Help needed with Traffic Camera Set up

lolliedog · 30-11-2020 10:02pm #1

Hi All

I have a dangerous exit from my house so I was looking at putting a camera on the pillar, power is available from the electric panel for the gates.

Is there any way that when the gates activated the live picture would come up on my phone so that I can check the road and exit safely.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Del2005 · 30-11-2020 11:28pm

You can't have a domestic CCTV viewing a public place. People have it used curved mirrors for years to see traffic if they have bad visibility

cruizer101 · 30-11-2020 11:46pm

What if it is not recording, just relaying the image.
I think the restrictions are just against recording.

thomas anderson. · 30-11-2020 11:48pm

I had CCTV set up before, one camera facing down the road. cops even asked me for footage after a number of car break ins.

lolliedog · 01-12-2020 12:09am

Del2005 wrote: »

You can't have a domestic CCTV viewing a public place. People have it used curved mirrors for years to see traffic if they have bad visibility

I have one on order, but was looking for a better set up.

lolliedog · 01-12-2020 12:10am

cruizer101 wrote: »

What if it is not recording, just relaying the image.
I think the restrictions are just against recording.

Yeah, I don't need to record.

dam099 · 01-12-2020 1:30am

What if the video stream freezes or is laggy and you don't realise? Not impossible if you are using Wifi or such to stream to your phone and could potentially have dire consequences. Low tech with the mirror might be the better safer option.

ted1 · 05-12-2020 12:37am

Del2005 wrote: »

You can't have a domestic CCTV viewing a public place.

Don’t be that guy.....,I suppose Google street view is completely illegal too ..

My concern would be that any kind of lag would be dangerous

SouthWesterly · 06-12-2020 10:30pm

ted1 wrote: »

Don’t be that guy.....,I suppose Google street view is completely illegal too ..

My concern would be that any kind of lag would be dangerous

The issue is that you become the data controller and responsible for what happens it.

07-12-2020 8:41am

Del2005 wrote: »

You can't have a domestic CCTV viewing a public place.

I wouldnt worry. Everyone with a smart phone is bearking the law in addition to every bank and shop in the counttry (as they all have cameras on the outside of thier premises).

Clareman · 07-12-2020 8:56am

2011 wrote: »

I wouldnt worry. Everyone with a smart phone is bearking the law in addition to every bank and shop in the counttry (as they all have cameras on the outside of thier premises).

Are you sure about that??? Banks/shops would have a legal and legitimate interest in having their CCTV cameras up. CCTV and GDPR is a nightmare, even dashcams are tricky, at the moment everyone is hoping not to be a guinea pig for a test case. https://www.lawsociety.ie/gazette/in-depth/cctv-data-protection/

Personally, as you shouldn't be using your phone when driving, any solution will only be available to you or others you've setup on you system, the GDPR impact, the fact that if there's an accident on the road you'll be expected to share the footage, I'd be avoiding the technology route and looking to put up a mirror or something

07-12-2020 2:17pm

Clareman wrote: »

Are you sure about that???

I think that you will agree:

1) Most people that have smart phones who take videos in public places don't have permission to do so.

2) Many people have video doorbells that cover some public areas.

3) Not every shop in the country that has cameras on the outside have some special permission.

4) Ditto for dash cams.

I agree that the OP should abandon this idea though.

liamog · 07-12-2020 2:20pm

GDPR does not apply to private individuals

This Regulation does not apply to the processing of personal data by a natural person in the course of a purely personal or household activity and thus with no connection to a professional or commercial activity. Personal or household activities could include correspondence and the holding of addresses, or social networking and online activity undertaken within the context of such activities. However, this Regulation applies to controllers or processors which provide the means for processing personal data for such personal or household activities.

So a camera used purely as household activity, such as the OP, or a video doorbell, does not make you a data controller.

Clareman · 07-12-2020 2:55pm

2011 wrote: »

I think that you will agree:

I wouldn't actually for a number of reasons

2011 wrote: »

1) Most people that have smart phones who take videos in public places don't have permission to do so.

You don't have the right to privacy in a public place so there is no need for permission to be granted

2011 wrote: »

2) Many people have video doorbells that cover some public areas.

Under recital 18 of GDPR, GDPR doesn't apply to personal or household activities, if someone is going outside of this remit then they are recording public places and become data controllers

2011 wrote: »

3) Not every shop in the country that has cameras on the outside have some special permission.

They mightn't have permissions but they need to adhere to the law, this document makes is very clear what is expected
https://www.dataprotection.ie/sites/default/files/uploads/2019-05/CCTV%20guidance%20data%20controller.pdf

2011 wrote: »

4) Ditto for dash cams.

Dash cams are covered here https://www.dataprotection.ie/sites/default/files/uploads/2019-12/Guidance%20for%20Drivers%20on%20the%20use%20of%20Dash%20Cams.pdf

2011 wrote: »

I agree that the OP should abandon this idea though.

Absolutely, the Ops intent here is to use technology to make his life easier but the use of this technology (recording of other people, processing of data, use of mobile phone, etc. etc.) opens up a lot of headaches that I don't think anyone knows the solution to, GDPR is still extremely new and there is a need for case law for a lot of it, you don't want to be that test case. Personally, I'd be putting a mirror up

[Deleted User] · 07-12-2020 2:59pm

Are you going to call the Garda on the OP?
I'd say hes trembling in his boots

Clareman · 07-12-2020 3:03pm

BrownFinger wrote: »

Are you going to call the Garda on the OP?
I'd say hes trembling in his boots

Absolutely not and in the real world this won't be an issue until it is an issue, it has opened up an interesting discussion on CCTV and the use of data though. Personally, I think the use of technology in situations like this can cause more hassle than it's worth so I'd be looking for low-tech solutions.

liamog · 07-12-2020 3:03pm

BrownFinger wrote: »

Are you going to call the Garda on the OP?
I'd say hes trembling in his boots

There's no grounds for the Garda to be involved, one it's an issue for the Office of the Data Protection Commissioner, and two, it's not an even an issue under the regulations. People shouldn't run scared of regulations due to possibly incorrect advice taken from boards.ie.

Clareman · 07-12-2020 3:31pm

Right, ignoring data protection/CCTV and all that........................................

The op wants to have an app on his phone that will automatically open with a video feed when an activity happens (gate opens). I'm guessing something like this might do the trick https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.ivideon.client&hl=en_IE&gl=US

Clareman · 07-12-2020 3:42pm

liamog wrote: »

There's no grounds for the Garda to be involved,

Unauthourised recording or the installation of something on a public place could be grounds, if the camera catching an offence occuring the Gardas could be involved.
one it's an issue for the Office of the Data Protection Commissioner,
Yup, also could be for the Gardas because of the reasons above

liamog wrote: »

and two, it's not an even an issue under the regulations. People shouldn't run scared of regulations due to possibly incorrect advice taken from boards.ie.

The problem with all this is that there's no definitive incorrect or correct for most cases yet, it's all people's opinions and until there's a case with a ruling then that's all it's going to be. An example would be an insurance company who was giving free dashcams, or discounts for people who use them, the DPC made a ruling that still isn't clear but the Irish Times has some good guidelines https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/q-a-how-to-ensure-your-dash-cam-does-not-infringe-privacy-law-1.3727572

liamog · 07-12-2020 3:56pm

OP is planning on installing a camera on a pillar which is presumably their own property. OP is not operating the camera as a commercial entity so doesn't fall under GDPR as the activity is "processing of personal data by a natural person in the course of a purely personal or household activity" which is specially excluded from GDPR.

In the case of the OP's problem, I would still probably go with a low tech mirror based system, a camera and alert based system seems overly complex for little added value.

ted1 · 07-12-2020 4:02pm

Clareman wrote: »

I

Absolutely, the Ops intent here is to use technology to make his life easier but the use of this technology (recording of other people, processing of data, use of mobile phone, etc. etc.) opens up a lot of headaches that I don't think anyone knows the solution to, GDPR is still extremely new and there is a need for case law for a lot of it, you don't want to be that test case. Personally, I'd be putting a mirror up

You clearly have not read or understood what the op’s intent is.

He wants live footage. No recording needed.

Op no need for an app. You can’t use it when driving. An outdoor tv mounted internally will show you what’s happening.

A mirror would be easier

Clareman · 07-12-2020 4:37pm

ted1 wrote: »

You clearly have not read or understood what the op’s intent is.

He wants live footage. No recording needed.

Op no need for an app. You can’t use it when driving. An outdoor tv mounted internally will show you what’s happening.

A mirror would be easier

True, the live feed wouldn't need to be recorded or "processed", TV would probably work but I can't imagine it would be easy to install a TV on an external boundary wall in Ireland, well, probably easy to install it but it would probably be water damages in a week.

I think a mirror is the winner here

07-12-2020 7:58pm

Clareman wrote: »

You don't have the right to privacy in a public place so there is no need for permission to be granted

There you go, my thoughts exactly.

Absolutely, the Ops intent here is to use technology to make his life easier but the use of this technology (recording of other people, processing of data, use of mobile phone, etc. etc.) opens up a lot of headaches that I don't think anyone knows the solution to, GDPR is still extremely new and there is a need for case law for a lot of it, you don't want to be that test case. Personally, I'd be putting a mirror up

My concerns would be:

1) The time lag between what is actually happening on the road and what is observed on the screen.
2) Observing a screen while driving.

Would your GDPR concerns not extend to the use of video doorbells and dash cams?

Del2005 · 07-12-2020 8:50pm

2011 wrote: »

There you go, my thoughts exactly.

My concerns would be:

1) The time lag between what is actually happening on the road and what is observed on the screen.
2) Observing a screen while driving.

Would your GDPR concerns not extend to the use of video doorbells and dash cams?

Anything that has the possibility to record has GDPR issues

https://www.dataprotection.ie/en/dpc-guidance/blogs/cctv-home

Clareman · 07-12-2020 9:07pm

2011 wrote: »

Would your GDPR concerns not extend to the use of video doorbells and dash cams?

Not my concerns, the Data Protection Commissions concerns

Clareman wrote: »

They mightn't have permissions but they need to adhere to the law, this document makes is very clear what is expected
https://www.dataprotection.ie/sites/default/files/uploads/2019-05/CCTV%20guidance%20data%20controller.pdf

Dash cams are covered here https://www.dataprotection.ie/sites/default/files/uploads/2019-12/Guidance%20for%20Drivers%20on%20the%20use%20of%20Dash%20Cams.pdf

lolliedog · 07-12-2020 10:37pm

Mods can we close this thread, whilst some of the arguments are worth discussing we are digressing from my original post. Thanks to everyone who contributed.

Help needed with Traffic Camera Set up

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