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Nvidia RTX Discussion

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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    deceit wrote: »
    I'm curious, unlike G-sync is their anything stopping AMD from using their own hardware acceleration on these games?

    I don't think so. So far ray tracing titles on PC have used DX12 DXR so AMD would have access to DX12 development kits.
    The problem is Navi was released very recently and it has no hardware accelerated DXR support. So if AMD decide to develop hardware for it, it will be a couple of years down the line.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,963 ✭✭✭jonerkinsella


    tuxy wrote: »
    I don't think so. So far ray tracing titles on PC have used DX12 DXR so AMD would have access to DX12 development kits.
    The problem is Navi was released very recently and it has no hardware accelerated DXR support. So if AMD decide to develop hardware for it, it will be a couple of years down the line.


    AMD have already. It's called Next gen consoles and they are coming next year in the many millions. Sony and Microsoft have already confirmed that the consoles will run RT.


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,689 ✭✭✭✭K.O.Kiki


    AMD have already. It's called Next gen consoles and they are coming next year in the many millions. Sony and Microsoft have already confirmed that the consoles will run RT.

    Sony/Microsoft also promised 4K gaming in the last generation, so... :pac:


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,979 ✭✭✭✭Cuddlesworth


    tuxy wrote: »
    The problem is Navi was released very recently and it has no hardware accelerated DXR support. So if AMD decide to develop hardware for it, it will be a couple of years down the line.

    5700-xt = 7nm 251mm²
    RTX 2070 SUPER = 12nm 545mm²

    As far as I know, if your selling a chip half the size on a smaller fab for near the same price, you make a lot more money per sale then your competitor.

    Why would the start putting in dedicated hardware now, it will only chip away at their profit?


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,718 ✭✭✭Cordell


    K.O.Kiki wrote: »
    Sony/Microsoft also promised 4K gaming in the last generation, so... :pac:

    And you can have a 4K screen connected to one of those no problem :)
    That promise is that unspecific :)


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    AMD have already. It's called Next gen consoles and they are coming next year in the many millions. Sony and Microsoft have already confirmed that the consoles will run RT.

    Navi has no processing units for rendering Ray tracing so it will be a software implimation in the same way GTX cards can run ray tracing.

    Here's raytracing running on 1080ti

    I just don't think the difference in visuals is worth such large drop in proformance. Especially when you consider how much they could increase visual effects using rastarisation. For the first few years of the new console it will be used sparinly mainly just to create hype, then later in years to come it will actually be viable.

    Perhaps developers will be able to optimise the code over the comming years to get better results. AMD may develop cores for ray tracing on the next generation of cards and then release them in ps5 pro or X version of the now xbox. But whether they go the optimised software or dedicated hardware route it's years away, probably at least 3 years after the new consoles are released.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,718 ✭✭✭Cordell


    Yes, Metro Exodus looks amazing with RT off and turning it on brings very little. and in that video there's a lot of water scenes, but they don't implement RT reflections at all. Control is the game you need to look at to see some real improvements.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Cordell wrote: »
    Yes, Metro Exodus looks amazing with RT off and turning it on brings very little. and in that video there's a lot of water scenes, but they don't implement RT reflections at all. Control is the game you need to look at to see some real improvements.

    A GTX 1080ti can get 10 - 30 fps with RTX on in cortrol, if they could get it stable at 25 fps on navi do you think that would be an accecptable experiace for console?
    Actully, maybe lower it to 24 fps so it can be called cinematic ray tracing.
    Of course I'm joking but if 30 fps is accectable for most people on console would 25 fps really be that bad?
    I think I've played GTA game on console in the past where the frame rate is sub 30 for large sections of the game.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,718 ✭✭✭Cordell


    I'm not a frame rate fanatic but for me when it dips under 50 it really irks me.
    Now, if you were to play at 30 fps cinematic ray tracing :pac: from the start maybe if can be acceptable for console people, in fact this was the norm not too long ago, 30fps capped on the last gen consoles.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    If people bustomers for the new consoles expect ray tracing then you could see deelepors go down the route of continuing to use checkerboard rendering and low frame rates. It was used last in the current gen with great success.
    From a marketing point of veiw it might be the most sucnessful way to go.
    20 - 30 fps in single player games with some limited ray tracing effects and then 60 fps in multiplayer games.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,299 ✭✭✭✭BloodBath


    5700-xt = 7nm 251mm²
    RTX 2070 SUPER = 12nm 545mm²

    As far as I know, if your selling a chip half the size on a smaller fab for near the same price, you make a lot more money per sale then your competitor.

    Why would the start putting in dedicated hardware now, it will only chip away at their profit?

    A mature 7nm process should be cheaper. Early 7nm costs roughly twice as much as Nvidias mature 12nm process.

    Lower yields on the 7nm process push the costs up but it should come down as the node matures.

    Didn't we have a demo showing hardware accelerated ray tracing on amd hardware already using a vega 56 no less. Granted it was only reflections.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,984 ✭✭✭Venom


    tuxy wrote: »
    A GTX 1080ti can get 10 - 30 fps with RTX on in cortrol, if they could get it stable at 25 fps on navi do you think that would be an accecptable experiace for console?
    Actully, maybe lower it to 24 fps so it can be called cinematic ray tracing.
    Of course I'm joking but if 30 fps is accectable for most people on console would 25 fps really be that bad?
    I think I've played GTA game on console in the past where the frame rate is sub 30 for large sections of the game.


    The problem for Sony and Microsoft is they have touted their upcoming consoles as 60+fps beasts and good luck trying to explain the complexities of RT to the average punter.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,538 ✭✭✭ Genevieve Disgusting Self-improvement


    I think this entire thread is testament to the fact no matter what the truth is people just make up whatever anyway.


  • Registered Users Posts: 27,634 ✭✭✭✭TitianGerm


    Venom wrote: »
    The problem for Sony and Microsoft is they have touted their upcoming consoles as 60+fps beasts and good luck trying to explain the complexities of RT to the average punter.

    The Ray tracing in consoles might only be a slimed down version used in very specific circumstances.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,425 ✭✭✭Inviere


    TitianGerm wrote: »
    The Ray tracing in consoles might only be a slimed down version used in very specific circumstances.

    A bit like years worth of resolution claims really.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,479 ✭✭✭M00lers


    For those of you lucky enough to own a LG OLED C9 and an RTX card.

    http://www.lgnewsroom.com/2019/09/lg-unveils-first-oled-tvs-to-support-nvidia-g-sync-for-big-screen-gaming-experience/

    Should really come into its own whenever 2.1 HDMI arrives on GPUs.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,538 ✭✭✭ Genevieve Disgusting Self-improvement




  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    So he believes DLSS is not using tensor cores in control but Nvidia still limited it to RTX cards.
    Is this making a stronger case for the tensor cores being unessasary in the future?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,538 ✭✭✭ Genevieve Disgusting Self-improvement


    tuxy wrote: »
    So he believes DLSS is not using tensor cores in control but Nvidia still limited it to RTX cards.
    Is this making a stronger case for the tensor cores being unessasary in the future?

    No...but I suppose people will take whatever their bias is from it. :rolleyes:

    I took the fact you can ray trace everything on at 4k and get over 60 fps
    . That DLSS upscalling is almost indistinguishable from native 4k, better in some cases and a little worse in others. The implementation of DLSS in control "may" not be running on the tensor cores at the moment but. This article is good

    https://wccftech.com/nvidia-details-new-dlss-technique-in-control-explains-how-dlss-can-further-improve-in-the-future/


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,689 ✭✭✭✭K.O.Kiki




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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,299 ✭✭✭✭BloodBath


    About time. Hopefully we see some more software support for that hardware. It's a waste otherwise.

    Gonna be grabbing a 2070 or 2070S next month. Seen 2070's with decent coolers going as cheap as €430.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,538 ✭✭✭ Genevieve Disgusting Self-improvement


    K.O.Kiki wrote: »

    How long will it take for somebody to post this is not a good thing, its somehow negative and that RTX is a waste of time and money...

    RTX already had a big improvement in IPC on a lot of cad packages that were cuda accelerated. My own work use showed considerable improvement.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,945 ✭✭✭Anima




  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Anima wrote: »

    It's the same price as this
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/ASUS-GeForce-High-Performance-Cooling-DUAL-RTX2080-O8G/dp/B07GQ52PNH/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=GeForce+RTX+2080&qid=1569516979&sr=8-2

    The blower cards are only good for ITX builds or if you are replacing them with a water cooling solution anyway.


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,689 ✭✭✭✭K.O.Kiki


    Anima wrote: »

    Only worth if you replace the cooler IMHO.
    Get a cheap 2070 Super (e.g. https://www.saturn.de/de/product/_kfa2-geforce%C2%AE-rtx-2070-super-ex-27isl6mdu9ek-2574158.html ) if you can't be arsed doing it yourself (e.g. with an Arctic Accelero Xtreme III, or Kraken G12 + AIO).


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,415 ✭✭✭.G.


    Maybe not directly related but since its an DLSS game anyone play Shadow of the tomb raider? I have it but its crashing non stop saying my gpu doesn't have enough resources to play it or something like that. RTX 2080ti I doubt that!


  • Registered Users Posts: 40 MaLiYa


    Anybody using an RTX with SolidWorks. Am thinking of upgrading but to an RTX 4000 which is specifically for CAD but could save €500-€600 if I went with a consumer card like a 2070 Super.


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,689 ✭✭✭✭K.O.Kiki


    MaLiYa wrote: »
    Anybody using an RTX with SolidWorks. Am thinking of upgrading but to an RTX 4000 which is specifically for CAD but could save €500-€600 if I went with a consumer card like a 2070 Super.

    As alluded to in the SolidWorks build thread - Quadro P2000 (€430) should be good enough for most projects.
    Check benchmarks on PugetSystems :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 40 MaLiYa


    This is a pretty good video which leads me to think I'd be better off going up a step on the ladder.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    I haven't been playing games recently but was really surprised that the new COD has ray tracing features on PC.
    This is it ray tracing has finally gone main stream, you can expect 2020 to be an outstanding year for Nvidia where all their innovation will pay off.



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