Problem viewing Glasnevin records

Mick Tator · 09-02-2021 12:13am

pinkypinky wrote: »

I would send Lyn a copy of this thread! I only talked to her once by email about this and she did sound frustrated then.

What about a letter in the Irish Times?

IT is not a topic for the Irish Times at the moment, they generally will publish only as a result of their own articles. That might happen soon, as today's news has Revenue apologising for a breakdown in their IT systems , unable to cope with Brexit documentation. And we know how long Revenue had to prepare for that!

tabbey · 09-02-2021 1:35am

I fail to see why you blame the office of public works and Patrick O'Donovan. Glasnevin received the money during the boom, for the purpose of gravestone restoration. The fact that the cemetery is situated in the constituency of the then taoiseach was a factor.
Since the bubble burst, glasnevin has received very little state funding.
Glasnevin always seemed a happy and helpful place when George was the boss there. That seems to be changing and covid is not helping. I feel great sympathy for Lynn as she has always been helpful and it is not her fault that there is a computer fault.

Mick Tator · 09-02-2021 3:13pm

tabbey wrote: »

I fail to see why you blame the office of public works and Patrick O'Donovan. Glasnevin received the money during the boom, for the purpose of gravestone restoration. The fact that the cemetery is situated in the constituency of the then taoiseach was a factor.
Since the bubble burst, glasnevin has received very little state funding.
Glasnevin always seemed a happy and helpful place when George was the boss there. That seems to be changing and covid is not helping. I feel great sympathy for Lynn as she has always been helpful and it is not her fault that there is a computer fault.

Hi Tabby,
I’m not blaming Lynn. You are missing the point.

A business is governed by a hierarchy - frontline staff, management, directors. It is the role of the directors (taking into account the wishes of and promises to the shareholders) to set the rules of operation in play, execute them and ensure all works. The buck stops at the top.
The Board, reporting to the Minister in charge (OPW) also represents the interests of the shareholders, i.e. us, the taxpayer. All fail when the business does not meet its objectives.

The IT system at Glasnevin Trust (GT), is broken and has been allowed to remain in that state for nearly five months. The executive management has failed to ensure it has been fixed and the board and minister apparently have taken a back seat. Furthermore, GT is overdue in publishing its accounts/annual report, as the last available is from 2018. That contains considerable business jargon (waffle) and aspirations. For example, on page 18 it states:
<<Key priorities have been identified for the period to 2023 summarised as follows:
1 Development of the Core Business
2 Build on the Cultural, Heritage, Education and Tourism components of Glasnevin Trust
3 Consolidate upon existing partnerships and build new stakeholder relationships
4 Review our internal governance and organisational structure to ensure the most effective operation of the Trust’s activities and facilitate robust and quality governance and leadership
5 Increase our public profile via Marketing and public relations activities>>

It is unclear how much money is brought in from the online business (probably very small), but a broken IT system conflicts with GT’s achievement of the majority of those objectives particularly in an era of Covid. It also has a major impact on image and as a result, GT is suffering reputational damage.

Cash/funds is not an issue for GT – in 2018 it had revenue of €9,902,92, expenditure of €9,614,397, so a profit of about €300k. It also has reserves of €19,632,903 (yes, about €20 million).

Whether or not Glasnevin is a happy place or has nice staff is immaterial. We are discussing an online presence, a key element of any modern business, one, if broken in a private business, would have been fixed in hours or at maximum a couple of days, or heads would roll. Instead, we are looking at broken functionality for nearly five months. From a management or corporate governance perspective it is a major ‘fail’ and simply is not good enough from a business in receipt of public funding.

BowWow · 09-02-2021 4:54pm

We're going way off topic here, but I've always thought that the Glasnevin Trust was a private, not for profit, company/charity. I fail to see how it reports to the Minister in Charge of the OPW?
They certainly got Public funds (once off?) coming up to 2016 and spent it well on new footpaths and grave restorations - doubt they are in receipt of regular public funding.
It's a well run business, in normal times operating a major tourist attraction in addition to their regular business of burials and cremations.

In the current issue, the failure of part of the website, I've contacted them and can sense the staff frustration. I understand that it was a major issue and not solvable quickly as initially hoped. They have helped me with queries without looking for payment.
I, for one, look forward to the return of the enhanced facility.

pinkypinky · 09-02-2021 5:13pm

Glasnevin Trust is a registered charity and states they are a not for profit organisation their website.

They have an IT manager according to their organisation flow chat in the 2018 annual report. That person is who should do the explaining. However, I suspect they're not obliged to tell people what's been going wrong.

Mick Tator is right that a private company would have had this fixed a lot sooner. I'm quite sure they've lost out on lots of revenue. Certainly, in my work, there's been several times since September that I had to tell a client I couldn't get a grave record for them in Glasnevin.

Mick Tator · 10-02-2021 12:30am

BowWow wrote: »

We're going way off topic here, but I've always thought that the Glasnevin Trust was a private, not for profit, company/charity. I fail to see how it reports to the Minister in Charge of the OPW?
They certainly got Public funds (once off?) coming up to 2016 and spent it well on new footpaths and grave restorations - doubt they are in receipt of regular public funding.
It's a well run business, in normal times operating a major tourist attraction in addition to their regular business of burials and cremations.

In the current issue, the failure of part of the website, I've contacted them and can sense the staff frustration. I understand that it was a major issue and not solvable quickly as initially hoped. They have helped me with queries without looking for payment.
I, for one, look forward to the return of the enhanced facility.

All from their (out of date) annual report:-
Glasnevin Trust is the registered business name and operating name of The Dublin Cemeteries Committee (DCC) a body corporate established under The Dublin Cemeteries Committee Act 1970
The Dublin Cemeteries Committee is a registered charity
.………the Trust invested massively in the visitor centre and undertook a huge renovation programme with the help of the Government through the OPW.
……….We continued, in association with the Office of Public Works, the Glasnevin Cemetery Restoration project. We were allocated €25 million under a 10 year programme as part of the National Development Plan in 2006. On this project to date we have spent and received funding back through OPW of €12.5m with €250,000 in 2018. The project has been extended into 2019 and we are grateful for the continued support of the OPW.
The principal funding sources are:
•Income from burials, grave sales and cremations
•Income from tours of Glasnevin Cemetery
•Merchandise income•Support from Monument Works and Florists trading
•Statutory funding through OPW and Department of Culture, Heritage and the Gaeltacht
•Fundraising is a very small element of our funding but we hope to grow this in the future
(My emphasis in the above)

Just because DCC is a charity does not absolve it from respecting commercial reality, effective corporate governance and providing an efficient service to stakeholders. No doubt all are nice people (and the directors do the gig gratis) but that is not the point. All organisations that receive State funding should be fit for purpose.

mindhorn · 13-03-2021 10:52am

Five weeks since they updated the message on their website and nearly six months since Hermy started this thread. Curious as to what the ongoing issue actually is.

BowWow · 18-03-2021 1:20am

The Glasnevin site was down all Patrick's day - hopefully an indication that they are fixing/updating it?

Garlinge · 18-03-2021 1:28pm

Oh dear! I have a lot of records that I paid for but did not take copy of as the site kept them.

Mick Tator · 18-03-2021 3:21pm

As promised I have sent a strongly-worded letter to Minister O'Donovan.

Hermy · 18-03-2021 4:58pm

Good man Mick - fair play!

pinkypinky · 18-03-2021 6:20pm

Well done!
Looking forward to hearing what civil servant response you get

tenterfields · 19-03-2021 10:17pm

Well, the website has been updated and it looks as if the genealogy search facility is operating again at long last. However, when I logged in there was no account history. The results of the many searches I have made and paid for have apparently been wiped. I have contacted Glasnevin to inquire. Anybody else have any information?

pinkypinky · 19-03-2021 11:01pm

Yep. Spoke to Lynn today. It will be finished next week. We'll get an email to do a password reset and our previously purchased stuff should be there.

Hermy · 19-03-2021 11:08pm

Great stuff folks - thanks for the update.

Mick Tator · 19-03-2021 11:17pm

pinkypinky wrote: »

Well done!
Looking forward to hearing what civil servant response you get

Had a personalised acknowledgement today from the Minister's Priv.Sec., said a detailed response will issue later. That's decent, but the site isn't working for me (on Firefox) as of now.

BowWow · 20-03-2021 10:35am

Mick Tator wrote: »

Had a personalised acknowledgement today from the Minister's Priv.Sec., said a detailed response will issue later. That's decent, but the site isn't working for me (on Firefox) as of now.

Try this in your browser bar -

https://www.dctrust.ie/genealogy/home.html

Mollymoo19 · 20-03-2021 2:05pm

Woo-hoo!

though previous records purchased from the old site are not showing. I could not place a new order either,

(sorry, hadn't see the updates from yesterday, when I responded)

pinkypinky · 20-03-2021 3:01pm

I was talking to Lynn and she advised that next week everyone will get a reset password link and once you do that, it will import all previous purchases.

BowWow · 20-03-2021 3:17pm

Just searched for, found and purchased a single record, all worked ok.

Mick Tator · 21-03-2021 12:30am

BowWow wrote: »

Try this in your browser bar -

https://www.dctrust.ie/genealogy/home.html

That's worked. Thank you.

BowWow · 21-03-2021 10:46am

Mick Tator wrote: »

That's worked. Thank you.

No problem.

Seems they rebranded Glasnevin Cemetery Trust as Dublin Cemetery Trust.

From web page -

"Glasnevin Trust has officially rebranded as Dublin Cemeteries Trust.
Our new name and brand identity is the result of a signiﬁcant branding exercise, undergone to improve our customer service and build better working relationships – creating stronger unity across our Funeral Services and our Heritage & Education Services."

Garlinge · 21-03-2021 3:44pm

I was unable to login using old details and the email is one I not longer use (exist?). I have written to them to see if they can help.

pinkypinky · 22-03-2021 12:50pm

https://www.irishgenealogynews.com/2021/03/glasnevin-burials-database-is-up-and.html

We get a nice mention

Hermy · 09-04-2021 10:51am

pinkypinky wrote: »

I was talking to Lynn and she advised that next week everyone will get a reset password link and once you do that, it will import all previous purchases.

Has anyone received the Reset Password link yet or been able to access their order history?

BowWow · 09-04-2021 11:39am

Hermy wrote: »

Has anyone received the Reset Password link yet or been able to access their order history?

I enter the site using my old password and have full access to all my previous records.

pinkypinky · 09-04-2021 12:42pm

I can see a couple of records, but have now discovered, after contacting the always helpful Lynn, that if you changed email, it only imported records purchased under the most recent address.

Hermy · 09-04-2021 1:42pm

Well that's a load of horse manure!

pinkypinky · 09-04-2021 2:05pm

She's actually sent me an excel spreadsheet of what was purchased under my previous email (practically everything). When I have time, I'll go through and make sure I have everything that is my own family (which I expect I will).

Hermy · 09-04-2021 3:33pm

To be honest I'm most annoyed at myself for not properly cataloguing my records from Glasnevin, something I just kept putting off.

Problem viewing Glasnevin records

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