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Confused over increase

  • 08-11-2018 11:40pm
    #1
    D3V!L
    Registered Users Posts: 2,923 ✭✭✭


    I'm seven and a half years renting the same property. Each year I renewed the lease with the landlord with very little increases. I'm living in an RPZ also.

    Last year the rent was increased 4% and the lease is set to expire towards the end of this year.

    The landlord is now looking for another increase of 4%.

    Am I right in thinking that he can't increase it two years in a row with a fixed term lease ? Also if I don't sign a new lease am I entitled to stay for a period afterwards under the part 4 tenancy ?


Comments

  • #2
    garhjw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,424 ✭✭✭garhjw


    https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/calculator/rpz

    This will answer your question on rent


  • #3
    D3V!L
    Registered Users Posts: 2,923 ✭✭✭D3V!L


    garhjw wrote: »
    https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/calculator/rpz

    This will answer your question on rent

    I was just looking at that and it's conflicting . It says that the rent can be increased by 4% for the second year where other pages mention it's after 24 months.


  • #4
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    D3V!L wrote: »
    I was just looking at that and it's conflicting . It says that the rent can be increased by 4% for the second year where other pages mention it's after 24 months.

    The first increase has to be after 24 months but subsequent increases can then be done after 12 months so the LL is allowed to increase again this year.


  • #5
    ross2010
    Registered Users Posts: 67 ✭✭ross2010


    Yes he is allowed to increase it again however he must wait until the lease expires and then he can give the 3 months notice and the new rent increase can only come into effect after that. In other words if your lease expires on 31st Dec then the new increase will come into effect on 1st April. That's my understanding.


  • #6
    Graniteville
    Closed Accounts Posts: 292 ✭✭Graniteville


    ross2010 wrote: »
    Yes he is allowed to increase it again however he must wait until the lease expires and then he can give the 3 months notice and the new rent increase can only come into effect after that. In other words if your lease expires on 31st Dec then the new increase will come into effect on 1st April. That's my understanding.

    Your post probably has good intentions, but unless you can show where this is stated, the OP should ignore it.

    It mis-information / someone's opinion that people then take as fact that causes a huge amount of argument in all spheres of life.


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  • #7
    ross2010
    Registered Users Posts: 67 ✭✭ross2010


    Graniteville wrote: »
    Your post probably has good intentions, but unless you can show where this is stated, the OP should ignore it.

    It mis-information / someone's opinion that people then take as fact that causes a huge amount of argument in all spheres of life.

    It isn't just my opinion or mis-information. I have had to abide by this rule for my own property which is in a RPZ. My letting agent confirmed my understanding. The OP should check it out for themselves.


  • #8
    ross2010
    Registered Users Posts: 67 ✭✭ross2010


    Graniteville wrote: »
    Your post probably has good intentions, but unless you can show where this is stated, the OP should ignore it.

    It mis-information / someone's opinion that people then take as fact that causes a huge amount of argument in all spheres of life.

    See below from Citizen Information

    Notice of rent review
    Once the required period (12 or 24 months) has elapsed, your landlord can issue a notice of rent review.

    The landlord must give you proper notice of the amount of the proposed new rent and the date from which it is to take effect. The notice must be in writing and contain the information prescribed by the legislation – see ‘Notice of rent review’ below. Emails, text messages and spoken messages are not valid forms of notice.

    You must get at least 90 days’ notice of a rent review. This means that the new rent cannot then apply until 90 days after the notice has been issued.


  • #9
    Graniteville
    Closed Accounts Posts: 292 ✭✭Graniteville


    ross2010 wrote: »
    See below from Citizen Information

    Notice of rent review
    Once the required period (12 or 24 months) has elapsed, your landlord can issue a notice of rent review.

    The landlord must give you proper notice of the amount of the proposed new rent and the date from which it is to take effect. The notice must be in writing and contain the information prescribed by the legislation – see ‘Notice of rent review’ below. Emails, text messages and spoken messages are not valid forms of notice.

    You must get at least 90 days’ notice of a rent review. This means that the new rent cannot then apply until 90 days after the notice has been issued.

    Nothing there to say that the notice period must be at the end of a lease.

    OP has already got notification of the increase. I would guess its 3 months notice and take effect at the end of 12 months after the previous increase.

    How you suggested it meant would mean an increase could only take place every 15 months.

    If OP is to sign a new lease from 1st Jan and last increase was 1st Jan 2018 and LL sent notification of new rent before 1st Oct, then I can't see what is wrong with that


  • #10
    D3V!L
    Registered Users Posts: 2,923 ✭✭✭D3V!L


    OP here again,

    "Tenancies commencing before 24th December 2016
    For tenancies that began before the 24th of December 2016, after a 6 month probationary period, the tenant secures the right to remain in the property for a further 3 1/2 years. This is known as a ‘Part 4 tenancy’."


    Say for example I signed a fixed term 1 year lease early December 2016, would the 4 years start from then for the part 4 tenancy or begin again the next year when I renew the fixed term lease ?


  • #11
    ross2010
    Registered Users Posts: 67 ✭✭ross2010


    Graniteville wrote: »
    Nothing there to say that the notice period must be at the end of a lease.

    OP has already got notification of the increase. I would guess its 3 months notice and take effect at the end of 12 months after the previous increase.

    How you suggested it meant would mean an increase could only take place every 15 months.

    If OP is to sign a new lease from 1st Jan and last increase was 1st Jan 2018 and LL sent notification of new rent before 1st Oct, then I can't see what is wrong with that

    What is wrong with that is that it is incorrect. The notice period can only start after the end of the fixed term lease. I could hardly believe it when I heard it myself but it has been repeatedly confirmed to me by various professionals who work in the lettings area. So for example you could have a lease renewal with an increase on 1st Jan 2018. On 1st Jan 2019 you issue the 3 month notice period, on 1st April 2019 the increased rent comes into effect. The lease is due for renewal on 1st Jan 2020 so on that date another increase notice can be issued which comes into effect on 1st April 2020...and it carries on like that. That's how it works.

    You can continue arguing if you wish however you are incorrect. Again, as already mentioned the OP should check it out themselves.


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  • #12
    GingerLily
    Registered Users Posts: 4,767 ✭✭✭GingerLily


    D3V!L wrote: »
    OP here again,

    "Tenancies commencing before 24th December 2016
    For tenancies that began before the 24th of December 2016, after a 6 month probationary period, the tenant secures the right to remain in the property for a further 3 1/2 years. This is known as a ‘Part 4 tenancy’."


    Say for example I signed a fixed term 1 year lease early December 2016, would the 4 years start from then for the part 4 tenancy or begin again the next year when I renew the fixed term lease ?

    Its the start date of your original tenancy.

    Your 7.5 years with your landlord, so in 6 months time (i.e. 8 years) has he can ask you to leave, no reason required.


  • #13
    D3V!L
    Registered Users Posts: 2,923 ✭✭✭D3V!L


    GingerLily wrote: »
    Its the start date of your original tenancy.

    Your 7.5 years with your landlord, so in 6 months time (i.e. 8 years) has he can ask you to leave, no reason required.

    Does he have to give notice at the 8 year mark ?


  • #14
    GingerLily
    Registered Users Posts: 4,767 ✭✭✭GingerLily


    D3V!L wrote: »
    Does he have to give notice at the 8 year mark ?

    Yes, I don't know the details,

    Worth reading this :

    http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/renting_a_home/types_of_tenancy.html#lef263


  • #15
    Graniteville
    Closed Accounts Posts: 292 ✭✭Graniteville


    ross2010 wrote: »
    What is wrong with that is that it is incorrect. The notice period can only start after the end of the fixed term lease. I could hardly believe it when I heard it myself but it has been repeatedly confirmed to me by various professionals who work in the lettings area. So for example you could have a lease renewal with an increase on 1st Jan 2018. On 1st Jan 2019 you issue the 3 month notice period, on 1st April 2019 the increased rent comes into effect. The lease is due for renewal on 1st Jan 2020 so on that date another increase notice can be issued which comes into effect on 1st April 2020...and it carries on like that. That's how it works.

    You can continue arguing if you wish however you are incorrect. Again, as already mentioned the OP should check it out themselves.

    That's crazy! I wasn't arguing, just thought it was best for the OP to have the full info and where it is stated.

    As I said, there's a lot of mis information online, so once the OP can show what the information is based on and point to the relevant information, that's good.

    I was a LL back in the 90's - fairly happy I'm not one now.


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