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23-01-2014, 16:22   #46
 
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Originally Posted by Iamxavier View Post
What are you talking about? You don't witness an accident so it must not have happened? How illogical is that?

This morning on my way to work I was hit by a car, as she overtook me with oncoming traffic while I was overtaking a stationary bike (man putting his daughter on the child seat). She didn't have room for the maneuver but continued on anyway. The lady continued driving because she was in shock, I caught up with her and asked her WTF was she doing. Her response said it all "I didn't think ...bla bla bla". She didn't even know what to do in an accident. The traffic started moving again and she moved off.

Every day there are incidents on the trip to work.

...

Helmets, high viz gear and lights are essential. It's idiotic to venture out without.


Expensive lights and high viz clothing (gloves, bib & coat) couldn't prevent stupid people doing stupid things.

Sorry, I'm not following you. Are you saying hi-viz is essential or that it can't in fact "prevent stupid people doing stupid things"?

Were you wearing hi-viz when that motorist nearly hit you? Do you wear hi-viz every day on the trip to work?

If so, what difference is the hi-viz making in practical terms? Genuine question, by the way, not merely rhetorical.
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23-01-2014, 17:01   #47
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Nuts, isn't it? The evaluation showed they were wasting everyone's time (except for motorists'), which should have been no surprise imo. I'm inclined to trot out the old "only in America" cliche, but I'm afraid that when it comes to hivisteria and helmetophilia this country can hold its own.
I'm going to use it as a facetious counter-example the next time someone tells me I should always wear hi-viz so as to have every chance of being seen.
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23-01-2014, 17:11   #48
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Sorry, I'm not following you. Are you saying hi-viz is essential or that it can't in fact "prevent stupid people doing stupid things"?
Being highly visible is a good thing, it will help other road users see you.

It won't protect you from gobshítes who don't give a damn and terrible drivers.

Quote:
Were you wearing hi-viz when that motorist nearly hit you? Do you wear hi-viz every day on the trip to work?
Yup, sure was. I wear it every day. She seen me. She just hasn't a clue on how to use the road. Oh and there was no nearly in my sentence. She did hit me, just didn't knock me off the bike.


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If so, what difference is the hi-viz making in practical terms? Genuine question, by the way, not merely rhetorical.
If you don't wear high viz, or use GOOD lights on your bike it makes you harder to be seen. By all means, wear what you like, but it's definitely easier to see somebody wearing lights/high viz than those who chose not to wear it.
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23-01-2014, 17:26   #49
 
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I think most drivers see cyclists
I see dead cyclists.
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24-01-2014, 12:18   #50
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Originally Posted by Capt'n Midnight View Post
Just in case there is any confusion.

Bicycle helmets are only designed to protect a cyclist falling off a bike up to about 20-30Kmph.

They are not designed to offer significant protection for a collision with a motor vehicle at 50Kmph+ , for that you'd need something much stronger like a motorbike helmet.


High levels of high Viz, means motorists may be come lazy because they are conditioned to cyclists being easy to see and thus won't look as hard in future.



Ninja cyclists serve to keep motorists on their toes. But they are scary and should be arrested. High Vis at night is almost useless. lights and reflectors (not all high vis are equal) matter much more than colour.
I agree with your points apart from what I put in bold.

High vis is pretty important at night. It's definitely better than dull/dark clothing. It's doesn't take a massive lack of concentration to miss a cyclist/pedestrian who is wearing dark clothing.

There's multiple parties involved and all parties should contribute to the safety of others.
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24-01-2014, 12:26   #51
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It's been said here before, but it's worth repeating. The reflective stripes in hi-viz jackets are some use at night. The green/orange bit does nothing. Fluorescent materials convert UV radiation to visible radiation, which is why they "glow". Artificial light contains negligble UV, and artificial is all that's really available at night.

Fluorescent materials do increase conspicuity at dawn and dusk. But, really, there are such very good lights available now, you really should try one of them and then consider whether you need to dress like a binman.

If you want to sport reflective stripes at night, a Sam Browne at least can be folded up in your bag out of the way when you're off the bike.
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24-01-2014, 12:29   #52
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Originally Posted by tomasrojo View Post
It's been said here before, but it's worth repeating. The reflective stripes in hi-viz jackets are some use at night. The green/orange bit does nothing. Fluorescent materials convert UV radiation to visible radiation, which is why they "glow". Artificial light contains negligble UV, and artificial is all that's really available at night.

Fluorescent materials do increase conspicuity at dawn and dusk. But, really, there are such very good lights available now, you really should try one of them and then consider whether you need to dress like a binman.

If you want to sport reflective stripes at night, a Sam Browne at least can be folded up in your bag out of the way when you're off the bike.
All the gear I have has the reflective stripes which glow fantastically when light hits it. I don't think I have seen a high viz jacket yet that does not have the reflective strips on them. While the bright colors may not be great, they are certainly better than dark colors.
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24-01-2014, 12:34   #53
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Originally Posted by Iamxavier View Post
All the gear I have has the reflective stripes which glow fantastically when light hits it. I don't think I have seen a high viz jacket yet that does not have the reflective strips on them. While the bright colors may not be great, they are certainly better than dark colors.
There are plenty of jackets that have only reflective spots or piping. Or neither. All they are is fluorescent, or Chartreuse in colour.

Reflective stripes can be very visible, but it really depends on the angle of incidence of the light. They're really positioned too high to make optimal use of dipped headlights, though that's far from saying they do nothing. They however do do nothing as you approach side traffic from the right.
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24-01-2014, 12:39   #54
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While the bright colors may not be great, they are certainly better than dark colors.
Not much, from my observation, and I'm not the only one:
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An 2009 Australian study of drivers trying to see stationary cyclists on a closed circuit found that fluorescent vests (without retro-reflective stripes) were not a significant improvement on black clothing at night, and that retro-reflective strips were more effective when attached to knees and ankles than on a more or less static jacket
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-visibility_clothing
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24-01-2014, 12:41   #55
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A final observation I've made about hi-viz jackets is that I'm not sure they work all that well when worn on road bikes. The stooped position means the stripes are pointing mostly up at the sky, especially if strained over a backpack. Might increase side-on visibility though.
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24-01-2014, 13:00   #56
 
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Similarly I've been behind guys with lights attached to the top of their rucksacks. All well and good when stopped and standing, but only serves to highlight your presence to passing air traffic once cycling.
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24-01-2014, 13:01   #57
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Similarly I've been behind guys with lights attached to the top of their rucksacks. All well and good when stopped and standing, but only serves to highlight your presence to passing air traffic once cycling.
Similarly, many lights attached to back of helmets disappear into the rucksack once the cyclist is back in the drops and on the move.
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24-01-2014, 13:29   #58
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Similarly I've been behind guys with lights attached to the top of their rucksacks. All well and good when stopped and standing, but only serves to highlight your presence to passing air traffic once cycling.
My new favourite position is behind (or is it in front) of pannier bags, I only see them just as I pass. I find it hard to believe no one sees the stupidity.
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24-01-2014, 14:32   #59
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Originally Posted by Iamxavier View Post
All the gear I have has the reflective stripes which glow fantastically when light hits it. I don't think I have seen a high viz jacket yet that does not have the reflective strips on them. While the bright colors may not be great, they are certainly better than dark colors.
Voila:

http://www.wiggle.co.uk/castelli-squadra-long-waterproof-jacket/


(in "flouro" obviously)
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24-01-2014, 14:51   #60
CramCycle
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Originally Posted by Iamxavier View Post
All the gear I have has the reflective stripes which glow fantastically when light hits it. I don't think I have seen a high viz jacket yet that does not have the reflective strips on them. While the bright colors may not be great, they are certainly better than dark colors.
The ones the RSA were handing out a few months ago did not have reflective strips, they had matte grey strips which did not reflect anything.
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