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Cork - BusConnects

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Comments

  • #32
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,271 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    residents will loose 7 metres from their front garden?? how big are these gardens?


  • #33
    CatInABox
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,231 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatInABox


    marno21 wrote: »
    Apologies, plans for Phase 1 (Dennehys Cross-Wilton Gardens) have actually been published

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/owners-mobilise-over-wilton-road-plans-911784.html

    That's not actually BusConnects though, it's just the council being proactive. Nothing has been published about BusConnects Cork yet.

    The works you highlighted are the reason those folks are complaining though, so yeah, they've got a reason to.


  • #34
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,344 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    CatInABox wrote: »
    That's not actually BusConnects though, it's just the council being proactive. Nothing has been published about BusConnects Cork yet.

    The works you highlighted are the reason those folks are complaining though, so yeah, they've got a reason to.

    In fairness the Wilton Corridor will be a core component of BusConnects, and the Council have stated that these works will be advanced with the consideration of light rail using this corridor in the future

    If BusConnects is published for Cork soon then Wilton Gardens-CUH will certainly be part of the overall BusConnects plan

    But yes it is just the council showing initiative


  • #35
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,271 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    those plans aren't really all that supportive of the bus to be fair. Cars are still getting almost all the space. 2 car lanes and no bus lane per direction for long stretches.


  • #36
    namloc1980
    Registered Users Posts: 18,064 ✭✭✭✭namloc1980


    marno21 wrote: »
    On 96FM news this morning that a coalition of residents have said they will resist this plan - waiting for further details on the plan still

    BusConnects and any light rail/BRT corridor doesn't stand a chance in Cork. As we have seen with the ongoing year long uproar over the Pana bus lane, genuine and real improvements to public transport in the city faces a long uphill battle.


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  • #37
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,344 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    namloc1980 wrote: »
    BusConnects and any light rail/BRT corridor doesn't stand a chance in Cork. As we have seen with the ongoing year long uproar over the Pana bus lane, genuine and real improvements to public transport in the city faces a long uphill battle.

    When residents along the light rail corridor are shown the increase in house prices in suburbs served by Luas lines in Dublin after they open they won't be long changing their tune


  • #38
    namloc1980
    Registered Users Posts: 18,064 ✭✭✭✭namloc1980


    marno21 wrote: »
    When residents along the light rail corridor are shown the increase in house prices in suburbs served by Luas lines in Dublin after they open they won't be long changing their tune

    I doubt it. Unless they're actively going to sell their house and realise the gain, then it's a paper gain at most.


  • #39
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,344 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    namloc1980 wrote: »
    I doubt it. Unless they're actively going to sell their house and realise the gain, then it's a paper gain at most.
    That's been my argument all the time but it doesn't seem to be reflected in reality. There's a large campaign ongoing in Rochestown to block a motorway over fears of house devaluation when in fact the opposite is likely to occur.


  • #40
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,344 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Tender process for consultants for the design of BusConnects Cork to begin in May

    https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/First-step-to-be-taken-on-200m-plan-to-improve-Corks-bus-service-3b08c640-9ad9-43cf-8ffc-bcd395771ca8-ds


  • #41
    namloc1980
    Registered Users Posts: 18,064 ✭✭✭✭namloc1980


    Curious that the BusConnects proposals in CMATS have a cost estimate of c.€545m but all we ever hear about is the €200m that was allocated under the NDP. Where's the rest of the €345m to come from to actually make it happen in full or is it going to be a case of let's see how much of it we can do with €200m?


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  • #42
    CatInABox
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,231 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatInABox


    namloc1980 wrote: »
    Curious that the BusConnects proposals in CMATS have a cost estimate of c.€545m but all we ever hear about is the €200m that was allocated under the NDP. Where's the rest of the €345m to come from to actually make it happen in full or is it going to be a case of let's see how much of it we can do with €200m?

    The NDP stops at 2027, CMATS continues until 2040. The BusConnects part is scheduled to end 2031, but I'd say the experience in Dublin means that you could put that out to 2033, to be honest. I'd assume the €200m is for Cork BusConnects during the period 2026, when it is due to start, to 2027, when the NDP ends.

    All subject to change of course, sadly I think this has a higher chance of being put on the back burner than BusConnects or Metrolink, despite the fact that it should really be done on schedule.


  • #43
    CatInABox
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,231 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatInABox


    Looks like something might be happening down in Cork tonight....

    https://twitter.com/EoinBearla/status/1282717750415286273


  • #44
    CatInABox
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,231 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatInABox


    Some details here.
    The scheme, which will be funded by the National Transport Authority, includes plans for a complete upgrade of the public realm on MacCurtain St, with new and wider footpaths, bus priority measures, street resurfacing, new public lighting, additional street furniture and the planting of new trees.

    Crucially, the street which has had two traffic lanes one-way eastbound since the 1960s will be converted to a two-way traffic flow system.

    MacCurtain Street has undergone a mini renaissance in recent years and city officials said they hope the scheme will make the area and several adjoining streets more accommodating for shoppers, pedestrians and cyclists, and help create a new destination in the city centre.

    11WfYeFl.jpg


  • #45
    Markcheese
    Registered Users Posts: 8,428 ✭✭✭Markcheese


    How're you going to have 2 way traffic ,wider footpaths ,bus priority ( bus lane ? or just a few stops ) and still incorporate loading bays ect ...

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



  • #46
    CatInABox
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,231 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatInABox


    Markcheese wrote: »
    How're you going to have 2 way traffic ,wider footpaths ,bus priority ( bus lane ? or just a few stops ) and still incorporate loading bays ect ...

    Couldn't tell you for sure, but presumably they're going to remove the on street parking, turning that into a mixed path/loading bay (more path than loading bay). Then with the other three lanes, they're going to keep one as a bus lane, one as a normal car lane, and turn the third one into a contra flow bus lane.

    I also see a bus light in the images, so that'd probably be used on one of the side streets there.


  • #47
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,271 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    That street is a central part of the proposed luas route. Would be a shame to do this and then dig it all up to lay tracks. The Luas Cross city in Dublin brutalised the streetscape and DCC has not done anything to fix it since.


  • #48
    Heartbreak Hank
    Registered Users Posts: 232 ✭✭Heartbreak Hank


    Details here:


    https://virtualengage.arup.com/maccurtain-street/


    Pretty cool way of presenting the information without an actual public information session


  • #49
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,455 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    cgcsb wrote: »
    That street is a central part of the proposed luas route. Would be a shame to do this and then dig it all up to lay tracks. The Luas Cross city in Dublin brutalised the streetscape and DCC has not done anything to fix it since.

    Well it will likely be at least 10 years before we see Luas in Cork, if at all. So either way we would get plenty of use out of this.

    Having said that I wouldn't see Luas doing much damage to it anyway, just replace the bus lanes with Luas lines (probably shared with bus). If anything this feels like it is laying the ground work for Luas.


  • #50
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,344 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    bk wrote: »
    Well it will likely be at least 10 years before we see Luas in Cork, if at all. So either way we would get plenty of use out of this.

    Having said that I wouldn't see Luas doing much damage to it anyway, just replace the bus lanes with Luas lines (probably shared with bus). If anything this feels like it is laying the ground work for Luas.

    I agree

    This strikes me as a precursor to the Luas by starting a bus route along the Luas route with priority. If the Luas is going to be 2 way on McCurtain Street it does make sense that the street would be a 2 way bus corridor first


  • #51
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,357 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    marno21 wrote: »
    I agree

    This strikes me as a precursor to the Luas by starting a bus route along the Luas route with priority. If the Luas is going to be 2 way on McCurtain Street it does make sense that the street would be a 2 way bus corridor first

    Likely start with a BRT service.


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  • #52
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,271 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    the plan they proposed seems very car centric, emphasis on providing multiple lanes for cars and lanes for traffic making different turning movements rather than providing continuous bus and bike priority.


  • #53
    Pete_Cavan
    Registered Users Posts: 6,702 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    cgcsb wrote: »
    the plan they proposed seems very car centric, emphasis on providing multiple lanes for cars and lanes for traffic making different turning movements rather than providing continuous bus and bike priority.

    Agree to an extent but I'm not sure that that is entirely fair. The multiple lanes for cars making different turning movements seems to be mainly on the N20 which is going to remain a main artery into the city until the NRR is built at least. Same with the quays really. I think there has to be a balancing act as going too far with traffic restrictions will bring out all sorts of opposition and ultimately nothing happens.

    A two way cycle track in lieu of parking on Leitrim Street and down Pine Street to link with quays cycle lane instead of the dogs dinner that is proposed would make a lot more sense. That then gives cyclists an alternative route than that avoids that section of road with all the turn offs.

    If the plan is that McCurtain Street will eventually host a Luas system, the two traffic lanes will have to be retained, hopefully establishing the street as primarily PT for future conversion.

    The biggest issue jumping out at me is the gap in cycle lanes between the Patrick's and CR bridges. If there was a bus lane along the river and cyclists could use that for a short distance, you could forgive it but just leaving that gap is nonsense.


  • #54
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,271 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    Also there's a missed opportunity there to install a bicycle lift up Patricks Hill.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zipZ5kwhFfs


  • #55
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,455 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    cgcsb wrote: »
    Also there's a missed opportunity there to install a bicycle lift up Patricks Hill.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zipZ5kwhFfs

    Would never happen in Ireland because of legal reasons and wouldn't last anyway, too many moving parts.

    Someone who regularly needs to cycle up Patricks Hill should get an e-bike.


  • #56
    cgcsb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,271 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    what legal reasons?

    Regarding maintenance. At the moment Ireland doesn't do maintenance per say, we just buy new ****. This will have to change though so have to start somewhere. At present, emptying bins is a challenge, often not met.


  • #57
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,455 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    cgcsb wrote: »
    what legal reasons?

    Trip/fall and sue the council. Compo culture.


  • #58
    namloc1980
    Registered Users Posts: 18,064 ✭✭✭✭namloc1980


    cgcsb wrote: »
    what legal reasons?

    Regarding maintenance. At the moment Ireland doesn't do maintenance per say, we just buy new ****. This will have to change though so have to start somewhere. At present, emptying bins is a challenge, often not met.

    With the disrepair that the Coke Bike Scheme in the city has been allowed to fall into, I wouldn't see a bike lift leading very long before breaking down and not being repaired.


  • #59
    Pete_Cavan
    Registered Users Posts: 6,702 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    marno21 wrote: »
    This strikes me as a precursor to the Luas by starting a bus route along the Luas route with priority. If the Luas is going to be 2 way on McCurtain Street it does make sense that the street would be a 2 way bus corridor first
    Likely start with a BRT service.

    They really should be implementing a bendy bus service along the route now. The longer bus stops are easier to convert to Luas stops later and bendy bus are preferable to double deckers now anyway.


  • #60
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,357 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Pete_Cavan wrote: »
    They really should be implementing a bendy bus service along the route now. The longer bus stops are easier to convert to Luas stops later and bendy bus are preferable to double deckers now anyway.

    I hate bouncy bendy buses.

    Three axles are dreadful - if you must have longer buses, make them four axles. They should have sick bags standard in the trailer part of the bendy bus.


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  • #61
    Pete_Cavan
    Registered Users Posts: 6,702 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    I hate bouncy bendy buses.

    Three axles are dreadful - if you must have longer buses, make them four axles. They should have sick bags standard in the trailer part of the bendy bus.

    I haven't experienced such issues with bendy buses, in recent years at least, and I spend a lot of time in a city where they are the standard form of transport. They are more space efficient without need for a stairs, multiple doors speeds up boarding and alighting and they better accommodate buggies and those with mobility issues. They also allow for easier upgrade to light rail if necessary. With proper offboard ticketing, they would be great for our small cities.


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