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Beginner bike

  • 20-03-2021 6:44pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 389 ✭✭


    Hey everyone im looking at getting a licence for a motorbike. In my forties so will be going for an A licence. I have full car truck and bus but no experience on bikes.
    Am i right in thinking i will have to do IBT and test on a bike at least 600cc?
    What are your thoughts on a bike over 600cc to learn on?
    Thanks


«13456

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Theory test to get learner permit depending too.

    Definitely want to be doing on a 600 or more.
    Much better road holding.


  • Registered Users Posts: 389 ✭✭eoin.d


    "Beginner bike "was what i meant to put as thread title if mods can change it please


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Try out the ibt bikes and see how you feel before buying one.


  • Registered Users Posts: 389 ✭✭eoin.d


    Theory test to get learner permit depending too.

    Definitely want to be doing on a 600 or more.
    Much better road holding.

    I was hoping i would get away without theory test as i had bike on licence before but not on my current licence.
    Is it easier to learn on a bigger bike?


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    eoin.d wrote: »
    I was hoping i would get away without theory test as i had bike on licence before but not on my current licence.
    Is it easier to learn on a bigger bike?

    Honestly imo a bigger bike is much better to be honest.
    You say you had bike? Was it the under 50cc one.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 389 ✭✭eoin.d


    Honestly imo a bigger bike is much better to be honest.
    You say you had bike? Was it the under 50cc one.

    Im not sure what it was. It was on my licence maybe 15 years ago.


  • Registered Users Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Mjolnir


    eoin.d wrote: »
    Hey everyone im looking at getting a licence for a motorbike. In my forties so will be going for an A licence. I have full car truck and bus but no experience on bikes.
    Am i right in thinking i will have to do IBT and test on a bike at least 600cc?
    What are your thoughts on a bike over 600cc to learn on?
    Thanks

    Yes it has to be over 600cc or 599cc can't remember and over a certain kw.

    Depends there's a massive difference between a 650 dragster and my 600 cbr
    A cbr 1000 is another world away altogether.
    Fazers, bandits, cbf600, sv650 are all very capable very forgiving learner bikes and this is from an idiot who would of happily jumped straight onto a busa.

    Basic rule, naked and touring bikes are forgiving for learners so are cruisers but c¤ntishly heavy.
    Sports bikes are much less forgiving and a different riding experience.

    Also welcome to the dumba$$ club we have lots of fb groups hahah


  • Registered Users Posts: 389 ✭✭eoin.d


    Mjolnir wrote: »
    Yes it has to be over 600cc or 599cc can't remember and over a certain kw.

    Depends there's a massive difference between a 650 dragster and my 600 cbr
    A cbr 1000 is another world away altogether.
    Fazers, bandits, cbf600, sv650 are all very capable very forgiving learner bikes and this is from an idiot who would of happily jumped straight onto a busa.

    Basic rule, naked and touring bikes are forgiving for learners so are cruisers but c¤ntishly heavy.
    Sports bikes are much less forgiving and a different riding experience.

    Also welcome to the dumba$$ club we have lots of fb groups hahah
    Definitely be going for a sports bike. Ive always loved the look of a cbr.
    With so few insurance companies is it always possible for a learner to get first time insurance on something over 600cc?


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    eoin.d wrote: »
    Im not sure what it was. It was on my licence maybe 15 years ago.

    I'd say that was it, that would have no help to you.

    Have you done the theory since 2006 if I recall right them your covered.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    eoin.d wrote: »
    Definitely be going for a sports bike. Ive always loved the look of a cbr.
    With so few insurance companies is it always possible for a learner to get first time insurance on something over 600cc?

    I'd recommend against for doing test.

    You need a naked like said previously as these are much easier to control for turn about, walking along side while you don't put the foot down etc etc.

    I done my test on a 600 Yamaha naked, had dogs run out in front of me and then chase me, he obviously could see I controlled it well as I passed.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Mjolnir


    eoin.d wrote: »
    Definitely be going for a sports bike. Ive always loved the look of a cbr.
    With so few insurance companies is it always possible for a learner to get first time insurance on something over 600cc?

    Depends on the age where you live and if you can get a grade 2 or above assessment, if not you'll either be refused or given a phone number for a quote. Even with a grade 1 or 2 assessment you'll be looking at a relatively high quote.

    It's next to impossible do a full u turn on the test when riding a cbr. I've done it off my bike walking and it can't do it in one move. Also depending on your tester while you're allowed to peddle back and make it more a 3 point turn they can still fail you for it.

    Sports bikes are incredibly unforgiving to learn on, hard on your back and knees on any decent length journey, leave you tired as all hell too.
    Between the seating position, how they handles and the throttle response there is a much greater learning curve.

    Get what ya like and can insure, but ultimately they aren't great to learn on, I'm just a d!ckhead and like what I like and despite everyone telling me better I'll still do what I like. Would I have been better off with a fazer oh god yes but here we are.

    Also fazer has a detuned r6 engine with a much more comfortable forgiving ride position.
    Oh and when you drop it and there's an incredibly high chance you'll drop your first bike the cost of fairings is eye watering.

    Knowing all that if ya still want one, can afford to buy and insure it, have done the ibt and still really want it go for it. There's a lot more to a bike than the look of it though.


  • Registered Users Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Mjolnir


    Actually should of added there's a stupidly high chance that as a new biker on a 750+ sports bike you'll f@ck yourself up higher cc sports bike less forgiving and higher chance of an accident.

    New permit, no ncb you won't get a 1000cc sports bike insured or a 750 in all reality you'd be pushing it on a 600


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,459 ✭✭✭zubair


    OP, you mentioned twice about riding something over 600, is there a particular bike you had in mind.

    Same as MJ, I'd steer you away from a sports bike to start, power aside, the riding position is just wrong for learning, in particular the clip ons. I did my test on an Sv650s, it's not even a sports bike but the clip ons just made life harder for slow riding in particular the uturn, in fact the bars touched the tank on full lock. I'm not saying it can't be done, obviously, because I could uturn the bike but a more upright bike would have been much easier and I probably had to practice more for the test.Lots of suitable beginner bikes out there that are faired (er6, diversion) so they'll have the sportier look without the back and wrist breaking riding position, but if you drop it you'll find out how expenseive a bit of plastic can cost (if you can even find a replacement). It's your first bike, not your last, plenty of time to get your dream sports bike later. Just get something safe and easy to learn on to start.

    All that said, don't buy a bike until after you've done your IBT.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,308 ✭✭✭nigeldaniel


    In relation to the OP, I would say myself to anyone starting off for the first time having never before been on a motorbike, consider getting hold of a 125cc and spend a few hours pottering around in a big yard. A big clean yard at that, not a gravel yard. Once you master slow control 10kph in first gear doing U-turns, and stopping, going, braking and so on, you will transfer much easier to a big bike. When I started out a few years back I made a slight mistake at starting off on a 600 bandit and it took me about 15 hours off lessons to get the hang of it right. It was a school bike so I had nothing else to practice on in between. There is lots of confidence-building to be done for newbies.
    If you fancy an A bike [600cc] then a bandit or an sv650 comes to mind. the SV650 can have small forward control [gear shaft and back brake] so if you have big feet in a size 12 like me you might like to keep that in mind.
    PS. A small bike can be a bit of fun too and if you drop in in a yard you won't get too upset.

    Dan.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,459 ✭✭✭zubair


    In relation to the OP, I would say myself to anyone starting off for the first time having never before been on a motorbike, consider getting hold of a 125cc and spend a few hours pottering around in a big yard. A big clean yard at that, not a gravel yard. Once you master slow control 10kph in first gear doing U-turns, and stopping, going, braking and so on, you will transfer much easier to a big bike. When I started out a few years back I made a slight mistake at starting off on a 600 bandit and it took me about 15 hours off lessons to get the hang of it right. It was a school bike so I had nothing else to practice on in between. There is lots of confidence-building to be done for newbies.
    If you fancy an A bike [600cc] then a bandit or an sv650 comes to mind. the SV650 can have small forward control [gear shaft and back brake] so if you have big feet in a size 12 like me you might like to keep that in mind.
    PS. A small bike can be a bit of fun too and if you drop in in a yard you won't get too upset.

    Not trying to take away from your advice or expericne but the IBT is designed in this way already, start on a 125 in a private yard/ car park etc and work up to an A on the public roads.


  • Registered Users Posts: 389 ✭✭eoin.d


    So much great advice there everyone. Yes i really just want something i can learn on and get the basics down and get some experience. I definitely have a draw towards sports bikes especially a cbr, but if there not great to learn on i will get a more suitable bike first.


  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭robbie_63


    Hey Eoin,

    My first bike was a CBR650F, picked it up in Oct 20 the day after I finished my IBT Lessons.

    They are a great bike to start off on, not too powerful, little bit more upright than on a normal sports bike.

    I done my IBT on a Fazer 600 and it was a doddle to scoot around at very low speed and to hold it on the clutch,
    CBR took a bit more getting used to but once you keep practicing you will get there.

    Only problem with a sports bike starting off is when you drop it, you can do a lot of damage to the fairings, etc.

    I've had mine 6 months now and only dropped once, although that was because a car hit me from behind!

    Rob


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,308 ✭✭✭nigeldaniel


    zubair wrote: »
    Not trying to take away from your advice or expericne but the IBT is designed in this way already, start on a 125 in a private yard/ car park etc and work up to an A on the public roads.

    Thats kind of what I was trying to say but with the bike school up in the air at the moment I left out the IBT.

    Dan.



  • Registered Users Posts: 389 ✭✭eoin.d


    robbie_63 wrote: »
    Hey Eoin,

    My first bike was a CBR650F, picked it up in Oct 20 the day after I finished my IBT Lessons.

    They are a great bike to start off on, not too powerful, little bit more upright than on a normal sports bike.

    I done my IBT on a Fazer 600 and it was a doddle to scoot around at very low speed and to hold it on the clutch,
    CBR took a bit more getting used to but once you keep practicing you will get there.

    Only problem with a sports bike starting off is when you drop it, you can do a lot of damage to the fairings, etc.

    I've had mine 6 months now and only dropped once, although that was because a car hit me from behind!

    Rob

    I guess with enough practice you can learn on anything. Just depends on what you can get insured on. I definitely wont be buying anything near new but what would you need to be spending to get a safe reliable bike to learn on for a few years. I know it depends on the bike , but roughly?


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,740 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    I'm going to suggest looking at A2 bikes . Good for learning on, and if you pass your test on it you can progress to a full A without doing a further test, by taking MOD 5 lessons.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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  • Registered Users Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Mjolnir


    galwaytt wrote: »
    I'm going to suggest looking at A2 bikes . Good for learning on, and if you pass your test on it you can progress to a full A without doing a further test, by taking MOD 5 lessons.

    Why in gods name would you do that? If you're 24 or over that's asinine to be polite.
    If he's capable of passing an A2 he's capable of passing an A and not having to hold and be restricted by an A2 for 2 years.

    That's just a pointless exercise in futility.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭✭Jimmy Bottlehead


    eoin.d wrote: »
    I guess with enough practice you can learn on anything. Just depends on what you can get insured on. I definitely wont be buying anything near new but what would you need to be spending to get a safe reliable bike to learn on for a few years. I know it depends on the bike , but roughly?

    Yes you can technically learn on anything, but what (almost) everyone is saying is true - learning on a sport bike will be more difficult than it needs to be.
    And you really don't want to add in unnecessary complications to motorbikes especially when you're learning. Mistakes are costly on a bike, so keep it simple. Learn on a comfortable, easy to ride bike, because I can almost guarantee you'll enjoy riding so much (yeoooo) that you won't care what you're riding for quite some time. By that stage, you should be competent and that's the better time to get a bike that you want.

    Plus your bike tastes may change. I was adamant on getting a cruiser when I started. I got a naked because it was good for learning on. Loved it. Never really liked sports bikes. Then got a sports tourer last year. It's a strange aul hobby.

    As for your final question, it REALLY depends on the bike. I picked up my Honda Super Four for €1050 back in 2015. I sold it last year for €1100. Super solid bike for learning and enough power to keep me interested that long. Personally, I found it superb to learn on, but they're not extremely common any more.

    You're best off figuring out your bike budget, posting it here, and seeing what bikes fit into it. I assume you've budgeted for gear too?


  • Registered Users Posts: 337 ✭✭Betsy Og


    I agree with going straight for A licence, but remember you can usually rent instructor bikes for the test, so you don't necessarily need to buy a test suitable bike.

    I'm currently having good craic on a 125, bought for young fella to learn on next year. Sure it struggles on National Roads but it's grand for pottering up and down country lanes and the hours of practice are a good reintroduction at relatively low speeds and forgiving throttle. So a 2 bike strategy wouldn't be bad - something for at least a year (get 1 years NCB, test, in my case maybe an Insurance Assessment) & then go for the dream bike! The gear is expensive too so best not to be going "all out" on everything at the same time.

    Question - is there a name for aimless 'touring', driving down roads you don't know and taking whichever turn looks more interesting - I bloody love it anyway, just don't know how to easily describe it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,740 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    Mjolnir wrote: »
    Why in gods name would you do that? If you're 24 or over that's asinine to be polite.
    If he's capable of passing an A2 he's capable of passing an A and not having to hold and be restricted by an A2 for 2 years.

    That's just a pointless exercise in futility.

    No more pointless than your rant tbh.

    Maybe you should re-read my post, or possibly actually read it for the first time.

    OP could get a nice mid-size bike, that he likes, is comfortable with, and not break the bank, and more or less ignore whehter it's A2 or A. If it's an A2 restricted, it can be unrestricted for s.f.a.

    If it happens to be an A, fine. You really need to remove the blinkers.

    Examples of A2 eligible (and some are A eligible as well):

    BMW F650 - various versions
    BMW R850 - various versions
    Ducati Monster
    Ducati Multistrada
    Ducati Supersport
    Enfield - various versions
    Harley Davidson - various versions from 883 to 1340 to 1450
    Honda CB series - lots
    Honda Hornet - various
    Honda Goldwing 1500
    Honda Deauville
    Honda cruisers - various
    Kawasaki ER, EN, GPz, KLR, VN, Z, Zephyr,
    KTM - 690, 640
    Moto-Guzzi - lots
    Suzuki - Bandit, SV, DL, GS, GSX, GSF, M, C, ....the list goes on
    Triumph - lots.
    Victory - several
    Yamaha - lots & lots. MT, FZ, FZR, VStar, Dragstar, XJ, XT,


    Anyone who thinks the above list is 'limiting' needs to spend more time on their bike tbh.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • Registered Users Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Mjolnir


    galwaytt wrote: »
    No more pointless than your rant tbh.

    Maybe you should re-read my post, or possibly actually read it for the first time.

    OP could get a nice mid-size bike, that he likes, is comfortable with, and not break the bank, and more or less ignore whehter it's A2 or A. If it's an A2 restricted, it can be unrestricted for s.f.a.

    If it happens to be an A, fine. You really need to remove the blinkers.

    Examples of A2 eligible (and some are A eligible as well):

    BMW F650 - various versions
    BMW R850 - various versions
    Ducati Monster
    Ducati Multistrada
    Ducati Supersport
    Enfield - various versions
    Harley Davidson - various versions from 883 to 1340 to 1450
    Honda CB series - lots
    Honda Hornet - various
    Honda Goldwing 1500
    Honda Deauville
    Honda cruisers - various
    Kawasaki ER, EN, GPz, KLR, VN, Z, Zephyr,
    KTM - 690, 640
    Moto-Guzzi - lots
    Suzuki - Bandit, SV, DL, GS, GSX, GSF, M, C, ....the list goes on
    Triumph - lots.
    Victory - several
    Yamaha - lots & lots. MT, FZ, FZR, VStar, Dragstar, XJ, XT,


    Anyone who thinks the above list is 'limiting' needs to spend more time on their bike tbh.

    You said get an A2 and pass your test on it, gues what that means he's restricted to A2 bikes for 2 years I read it fine.
    Remove the blinkers because I don't think someone should follow bad advice and pointlessly complicate things?
    If you're over 24 you qualify for full A category, even if you buy a 125cc you'd be best served taking the test on an A and not p!ssing around being restricted for 2 years.

    You left out the period of 2 years before you can do mod 5 for progressive access and now you're leaving out the fact the likes of a fzr needs to be restricted for A2. A fair amount of those bikes need restricting to be A2 eligible, they are not automatically A and A2 eligible.

    Being someone that likes sportsbikes I know where he is coming from your advice is useless to him getting on a true 600+ sportsbike in any decent frame of time.

    Think you could spend the couple more seconds to provide all the caveats that come along with your advice.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭✭Jimmy Bottlehead


    RZM0j2cMX6D1.gif


  • Registered Users Posts: 33,650 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato
    Restaurant at the End of the Universe


    Mjolnir wrote: »
    A fair amount of those bikes need restricting to be A2 eligible, they are not automatically A and A2 eligible.

    nothing is.

    It took a while but I don't mind. How does my body look in this light?



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,459 ✭✭✭zubair


    nothing is.

    Yes it is!

    fydS.gif


  • Registered Users Posts: 389 ✭✭eoin.d


    Alot of great bikes have been mentioned any of which i would be very happy with. I will definitely be going for the A licence, and be finished with it. God only knows when i will get any bike with this lockdown. Couple of months wait for a theory test , IBT not even running and i cant imagine how long i will have to wait for the test then


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,459 ✭✭✭zubair


    I'd still suggest doing the IBT before geting a bike. Your instructor will have plenty of advice for you too. Keep us posted on how you're getting on.


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