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Margaret Cash steals €300 worth of clothes from Penneys and aftermath/etc!

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Comments

  • #4472
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Is there a failing on behalf of the councils to understand traveller culture?

    Sites being cursed and an intricate web of family feuds have left many sites and houses empty.


  • #4473
    qo2cj1dsne8y4k
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,646 ✭✭✭✭qo2cj1dsne8y4k


    Goldengirl wrote: »
    No , that is not what I said , as you know . In a previous answer to you I accepted that the chip pan started the fire. But it is a council halting site, provided by the council so is the responsibility of the council and the fire safety officers to ensure that fire safety regulations are enacted on any site within its remit.
    And in reply to another post , the council are responsible along with individuals who remove smoke alarms , and who do not take care while cooking. Of course there is individual responsibility for the actions/ inactions of people, but this applies to the council also. I have no interest personally in progressing this debate , except to tell those who were blaming the individual travellers alone for the tragedy.

    Is it though? Can we reasonably expect the council to hold the hands of grown adults? I am not blaming the victims, because it was an accident. But it’s certainly nobody else’s fault.


  • #4474
    freshpopcorn
    Registered Users Posts: 30,169 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    Galwayguy35 wrote: »
    If I was drinking, forgot about a chip pan and passed out from being drunk it would be my fault if i died in a fire.

    Seems like the PC crowd are twisting themselves up in knots to blame everyone except the people responsible.

    I think taking personal responsibility went out of fashion a few years ago now!


  • #4475
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Jasiah Hot Talker wrote: »
    Is it though? Can we reasonably expect the council to hold the hands of grown adults? I am not blaming the victims, because it was an accident. But it’s certainly nobody else’s fault.

    If the adults have below an IQ below 70 they are technically disabled and the council have a duty of care to them.


  • #4476
    tretorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,800 ✭✭✭tretorn


    The chip pan was placed on a hot plate and the hot plate was set at its highest setting.

    I think most of the victims died in bed with one male found dead in the kitchen area.

    The responsibility for the danger those children were put in was the person who turned on the hot plate and put the chip pan full of oil on top of it.


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  • #4477
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users Posts: 12,015 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Why should the council have checked the site?

    Personal responsibility is the key. The council didn't get rid of the smoke alarm. The council didn't take their eye of a chip pan with burning oil.

    No fault of the council. I have found some of the testimony and blaming of the council to be deeply disturbing. It seems some people want to profit wrongly out of the death of their relatives.

    Straight away you say people want to profit wrongly out of the death of their relatives...that's the only thing you can think to say about a horrible tragedy.
    It is an unbelievable horrific tragedy and hopefully lessons will be learned by more than the travelling community .


  • #4478
    Galwayguy35
    Registered Users Posts: 16,265 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    freshpopcorn wrote: »
    I think taking personal responsibility went out of fashion a few years ago now!

    It appears to be the case all right.

    RTE news are going out of their way to mention about the council but not a peep about the guy who is responsible for what happened.


  • #4479
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users Posts: 12,015 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    freshpopcorn wrote: »
    I think taking personal responsibility went out of fashion a few years ago now!

    Can you as a moderator take personal responsibility for the cruel and interminable traveller bashing on this site!


  • #4480
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users Posts: 12,015 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    tretorn wrote: »
    The chip pan was placed on a hot plate and the hot plate was set at its highest setting.

    I think most of the victims died in bed with one male found dead in the kitchen area.

    The responsibility for the danger those children were put in was the person who turned on the hot plate and put the chip pan full of oil on top of it.

    Yes, undeniably . So the council have no responsibility ?


  • #4481
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Goldengirl wrote: »
    Can you as a moderator take personal responsibility for the cruel and interminable traveller bashing on this site!

    The bashing is worse on Youtube!



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  • #4482
    freshpopcorn
    Registered Users Posts: 30,169 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    Goldengirl wrote: »
    Can you as a moderator take personal responsibility for the cruel and interminable traveller bashing on this site!

    Yes they can,
    Threads have being locked, deleted, users banned, giving warnings, posts edited/deleted.
    However we have to leave discussion to go on!


  • #4483
    pah
    Registered Users Posts: 3,379 ✭✭✭pah


    tuxy wrote: »
    If the adults have below an IQ below 70 they are technically disabled and the council have a duty of care to them.

    WTF?


  • #4484
    qo2cj1dsne8y4k
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,646 ✭✭✭✭qo2cj1dsne8y4k


    Goldengirl wrote: »
    Yes, undeniably . So the council have no responsibility ?

    Do you expect a council representative to be placed in each trailer and home across Ireland armed with a fire blanket and a hose?


  • #4485
    Galwayguy35
    Registered Users Posts: 16,265 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    Goldengirl wrote: »
    Can you as a moderator take personal responsibility for the cruel and interminable traveller bashing on this site!

    Some of them are fairly handy at the bashing themselves, bashing old people that is.


  • #4486
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Goldengirl wrote: »
    Yes, undeniably . So the council have no responsibility ?

    If I have friends around at night. Drink to excess, take drugs, then in the wee small hours, put a pan of oil on the highest setting on the hob intending to make chips, leading to a fatal fire, would you still blame the council? Bear in mind that I own my house.


  • #4487
    Roger Hassenforder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    Fair play you are consistent in your attempt to lay blame anywhere except where it belongs. 'The lad that put on the chip pan, insisted on the smoke alarm being changed, drinking to unconsciousness is responsible '. NOONE ELSE.

    Is it me, or do other parents just not get stoned or pıssed when having to mind kids as well?


  • #4488
    tretorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,800 ✭✭✭tretorn


    Listening to the inquest it gets clearer and clearer why people object so strongly to travellers halting sites near them.

    The information regarding the tampering with the electricity supply is chilling. There is no way the Council can police such activities, they simply dont have the staff.


  • #4489
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    tretorn wrote: »
    Listening to the inquest it gets clearer and clearer why people object so strongly to travellers halting sites near them.

    The information regarding the tampering with the electricity supply is chilling. There is no way the Council can police such activities, they simply dont have the staff.

    Can you imagine the reaction to them attempting a safety inspection. They would be chased off the site.


  • #4490
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users Posts: 12,015 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    Fair play you are consistent in your attempt to lay blame anywhere except where it belongs. 'The lad that put on the chip pan, insisted on the smoke alarm being changed, drinking to unconsciousness is responsible '. NOONE ELSE.

    And fair play you are consistent in NOT READING the post! And then taking one line out to quote. I HAVE on more than occasion said that those are to blame AS WELL as lack of adequate fire safety requirements .


  • #4491
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Roger Hassenforder wrote:
    Is it me, or do other parents just not get stoned or pıssed when having to mind kids as well?


    Cultural thing I guess, according to some the council should provide babysitting ( apparently adult sitting) services as a key service along with detailed instructions how to use a fire extinguisher and the dangers of chip pans.


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  • #4492
    DavidLyons_
    Registered Users Posts: 1,251 ✭✭✭DavidLyons_


    tuxy wrote: »
    Goldengirl wrote: »
    Can you as a moderator take personal responsibility for the cruel and interminable traveller bashing on this site!

    The bashing is worse on Youtube!

    Deary fcuking me. Absolute low life scum.

    Why is it that there always has to be disgusting nakedness in these animal’s videos?

    Pure dregs of society.


  • #4493
    Ray Palmer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,346 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    Roger Hassenforder wrote: »
    He's ducked several questions

    *would he rent to a traveller? (sidestepped neatly)
    * what services would he cut funding to? (as punishment for Councils not spending 'traveller money' he seems to think is is a drawer in the local town hall).

    I dont think he's up yet. Or he's too busy touring his property portfolio and counting his cash.
    But the "I earn more than you" stuff is pure gold. Bless his little cotton socks.

    No I have nothing suitable and that is the reason. I rented to drug addicts getting clean in the past
    All council funding
    Was at work
    People were going on about how they didn't like "their" taxes being paid and I pointed out I pay more than they do. If you think me mentioning tax is any different from people pointing out they got a job and bought their own house then you just are blind to hypocrites.

    Lots of people avoided questions like you. What level of racist are you so?


  • #4494
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users Posts: 12,015 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    If I have friends around at night. Drink to excess, take drugs, then in the wee small hours, put a pan of oil on the highest setting on the hob intending to make chips, leading to a fatal fire, would you still blame the council? Bear in mind that I own my house.

    Yes, If you live in a council house that doesn't for some reason have regard for fire safety regulations, which all habitable accommodation, under building regulations have to have installed and built in, and not just in recent years either, but especially enacted by law since 2014 ?
    Yes , the council are responsible for enforcement . You as the owner of your own home have responsibility as it is your own home.
    These people were living in portacabins placed cheek by jowl on an emergency council site ( and it was a long time an emergency site ).
    Were the people in Grenfell responsible for the cxxp apartments built for them?
    Do you think the individuals whose kitchen fire started the Grenfell fire are the only ones responsible for the deaths of all those people? Would you blame them too?

    Many people are responsible, some of whom are paid to be accountable.


  • #4495
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users Posts: 12,015 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    tuxy wrote: »
    Can you imagine the reaction to them attempting a safety inspection. They would be chased off the site.

    Again they have a legal responsibility to do so, but yes they probably don't have the staff.


  • #4496
    freshpopcorn
    Registered Users Posts: 30,169 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    Goldengirl wrote: »
    If you live in a council house that doesn't for some reason have regard for fire safety regulations, which all habitable accommodation, under building regulations have to have installed and built in, and not just in recent years either, but especially enacted by law since 2014 ? Yes , the council are responsible for enforcement .
    You as the owner of your own home have responsibility as it us your own home. These people were living in portacabins supplied to them and placed cheek by jowl.
    Were the people in Grenfell responsible for the cxxp apartments built for them?
    Do you think the individuals whose kitchen fire started the Grenfell fire are the only ones responsible for the deaths of all those people? Would you blame them too?

    Many people are responsible, some of whom are paid to be accountable.

    I know if I lived in a unsuitable council house/residence/rented house. I wouldn't continue to add to my family. I wouldn't invite visitors to my house to spend the night and I'd be very cautious about drinking alcohol around children. I'd also never light a chip pan especially if I had consumed alcohol.


  • #4497
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    freshpopcorn wrote:
    I know if I lived in a unsuitable council house/residence/rented house. I wouldn't continue to add to my family. I wouldn't invite visitors to my house to spend the night and I'd be very cautious about drinking alcohol around children. I'd also never light a chip pan especially if I had consumed alcohol.


    You probably wouldn't smoke weed either......


  • #4498
    kowloon
    Registered Users Posts: 13,275 ✭✭✭✭kowloon


    Ruraldweller56 wrote: »
    Loud noises :mad: :mad: :mad:

    You make a good point.


  • #4499
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users Posts: 12,015 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    Cultural thing I guess, according to some the council should provide babysitting ( apparently adult sitting) services as a key service along with detailed instructions how to use a fire extinguisher and the dangers of chip pans.

    Actually, yes , there should be detailed instructions on all fire safety equipment , especially fire safety on particularly vulnerable areas . That's the fxxxin point!
    Other councils refuse to allow families with children in emergency sites, whether they get abuse for it or not .


  • #4500
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users Posts: 12,015 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    freshpopcorn wrote: »
    I know if I lived in a unsuitable council house/residence/rented house. I wouldn't continue to add to my family. I wouldn't invite visitors to my house to spend the night and I'd be very cautious about drinking alcohol around children. I'd also never light a chip pan especially if I had consumed alcohol.

    Well good for you , I am glad to hear it !


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  • #4501
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Goldengirl wrote:
    Actually, yes , there should be detailed instructions on all fire safety equipment , especially fire safety on particularly vulnerable areas . That's the fxxxin point! Other councils refuse to allow families with children in emergency sites, whether they get abuse for it or not .


    Actually there is, have a look at a fire extinguisher, fire blanket. Not just text but visual aids how to use device.
    Still trying to blame the council I see. Any thoughts on the actions of the individual that caused the fire?


This discussion has been closed.
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