Boards unfettered sexism (See Mod Note in first post)

Caranica · 14-02-2021 2:17pm

eviltwin wrote: »

I don’t feel Boards has any interest in making women feel welcome and I no longer feel it’s confined to certain forums, a post in LL today on the breast reduction thread being confirmation of that.

I agree, I think the word breast in the title attracted a few who have no place in a LL thread about a serious surgery.

I can't say I frequent the male equivalent forum so I don't know why some guys come in here and troll serious threads.

anewme · 14-02-2021 2:23pm

Airyfairy12 wrote: »

I considered leaving a few times too, the comments & threads about women in general often left me feeling hurt, saddened, frustrated and ruined my day after reading them. Whenever I would reply to comments that were overly sexist, I would be shouted down by other members on the thread and called a feminazi, an angry feminist, told to lighten up ect. Id report comments but of course nothing would be done.

If thats how boards want to run this site, making a entire group of people feel unwelcome and undermined by other posters, I dont see any benefit in sticking around.

I also dont post much, but occasionally something is too much to ignore.

I left the site following a shocking thread about the schoolgirls in carlow I think it was where there was a fuss about Male teachers looking at uniforms. Some of the views expressed about teenage girls were not acceptable and very concerning.

I could not give one single iota about these posters in reality. In fact you know right well if you met them in real life they would have the guts of a grape.

However, I have a young niece just about to start college and feel it needs to be actioned for the next generation. A speak up culture needs to be developed on boards. Not just lip service.

I will say there were only a couple of posters pushing back on the fashion thread, but it is very fair to say they held their own.

At one stage I felt I was the only one seeing all the...why do women...why are women....why are fat women? The constant references to tits, ass, camel toes etc is also not adding value. I'm actually glad others feel the same.

There was a thread yesterday on Tommy Tiernan where a lad clearly grieving the loss of his friend was mocked and made little of. And sneered at for his looks.

Very poor from a Community Forum.

eviltwin · 14-02-2021 2:44pm

Caranica wrote: »

I agree, I think the word breast in the title attracted a few who have no place in a LL thread about a serious surgery.

I can't say I frequent the male equivalent forum so I don't know why some guys come in here and troll serious threads.

It’s always been this way unfortunately. I came back specifically to post on that thread because I’m thinking of the same procedure but as usual what could have been a proper discussion about a serious medical procedure became a comment on women’s bodies. I was going to post my question but why would you when certain posters just want to fetishise your body and health. And the comment is still there. Does the Gentleman’s Club or LGBT page have to deal with this ?

Caranica · 14-02-2021 2:52pm

It's very frustrating when posts like that are allowed to remain despite being reported.

Annasopra · 14-02-2021 3:01pm

eviltwin wrote: »

It’s always been this way unfortunately. I came back specifically to post on that thread because I’m thinking of the same procedure but as usual what could have been a proper discussion about a serious medical procedure became a comment on women’s bodies. I was going to post my question but why would you when certain posters just want to fetishise your body and health. And the comment is still there. Does the Gentleman’s Club or LGBT page have to deal with this ?

The LGBT forum does from time to time but its moderated quite strictly. A lot of the really horrible transphobia on the site has driven trans posers away but I get shouted down for saying this.

Airyfairy12 · 14-02-2021 3:03pm

eviltwin wrote: »

It’s always been this way unfortunately. I came back specifically to post on that thread because I’m thinking of the same procedure but as usual what could have been a proper discussion about a serious medical procedure became a comment on women’s bodies. I was going to post my question but why would you when certain posters just want to fetishise your body and health. And the comment is still there. Does the Gentleman’s Club or LGBT page have to deal with this ?

I cant speak on the LGBT page but reading through the gentleman's club, a large number of threads consist of comments about how women are lying, manipulating, gold diggers, sluts or prudes that wont sleep with them and how males are the real victims of sexism and they all agree with each other. All the while any post in any forum were a woman voices her concerns about her personal physical health or life experiences, she's fetishized or shouted down by the male posters and god help her is she calls them out.
Its really ridiculous and speaks volumes.
They cant even speak about issues related to mens rights in their mens rights thread without totally bashing women.
Its evident from reading through threads that they dont have to deal with anything like women posters have been putting up with it.

notsoyoungwan · 14-02-2021 3:07pm

Caranica wrote: »

I agree, I think the word breast in the title attracted a few who have no place in a LL thread about a serious surgery.

I can't say I frequent the male equivalent forum so I don't know why some guys come in here and troll serious threads.

I’ve just read the post in question- the fact that it only received a yellow card is shocking, it really is. It’s also disappointing, and reinforces the ‘why the fcuk would I bother?’ frame of mind that a lot of us have about posting now. That sort of nonsense should be very firmly clamped down on.

anewme · 14-02-2021 3:10pm

Airyfairy12 wrote: »

I cant speak on the LGBT page but reading through the gentleman's club, a large number of threads consist of comments about how women are lying, manipulating, gold diggers, sluts or prudes that wont sleep with them and how males are the real victims of sexism and they all agree with each other. All the while any post in any forum were a woman voices her concerns about her personal physical health or life experiences, she's fetishized or shouted down by the male posters and god help her is she calls them out.
Its really ridiculous and speaks volumes.
They cant even speak about issues related to mens rights in their mens rights thread without totally bashing women.
Its evident from reading through threads that they dont have to deal with anything like women posters have been putting up with it.

In respect of the breast reduction thread, I did notice in Gentleman's forum there is a thread about hair restoration, which thankfully has not attracted the same type of low quality trolling as the breast reduction thread or similar.

The other question is though, you will also come across some very measured and friendly men posters who dont frequent the forums we are referencing. Perhaps they also feel simiar and just dont say as I have seen them called White Knights, etc.

Airyfairy12 · 14-02-2021 3:16pm

anewme wrote: »

In respect of the breast reduction thread, I did notice in Gentleman's forum there is a thread about hair restoration, which thankfully has not attracted the same type of low quality trolling as the breast reduction thread or similar.

The other question is though, you will also come across some very measured and friendly men posters who dont frequent the forums we are referencing. Perhaps they also feel simiar and just dont say as I have seen them called White Knights, etc.

Can you just imagine going onto that thread and giving unsolicited advice to that man on what he should to do with his hair based on what you personally find sexually appealing. So utterly insensitive and mean.

Ive seen plenty of men stand up for women posters and be shouted down for it, it's not surprising that they would stay quiet.

notsoyoungwan · 14-02-2021 3:26pm

There’s a 25 page thread with over 300 posts in TGC called ‘masturbation’. Does anyone think a similar thread here would get to 10 posts without being trolled?

eviltwin · 14-02-2021 3:26pm

anewme wrote: »

In respect of the breast reduction thread, I did notice in Gentleman's forum there is a thread about hair restoration, which thankfully has not attracted the same type of low quality trolling as the breast reduction thread or similar.

The other question is though, you will also come across some very measured and friendly men posters who dont frequent the forums we are referencing. Perhaps they also feel simiar and just dont say as I have seen them called White Knights, etc.

I don’t think it’s even trolling. I think a lot of men genuinely think that a mans opinion on a woman’s body and what she does with it is relevant and should be taken into consideration.

anewme · 14-02-2021 3:28pm

eviltwin wrote: »

I don’t think it’s even trolling. I think a lot of men genuinely think that a mans opinion on a woman’s body and what she does with it is relevant and should be taken into consideration.

Even worse so.

Similar view to the fat woman shoukd cover up so not to offend mens eyes.

Annasopra · 14-02-2021 3:43pm

anewme wrote: »

In respect of the breast reduction thread, I did notice in Gentleman's forum there is a thread about hair restoration, which thankfully has not attracted the same type of low quality trolling as the breast reduction thread or similar.

The other question is though, you will also come across some very measured and friendly men posters who dont frequent the forums we are referencing. Perhaps they also feel simiar and just dont say as I have seen them called White Knights, etc.

Im a man. I often raise issues around lots of hateful rhetoric around racism, homophobia, transphobia and to a lesser extent mysogyny. I often get shouted down by swarms of posters for it.

anewme · 14-02-2021 3:51pm

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

Im a man. I often raise issues around lots of hateful rhetoric around racism, homophobia, transphobia and to a lesser extent mysogyny. I often get shouted down by swarms of posters for it.

Yes I've seen some of your posts and the responses in particular taking on the transphobic posters.

Some really toxic views that should not be tolerated.

eviltwin · 14-02-2021 3:53pm

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

Im a man. I often raise issues around lots of hateful rhetoric around racism, homophobia, transphobia and to a lesser extent mysogyny. I often get shouted down by swarms of posters for it.

I think as a gay man your views aren’t taken as seriously in that forum as those of a straight man.

The Cool · 14-02-2021 7:32pm

Yes! This thread. Actually great to see that others are feeling this way too. I've not been using Boards as much the last few years because I just haven't the patience for the sexism etc any more. After Hours in particular is a cesspit. There was a thread a while back on Louise O Neill and the stuff that was said about her, about women in general, snowflakes, the fact that we're all making up the whole concept of rape culture, that rape culture doesn't exist in Ireland. And yet if you were to sit and cross-check usernames I wonder how many of them also stood by the Ulster rugby lads, our local UFC fighter, etc. AH just leaves me in a rage.
I would think the LL is grand, but then to come on today and read that thread about breast reduction surgery as I'd be interested in it myself, only to see some dude dropping his 2 cents of "oh no don't get rid of the boobs!" Give me STRENGTH.
i agree with anewme - poor form for a community forum. And that "women's fashions" thread...... I'd love to start a thread on AH asking why men wear hoodies when it stops us women from ogling their muscles, and see how long it stays up!!

sullivlo · 14-02-2021 8:08pm

Folks, mea culpa. I did not act strongly enough in the breast reduction thread. I have gone back to the thread and deleted the post.

Sorry if my lack of action caused offence.

fits · 14-02-2021 8:11pm

sullivlo wrote: »

Folks, mea culpa. I did not act strongly enough in the breast reduction thread. I have gone back to the thread and deleted the post.

Sorry if my lack of action caused offence.

Moderating is a fairly thankless task. Definitely goes under my can’t be bothered category alongside going into battle every time I come online.

sullivlo · 14-02-2021 8:19pm

fits wrote: »

Moderating is a fairly thankless task. Definitely goes under my can’t be bothered category alongside going into battle every time I come online.

Yes. It really is.

Caranica · 14-02-2021 8:23pm

sullivlo wrote: »

Folks, mea culpa. I did not act strongly enough in the breast reduction thread. I have gone back to the thread and deleted the post.

Sorry if my lack of action caused offence.

Thanks. I've just reported another post where they quoted the deleted post.

I take my hat off to all mods, I did it for a few years but had to give it up as it was taking up so much of my time.

anewme · 14-02-2021 8:26pm

The Cool wrote: »

Yes! This thread. Actually great to see that others are feeling this way too. I've not been using Boards as much the last few years because I just haven't the patience for the sexism etc any more. After Hours in particular is a cesspit. There was a thread a while back on Louise O Neill and the stuff that was said about her, about women in general, snowflakes, the fact that we're all making up the whole concept of rape culture, that rape culture doesn't exist in Ireland. And yet if you were to sit and cross-check usernames I wonder how many of them also stood by the Ulster rugby lads, our local UFC fighter, etc. AH just leaves me in a rage.
I would think the LL is grand, but then to come on today and read that thread about breast reduction surgery as I'd be interested in it myself, only to see some dude dropping his 2 cents of "oh no don't get rid of the boobs!" Give me STRENGTH.
i agree with anewme - poor form for a community forum. And that "women's fashions" thread...... I'd love to start a thread on AH asking why men wear hoodies when it stops us women from ogling their muscles, and see how long it stays up!!

There are really a lot of women coming forward feeling the same way. Surely this has to be escalated and actioned.

It's fair to say though, that not every man supported the nasty views on the women's fashion thread. There were some men saying wear what you like and stop judging while there were some mean enough comments from women about not wanting to see fat women wearing " see through leggings with their fupa and bits hanging out".

Airyfairy12 · 14-02-2021 8:26pm

The Cool wrote: »

i agree with anewme - poor form for a community forum. And that "women's fashions" thread...... I'd love to start a thread on AH asking why men wear hoodies when it stops us women from ogling their muscles, and see how long it stays up!!

Lol can you imagine?
If we started a thread about mens fashion and left comments that overweight men look like fat pigs that should wear sacks so we dont have to look at them.
Or started a convo about mens bulges in tight jeans and reduced men to body parts and sexual fetishes. Then everytime a man commented with a different opinion or asking to not be spoken about like an object, we'd shout him down, tell him not to be so easily offended and bully him out of the thread.

We would be banned from the forum. Those posters dont get so much as a warning.

Grolschevik · 14-02-2021 9:07pm

New reg, two posts. Banned re-reg, or just embarrassed, or both?

Also. Who's this "we"? You don't speak for me.

Also edit: post I was referring to now gone.

eeeee · 14-02-2021 11:05pm

Have to say this is a major, major issue on boards. I have been on for years and felt increasingly alienated as time goes on. As others say, I stick to safe spaces, but do like the funny pics and vids thread, and the amount of homophobic, transphobic, sexist and racist crap that gets put up there without any hesitation and left up. I report stuff all the time. I know it's easier to mod quieter fora, and I can't imagine what being an AH or CA mod is like, but there are plenty of quieter fora out there with completely unacceptable misogynistic and sexist posting.
I hop on it in the forum I mod, I know it probably pisses some people off, but you have to be the change you want to be, and make spaces as tolerant as possible.

Boards has become increasingly intolerant, and it's not a nice place to be unless you're a ciss, white, middle aged conservative man. There needs to be a broader discussion had above us to decide what direction they want the site to go, because it's withering into an unpleasant place to be for a lot of people.

nightie · 14-02-2021 11:17pm

Must say it is refreshing to read this thread and in particular to get the honest perspectives of the moderators. Friend left last year after raising concerns about horrendous posts. Such posts were explained on the basis that After Hours is a place where one can often find “dark humour”.

Ectoplasm · 14-02-2021 11:45pm

I'm going to break my self-imposed rule and talk about sexism on Boards.

I've been a member for years and Boards has always had a sexism problem. Part of it was down to sheer numbers; when I first started using Boards, men dramatically outnumbered women in terms of regular posters.

Then more women joined and there was a push back against it and The Ladies Lounge was created as a place for women to talk...and instantly became magnet for the worst kinds of misogynistic posters. The mods did Trojan work on that front and for a while TLL was brilliant...it was super active and had really interesting threads on feminism and just being a woman...but it continued to draw the trolls and eventually a lot of active posters stopped posting.

For me, it wasn't any one post or any one terrible instance of sexist BS that made me step away from TLL and posting more generally about issues relating to sexism and/or feminism it was just the sheer habitual grind of every thread discussing women's experiences being derailed by #notallmen or #mensuffertoo. It just got boring and futile. Nuance is overlooked in favour of "winning" and that's just not a discussion.

It is absolutely NOT all men who post on Boards, nor is it most, but it is enough of a voluble minority to make it feel demoralising and pointless.
I know for a fact that there are men who avoid certain forums for precisely the same reasons I avoid them.
I would also be very wary about blaming the mods. I have seen mod actions on sexism get overturned often enough that the message is clear...sexism really isn't an issue to be taken seriously.

Sorry for the wall of text...back to playing games on t'interwebs for me.

Grolschevik · 15-02-2021 12:31am

There seems to be an often-overlapping, vocal and active cohort with interrelated views on women, misogyny, class, race, gender, anti-intellectualism, property ownership, etc. I assume most of them to be men.

I've noticed stuff that people wouldn't necessarily get away with forums like politics or legal getting posted in, say, radio or accommodation, almost as a way to circumvent more robust challenge or moderation.

I only ever followed a few forums on Boards. I've always actively avoided the ones I knew would annoy me, but even in the ones I follow I check in less and less.

There's a cluster of related and, to me, deeply unpleasant ideologies that have grown on this site, just as they have in the comments sections on social media.

Grolschevik · 15-02-2021 12:45am

Jaysus, who said those phone app permission settings weren't scary!

Just "suggested for me" on Facebook:

https://www.splcenter.org/news/2021/02/01/patriarchal-violence-misogyny-far-right-mainstream

In both the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) and the field of extremism research as a whole, analyses of the far right have often neglected to fully account for the innumerable ways gender, misogyny and gender-based violence manifest within and operate alongside other forms of racially and religiously motivated hate.

Muahahaha · 15-02-2021 1:10am

cee_jay wrote: »

I understand mods can't action each and every reported post, or even see those posts that don't get reported.
However, there is a lot of low level trolling going on across the site, and it can often take a number of posts along the same vein before a poster is warned by a mod. It even happened on this thread (not saying the mods were incorrect btw). This type of posting often means individual posts can in themselves be just on the right side of not being actioned, but take all the posts together, a completely different picture can appear. And this is not just for sexist posts - it is quite evident in racist posts, transphobic posts, etc.

You've hit the proverbial nail on the head there. Low level trolling is a problem on this site and you can be one around here and literally get away with it for years. They pick up the odd yellow and threadban here and there but they're still free to come back for endless more bites of the cherry. The sanctions handed out are nothing really when you consider their entire body of work as a whole but because its kept low level a combination of people not reporting and then mods seeing it as just short of actionable means they're free to carry on regardless. Every now and again the mask will slip and they'll post what they really think (such as that post advocating for the drowning of migrants in the English Channel) and the post will be deleted and a yellow handed out. So things like racism are allowed to continue unchecked.

I think there has to come a point where Boards needs to ask itself is it really good for the community overall that this type of low level trolling is entertained for months and even years without any proper sanctions and by that I mean sitebans. Does Boards really want to become a safe space for racists, misogynists and homophobes? Some wold argue it already is to some extent. I wouldnt mind but it is mainly a handful of recurring posters so it shouldnt be all that difficult to deal with. But because it isnt a small minority really do a superb job of bringing this place down into the gutter on multiple occasions.

Grolschevik · 15-02-2021 4:14am

Jaysus. Must Try Harder.

Boards unfettered sexism (See Mod Note in first post)

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