you the complete opposite before....
    Many won't even answer when asked.

    Sorry I was still writing my post before you posted. Personally I would ban buggies completely from the wheelchair space and only allow one on in the buggy space.


  • #141
    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime
    Registered Users Posts: 3,964 ✭✭✭Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    Sorry I was still writing my post before you posted. Personally I would ban buggies completely from the wheelchair space and only allow one on in the buggy space.

    That still misses the point of leaving people behind at the bus stop due to space taking up by buggy

    Flat out all buggies should be folded. They've done it before, no reason they can't again


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  • #142
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »
    That still misses the point of leaving people behind at the bus stop due to space taking up by buggy

    Flat out all buggies should be folded. They've done it before, no reason they can't again

    But my question is would this be enforced or would only some drivers enforce it and others not just like many rules and bans at present what's the point bringing in rules if they are not enforced.


  • #143
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    Sorry I was still writing my post before you posted. Personally I would ban buggies completely from the wheelchair space and only allow one on in the buggy space.

    Under equality this can't happen.....

    Obviously I fully understand there are children unfortunately that will have medical conditions or disabilities where they need to be in a buggy or adapted one and have no issues at all with these using the space but the way things are it's a joke.


  • #144
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    punisher5112 wrote: »
    Double licence plates???

    It used to be going around with a plate affixed to the rear window as well as the bumper.

    9656690559_a729fe36ae_b.jpg


  • #145
    john boye
    Registered Users Posts: 1,489 ✭✭✭john boye


    GM228 wrote: »
    It used to be going around with a plate affixed to the rear window as well as the bumper.

    9656690559_a729fe36ae_b.jpg

    Pretty obvious explanation for that...


  • #146
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    john boye wrote: »
    Pretty obvious explanation for that...

    Repainted and forgotten about.


  • #147
    john boye
    Registered Users Posts: 1,489 ✭✭✭john boye


    GM228 wrote: »
    Repainted and forgotten about.

    Yes exactly. Did it have it for long out of interest?


  • #148
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Ah right I get you now..... That was a long time ago.

    As above repaint they strip the outer of everything in Donnybrook and fit new panels etc if needed.

    Plates are placed inside and new ones fitted with double sided tape after.


  • #149
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    john boye wrote: »
    Yes exactly. Did it have it for long out of interest?

    I believe so which is why I mentioned it as a bit of a joke.


  • #150
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Jaysus just noticed in that pic it was coming down from O'Neil's pub and onto college green.... That's a long time ago....


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  • #151
    Markcheese
    Registered Users Posts: 8,427 ✭✭✭Markcheese


    Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »
    I think the need of the many out weigh the need of the few here

    In no world should we be allowing an unfolded buggy on a packed bus resulting in an additional 6 people being left at a bus stop in the pissing rain

    Buggy should be folded in favor of capacity in an already struggling transport system

    So say a parent has 2 kids, a buggy and a bag or two, (not unreasonable) do the kids get put on the bus while the stuff is still at the bus stop, or the other way round, cos I doubt you'll get everything on folded up in one go..

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



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