Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Beef Plan Movement (READ OP BEFORE POSTING)

13567…40

Comments

  • #62
    older by the day
    Registered Users Posts: 1,530 ✭✭✭older by the day


    Mooooo wrote: »
    I understand that? but when the protests were planned many didnt turn up?

    Any suckler and dry stock man is working off farm in my area or else he is minding the kids while the wife is out working. Look its easy peasy, its all about supply and demand, giving extra premiums to produce more cheap beef will only mask the problems. Export as many calfs and weanlings as possible, therfore with less animals they should be worth more get new live markets ??. It's a costly country to do business. So when it come to dry stock less is more, have grass 10 months a year, put the check book in hiding. Sell excess bales if you have too much grass, or lease a cut growing. Draw your subsidizes


  • #63
    CloughCasey1
    Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭CloughCasey1


    older by the day wrote: »
    Any suckler and dry stock man is working off farm in my area or else he is minding the kids while the wife is out working. Look its easy peasy, its all about supply and demand, giving extra premiums to produce more cheap beef will only mask the problems. Export as many calfs and weanlings as possible, therfore with less animals they should be worth more get new live markets ??. It's a costly country to do business. So when it come to dry stock less is more, have grass 10 months a year, put the check book in hiding. Sell excess bales if you have too much grass, or lease a cut growing. Draw your subsidizes

    Sure we all would be as well to curl up in the corner and die so. Thats akin to drawing the dole not farming.


  • #64
    wrangler
    Registered Users Posts: 11,041 ✭✭✭✭wrangler


    older by the day wrote: »
    Any suckler and dry stock man is working off farm in my area or else he is minding the kids while the wife is out working. Look its easy peasy, its all about supply and demand, giving extra premiums to produce more cheap beef will only mask the problems. Export as many calfs and weanlings as possible, therfore with less animals they should be worth more get new live markets ??. It's a costly country to do business. So when it come to dry stock less is more, have grass 10 months a year, put the check book in hiding. Sell excess bales if you have too much grass, or lease a cut growing. Draw your subsidizes

    There was plenty of hours apart from working hrs to man protests, part time farmers could've manned protests from 2am - 6am for instance which no one wanted to do it seems, if they don't show commitment to this campaign they'll only make fools out of the organisers...... too many farmers talk the talk until they're needed.
    One good thing that will come out of this is that it will become apparent that farmers and not IFA are responsible for poor beef price.
    There is very little any organisation can do when beef processors tell you that ''there's deals being done'' and you know cattle are being thrown at them


  • #65
    Willfarman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,239 ✭✭✭Willfarman


    CloughCasey1 wrote: »
    Sure we all would be as well to curl up in the corner and die so. Thats akin to drawing the dole not farming.
    Why die? The sun will be back in 5 months..
    Curl up with a few Dutch gold, sky box for the Jeremy Kyle show.. happy days! Beats working hard to find Larry’s next private jet and silk underpants


  • #66
    older by the day
    Registered Users Posts: 1,530 ✭✭✭older by the day


    CloughCasey1 wrote: »
    Sure we all would be as well to curl up in the corner and die so. Thats akin to drawing the dole not farming.

    I am on your side my friend but subsidizing sucklers will probably lead to increasing numbers which will cause beef price to go down. Is there a way to get beef prices up for the farmer, would be more sustainable


  • Advertisement
  • #67
    DieselMad
    Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭DieselMad


    older by the day wrote: »
    I am on your side my friend but subsidizing sucklers will probably lead to increasing numbers which will cause beef price to go down. Is there a way to get beef prices up for the farmer, would be more sustainable

    And once beef prices increase, what will human nature cause us to do?

    Increase stocking rates to take more of the pie for ourselves! Thus increasing the supply and once again reducing the price!

    It is a vicious circle! Much like the dairy men and their senario. Maybe production quota's that keep a reasonable floor and control on the supply and price were not such a bad idea after all!

    Unfortunately in beef production we are never really exposed to the upside once the UK/EU market gives a stronger return.

    Which is the case in dairy farming to a degree as the farmer elected board come together to decide the monthly price they can give to their members (suppliers) based on returns and projected returns.


  • #68
    gerryirl
    Registered Users Posts: 577 ✭✭✭gerryirl


    Seaba wrote: »
    I was at the meeting last night in Roscommon mart.

    Serious crowd there - 500 reported but seemed like a lot more. Anyone that knows the mart, Ring 2 (bullocks ring) was jammed.
    Myself and my Dad have about 60 acres, suckler to beef, decent enough land. I am working full time so Dad does most of the work, my wife is self employed, 3 kids. Like all the farmers there last night we are sick and tired of being screwed on price by the factories.

    I was impressed how everyone spoke last night. A few got very passionate and made some very heart felt speeches but in the main there was a quiet determination to wrestle back control from the factories and, as a few mentioned, the retailers - it was quoted that farmers make 20%, factories 29% and retailers 51%.


    I plan, like a few others I was talking to, to go to every farmer in my village that doesn't know about it, give them the membership form and the address to send the €10, and encourage them to go to the next meeting in the McWilliam Hotel, Claremorris, Co Mayo, November 14th at 8.30pm.

    For the first time in my short farming life I felt last night that things are about to change. As they said at the meeting, no other organisation is going to do it for us. We can either continue being exploited, continue bitching, sniping, crying etc or join together and do something about it.

    Yes I was there too. Was great to see a big crowd and as you said all speakers from the floor and crowd all made great points. Its very early days but no one is doing anything to tackle the issue so fair play to all that set it up. Id love to be a part of it but have way too much going on to be involved heavily in it as you'd like but will attend any meetings or whatever to contribute.

    It was a very positive start for them but here is a long hard road ahead


  • #69
    patsy_mccabe
    Registered Users Posts: 10,672 ✭✭✭✭patsy_mccabe


    Are they going to travel around the country?

    'The Bishops blessed the Blueshirts in Galway, As they sailed beneath the Swastika to Spain'



  • #70
    Seaba
    Registered Users Posts: 448 ✭✭Seaba


    gerryirl wrote: »
    Yes I was there too. Was great to see a big crowd and as you said all speakers from the floor and crowd all made great points. Its very early days but no one is doing anything to tackle the issue so fair play to all that set it up. Id love to be a part of it but have way too much going on to be involved heavily in it as you'd like but will attend any meetings or whatever to contribute.

    It was a very positive start for them but here is a long hard road ahead


    I have a fair bit going on myself also but the one way we can all make a difference is to spread the word.

    I am jumping in the car tomorrow evening to give that membership form to everyone in my village and the next village if I have time. The few people I told today had never heard of the plan but said it something has to be done and wanted the membership details.
    I am also sharing every posts I come up to which relates to this, on Facebook, especially the next upcoming meeting.

    A few of us are going to put flyers in the local shops in town and one lad, who works in a hardware store, hands them out to every person he meets. There is lots you can do which won't take up a huge amount of your time.


  • #71
    Seaba
    Registered Users Posts: 448 ✭✭Seaba


    patsy_mccabe wrote: »
    Are they going to travel around the country?


    www.beefplan.ie
    has a lot of details.
    Next meetings I see scheduled are:


    Mayo : McWilliam Park Hotel, Claremorris, Nov 14th, 8:30pm
    Laois : Ratheniska Hall - Nov 20th, 8:00pm
    Cavan : Cavan Crystal Hotel - Nov 21st, 8:30pm
    Kilkenny : Newpark Hotel - Nov 28th, 8:00pm


  • Advertisement
  • #72
    tractorporn
    Registered Users Posts: 1,358 ✭✭✭tractorporn


    patsy_mccabe wrote:
    Are they going to travel around the country?

    I got a notification on the Westmeath WhatsApp group that there's going to be a meeting for Westmeath, Offaly and Longford areas on the 22nd most likely in Mullingar


  • #73
    declanmo
    Registered Users Posts: 2 ✭declanmo


    Folks I am one of the volunteer farmers that are driving the beef plan, like I mentioned in a previous post I got involved over 3 weeks ago and since then I have put hours of work into this every day for the simple reason that my small beef farm has no future if things continue the way they are. At this point in time I dont believe anyone else will help us so we either help ourselves or give up. Like the other 30+ volunteer beef farmers that are driving this I dont get any money and I cover my own expenses.

    In my opinion the only way that we can improve the situation is to unite farmers. This plan is not about the few farmers that are driving it, it is about all beef farmers. I have a few suckler cows and I finish a few heifers from both the dairy and sucker herds. No matter what colour or breed my heifers are I want to get at least a cost of production when I slaughter them.

    I have been reading through the posts here and for those that have made comments on the plan the first thing I would like to say is thanks for reading it and the second thing is if you feel strongly about something then contact us. As it says in the plan it is a working document and its not set in stone. If you feel strongly enough about actually trying to improve the situation then get involved, we need all the help we can get!


  • #74
    _Brian
    Registered Users Posts: 18,464 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    “Telegram Messenger”
    Haven’t come across that app before, yet another messenger app on the phone, how many are needed !!


  • #75
    Never wrestle with pigs
    Registered Users Posts: 1,447 ✭✭✭Never wrestle with pigs


    _Brian wrote: »
    “Telegram Messenger”
    Haven’t come across that app before, yet another messenger app on the phone, how many are needed !!

    WhatsApp, it's the only one that anyone is really using anymore apart from standard SMS. It's very good. You can send texts, pictures or videos to friends or group chats in a second for free.


  • #76
    Never wrestle with pigs
    Registered Users Posts: 1,447 ✭✭✭Never wrestle with pigs


    Bass Reeves wrote: »
    Can any lad here tell me what is a sustainable beef price. We have heard a lot about a margin above cost of production how much is that what do weanling producers think is a sustainable price for them. There seems to be a lot of wishful thinking​with nobody putting up hard prices.

    We then have the issue of the aims of the beef plan. Why would finishers get involved in an organization who's aims may cause a reduction in price of 60% of the beef produced a static price for 10-20% and a small price for the rest. So I am sorry but I am a non believer that this beef plan is the solution and will do anything for me and may actually have negative conontations for my system.

    At the end of the time the best solution is:

    The setting up of producer's groups backed by legislation which is being proposed at EU level which will force processors to forward price cattle over a 3-4 months period.
    The control of feedlots being directly controlled or contracted to processors being used as market controlling measure's. However even in the last few weeks an ex President of the IFA spoke against this.
    The prevention of market control measure's used by processors to prevent the live trade in cattle.


    After that it would be mainly up to market forces but these measure's would prevent processors manipulation of supplies

    Bass, the best thing you can do is go to one of the meetings. Ask the hard questions, ask them is it going to put money in your pocket and how. Give ideas of how you think we can push for a better price/newer markets etc. Then decide if it's for you or not.


  • #77
    Keep Sluicing
    Registered Users Posts: 476 ✭✭Keep Sluicing


    I've done my bit for Beef Plan. Went from 150 bullocks to 45 this year. Restricting supply in my own little way.
    .
    .
    Your welcome.


  • #78
    Farmer
    Registered Users Posts: 750 ✭✭✭Farmer


    _Brian wrote: »
    “Telegram Messenger”
    Haven’t come across that app before, yet another messenger app on the phone, how many are needed !!

    AFAIK they are using telegram because it has a max group size of something like100k users. WhatsApp is much more restrictive, hence the multiple groups.

    In the early days, telegram was one of the few encrypted apps although I think the others have now caught up


  • #79
    larthehar
    Registered Users Posts: 606 ✭✭✭larthehar


    Can anybody tell me what is the price/kg that each member of the supply chain gets??
    Farmer is 3.80/kg at the mo
    What does the consumer pay, average price/kg for a carcass?


  • #80
    gerryirl
    Registered Users Posts: 577 ✭✭✭gerryirl


    Keep Sluicing wrote: »
    I've done my bit for Beef Plan. Went from 150 bullocks to 45 this year. Restricting supply in my own little way.
    .
    .
    Your welcome.

    Id say the taxman was licking his lips over you..:D. sad when thats the way its gone. Your not alone but its whats happening country wide


  • #81
    Seaba
    Registered Users Posts: 448 ✭✭Seaba


    larthehar wrote: »
    Can anybody tell me what is the price/kg that each member of the supply chain gets??
    Farmer is 3.80/kg at the mo
    What does the consumer pay, average price/kg for a carcass?

    Open to correction on this but at the meeting last night they said the farmer gets 20%, factory 29% and retailer 51% so at €3.80 a kilo that's:


    Farmer €0.80
    Factory €1.10
    Retailer €1.90


  • Advertisement
  • #82
    Buford T. Justice XIX
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,633 ✭✭✭✭Buford T. Justice XIX


    Seaba wrote: »
    Open to correction on this but at the meeting last night they said the farmer gets 20%, factory 29% and retailer 51% so at €3.80 a kilo that's:


    Farmer €0.80
    Factory €1.10
    Retailer €1.90

    If €3.80 is the farmers portion, the consumer must be paying €19.00 a kg?


  • #83
    Peter90
    Registered Users Posts: 96 ✭✭Peter90


    Buford T. Justice V wrote: »
    If €3.80 is the farmers portion, the consumer must be paying €19.00 a kg?

    True, facts appear wrong, when the meat is taken off the bone there will be waste, retailer getting 50% I would believe this, no matter the product retailers are making 50% be it good, furniture, appliances it’s a 50% mark up on purchase price. I am all for an increase in price but we need to be realistic. Subsidies were put in place to provide the consumer with a cheap affordable meat. Surly it should be more subsidies we should be targeting. I have spoken to organisers of the beef plan, asked questions & received little or no answers suggested problems as we have been told was shot down accused of not reading the plan eventually not getting answers to my texts. Plan imo is set up to fail, refuse to send cattle,if it happens supplies get tight increase of say 10c on previous week, what is the man with say 30 head of cattle ready to send to the factory? Continue to hold out I think not 10c by 350kg Carcus x 30 cattle extra €1000 in his pocket, those that think this wouldn’t happen are being naive


  • #84
    TITANIUM.
    Registered Users Posts: 2,313 ✭✭✭TITANIUM.


    Peter90 wrote: »
    True, facts appear wrong, when the meat is taken off the bone there will be waste, retailer getting 50% I would believe this, no matter the product retailers are making 50% be it good, furniture, appliances it’s a 50% mark up on purchase price. I am all for an increase in price but we need to be realistic. Subsidies were put in place to provide the consumer with a cheap affordable meat. Surly it should be more subsidies we should be targeting. I have spoken to organisers of the beef plan, asked questions & received little or no answers suggested problems as we have been told was shot down accused of not reading the plan eventually not getting answers to my texts. Plan imo is set up to fail, refuse to send cattle,if it happens supplies get tight increase of say 10c on previous week, what is the man with say 30 head of cattle ready to send to the factory? Continue to hold out I think not 10c by 350kg Carcus x 30 cattle extra €1000 in his pocket, those that think this wouldn’t happen are being naive

    So what would you do Peter?


  • #85
    Peter90
    Registered Users Posts: 96 ✭✭Peter90


    TITANIUM. wrote: »
    So what would you do Peter?

    I have said I would target more subsidies, they were put in place to provide a margin for farmers while providing affordable food so surly it is the subsidies that are failing? While there is room for increase in factory price it would have to be substantial to affect everyone from finishers to those that sell weanlings


  • #86
    TITANIUM.
    Registered Users Posts: 2,313 ✭✭✭TITANIUM.


    Peter90 wrote: »
    I have said I would target more subsidies, they were put in place to provide a margin for farmers while providing affordable food so surly it is the subsidies that are failing? While there is room for increase in factory price it would have to be substantial to affect everyone from finishers to those that sell weanlings

    Sorry Peter I should have clarified, what would you do or like to see done to improve factory prices?


  • #87
    Peter90
    Registered Users Posts: 96 ✭✭Peter90


    TITANIUM. wrote: »
    Sorry Peter I should have clarified, what would you do or like to see done to improve factory prices?

    Export more heavy cattle? Only solution to shorten supply, not sure how feasible, but suggestions such as everyone reducing numbers or with holding cattle is not going to happen under any circumstance


  • #88
    TITANIUM.
    Registered Users Posts: 2,313 ✭✭✭TITANIUM.


    Peter90 wrote: »
    Export more heavy cattle? Only solution to shorten supply, not sure how feasible, but suggestions such as everyone reducing numbers or with holding cattle is not going to happen under any circumstance

    Ya I hear ya. I'm conflicted over the holding cattle part. The factories know well that it's the farmers who will blink first with so much money tied up in them and the cost of hanging onto them.
    Personally I think if the figures the lads put up here from about the profit percentages are even close to accurate then our problem is really with the retailers. 51% and what do they do for it? Seems crazy to me anyway!


  • #89
    Buford T. Justice XIX
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,633 ✭✭✭✭Buford T. Justice XIX


    Peter90 wrote: »
    I have said I would target more subsidies, they were put in place to provide a margin for farmers while providing affordable food so surly it is the subsidies that are failing? While there is room for increase in factory price it would have to be substantial to affect everyone from finishers to those that sell weanlings
    Our cheque in the post is worth about half what we were getting when the SFP was started.



    2 rounds of modulation with possibly another coming from Brexit and 15 years at 2% inflation each year, compounded, adds up fairly quickly.


  • #90
    patsy_mccabe
    Registered Users Posts: 10,672 ✭✭✭✭patsy_mccabe


    Would it be true to say percentage wise, we are the largest exporter of Beef in the world? Hard to believe there is some country greater than 90%.

    I really don't see any solution to this, apart from throwing a few euro at the farmer in the form of subsidies and hope markets improve long term.
    What good will holding supplies do? Factories will tap into their own feedlots and penalise any farmers then with over age or overfat cattle.

    'The Bishops blessed the Blueshirts in Galway, As they sailed beneath the Swastika to Spain'



  • Advertisement
  • #91
    coolshannagh28
    Registered Users Posts: 1,476 ✭✭✭coolshannagh28


    Peter90 wrote: »
    I have said I would target more subsidies, they were put in place to provide a margin for farmers while providing affordable food so surly it is the subsidies that are failing? While there is room for increase in factory price it would have to be substantial to affect everyone from finishers to those that sell weanlings

    This is the crux of the matter , subsidy provides margin for farmers , processors and retailers take a cut and consumers stay peaceable on cheap food.
    Subsidy is being weaned off farmers in many ways ; EU cuts , the dilution to advisory groups , vets, red tape etc .
    Farmers amazingly now are turning down potential subsidy ie suckler cow payment .
    Live exports which have been curtailed by Govt regulation on the behest of the processors are the main release valve on beef prices , these need to be reinstated and give exporters free reign to compete with processors and retailers.
    The movement is a good idea and withholding of supply in an organised farmers union is the only way to face down processors but as stated earlier the Irish model of stack it high and sell it cheap on Uk shelves does not leave much wriggle room on prices to farmers.


Advertisement