2019 Shanghai Masters, 9th-15th September - Eurosport

Frank O. Pinion · 15-09-2019 10:08am

Murphy won the first 3 frames, Ronnie won the next 4, first session ended 5-5. Close match.

Joe_ Public · 15-09-2019 10:10am

Only started watching from 3-0 but have to say O'Sullivan got to be the happier with 5-5 at the interval. Murphy should have been 4-0 and opponent in all sorts of bother, instead got to fancy O'Sullivan from here, but then again, you never know!

zuutroy · 15-09-2019 10:30am

Yea but O'Sullivan lost 2 frames from 50+ ahead towards the end so not sure he'll be that happy.

Joe_ Public · 15-09-2019 10:38am

Swings and roundabouts i suppose. Was a decent clearance by Murphy to go 5-4 up that time, these things happen in a match. Dont think it will bother O'Sullivan all that much. Just hoping it stays neck and neck to the finish now!

Inviere · 15-09-2019 11:37am

Does anyone else get the feeling watching O'Sullivan that he's just not a titan of the game anymore? He's obviously still a top class player, but the days of him displaying jaw dropping skills and properly intimidating opponents just seem to be behind him now. His consistency, while always a question mark for me, just seems not there anymore...he's a strong player, capable of nicking/stealing frames from behind, capable of big breaks etc...but he just doesn't seem superhuman anymore, like he used to. Granted he's 40 odd I suppose really...

Joe_ Public · 15-09-2019 12:12pm

Would agree to an extent, though not by means all. He's still no.2 in the world, won 5 out of 10 events entered last year, beaten in finals in two others, so he remains by any standard a "titan" of the game imo. Think he still does intimidate players, Wilson the other day for one, just not at the crucible where everyone knows he's beatable nowadays because the grind is a little beyond him these times. But i'd definitely agree that he's not the player he was 10, 15 or 20 years ago and nor should be be. There are purple patches of genius every now and again, and he does tend to check out mentally a little less these days, but the standard he was producing when playing the likes of hendry, higgins and williams at their peak will never be repeated i dont think, unless trump takes it up another level. Bit of an indictment of todays generation of players that he's still that far ahead of them imho.

Slippin Jimmy · 15-09-2019 12:28pm

Looking at him over the last few matches he really has just been nicking frames of his opponent. Before, once he got a decent break off shot he would wrap up the frame.

He still plays at an amazing pace. Much better than anyone else in the game. As you said, he is in the 40 category now. There are not many players in that category that are anywhere near O'Sullivans standard.

Inviere · 15-09-2019 12:35pm

Joe_ Public wrote: »

but the standard he was producing when playing the likes of hendry, higgins and williams at their peak will never be repeated i dont think, unless trump takes it up another level.

I think in pure potting ability, Trump has taken that crown. Trump has his own flaws, but man that lad pots balls in ways I've never seen in 30 years of watching Snooker.

zuutroy · 15-09-2019 12:46pm

As well as winning 5 of 10 last year he has 135 centuries the last two years, his 2 highest tallies ever, despite not playing many events. A bit rusty this week in his first tournament in 5 months and that match against Cahill was an aberration. I think news of his demise is a bit premature yet.

Slippin Jimmy · 15-09-2019 12:52pm

He certainly has the potential to continue as he is for many a years to come.

zuutroy · 15-09-2019 1:04pm

That counter clearance was a beauty.

The Nal · 15-09-2019 1:04pm

Overall Ronnie has played some of the best snooker he's ever played in the last 2 or 3 years.

Inviere · 15-09-2019 1:07pm

zuutroy wrote: »

I think news of his demise is a bit premature yet.

Who said that? I'm saying that he's not the seemingly unbeatable superpower he once was. He's still playing at a high standard, more impressive considering his age...but he'd have turned the screw on opponents a lot harder a few years back than he seems to today.

zuutroy · 15-09-2019 1:16pm

I'd say that's only true of this week tbh. Everyone except Allen, Robertson, and Trump tend to crumble against him still.

Inviere · 15-09-2019 1:33pm

zuutroy wrote: »

I'd say that's only true of this week tbh. Everyone except Allen, Robertson, and Trump tend to crumble against him still.

He's still playing at an incredibly high level, I just think his best days are behind him. He's there for the taking more often than ever these days, and if people don't seize those chances, that's their own deficiency, it's not because Ronnie is unbeatable. Trump absolutely pummeled him, twice, last season. He is still tactically brilliant, great 'snooker brain' as they say, but when was the last time he could be called 'sensational' on the table? It used to be pretty regularly, sure he still had off days like everyone, but I get the sense he's a bit 'weaker' these days.

Joe_ Public · 15-09-2019 1:36pm

Nobody saying anything about demise. Or that he isn't still playing some great snooker on a reasonably regular basis. Its just my opinion, but any judgement of his standard has to be set against the easier playing conditions and more generous pockets he is playing with now. Even Ronnie himself has argued that (most recently during the Masters this year). The standard of snooker players, not just o'sullivan, were producing from late 90s to early noughties was best i've personally witnessed. Others are free to differ, of course.

zuutroy · 15-09-2019 1:41pm

Yea maybe demise was the wrong choice of words! I think the addition of a bit of mental resolve and him 'beating himself' not happening as often makes him overall a better player now than in his more flamboyant days. I do find it very hard to be objective though as I'm a total fanboy.

Joe_ Public · 15-09-2019 1:50pm

Nothing wrong with being a fanboy imo, i've loved watching him play as much as anybody over the years and game would be a lot poorer for his absence. That much for sure. I'm a little underwhelmed by all this century scoring as a measure for greatness to be honest, because i've absolutely no doubt the game has been altered to make it easier to rack them up. But thats by the by. Other thing i'd say about ronnie is, on the one hand he is clearly mentally stronger in many ways and thats a credit to work done with Steve Peters. But on the other, he hasnt gone beyond the world quarters in five years (i think) which is pretty poor for his standards and i have to count that against him.

Joe_ Public · 15-09-2019 1:50pm

Big chance for Murphy here.

zuutroy · 15-09-2019 1:57pm

Yea he seems to wilt at Sheffield and almost accept that that will be the case these days.

Joe_ Public · 15-09-2019 2:08pm

Think he's just accepted its not going to happen at sheffield anymore and he can concentrate on being a beast rest of season, loves those bo7s, just get in and out quick as he can. If he needed just 1 to equal hendrys record, i think he might go all out for that, but fact it's two just maybe feels a mountain too high to climb.

Murphy off the boil this frame, a gift for o'sullivan.

Slippin Jimmy · 15-09-2019 2:22pm

It's all up to Murphy now!

Joe_ Public · 15-09-2019 2:52pm

Murph making this interesting to be fair to him. Decider would be nice.

Frank O. Pinion · 16-09-2019 9:43am

Great win by Ronnie. He seems to love this event (probably due to very good Shanghai sponsors), and really wants to win it, to start his season. When was the last time someone won the same major event three years in a row? Impressive stuff.

On Ronnie's form and any decline, it seems the past few seasons when Ronnie wins an event, or multiple events like last season, he's perfect, "as good as ever". But, the moment he has a bad performance or loses in the early rounds (like he tends to do at the Crucible recently), he's "not the same anymore", "not intimidating anymore", etc. I've always loved watching Ronnie play, great performances, bad performances, to...bizarre performances. I'll also be fascinated to watch any downfall of his career, quick or slow, and when that does happen, how quickly (or not) he decides to give it all up.

I really don't think he'll stick around in bad form, looking for an "Invitational Tour Card" in his late 50s, like the current Seniors champ.

zuutroy · 16-09-2019 10:53am

Yea his recent results are
-lost final to Trump in NI
-won the UK
-lost final to Trump in the Masters
-lost early to Fu
-won the Players Champ
-won the tour Champ
-that mess of a match in Sheffield
-won in Shanghai

Would be tough to find as good a run as that in his history I'd have thought.

The Nal · 16-09-2019 11:04am

15 finals and 11 wins in 2 years. Playing part time.

Joe_ Public · 16-09-2019 4:55pm

zuutroy wrote: »

Yea his recent results are
-lost final to Trump in NI
-won the UK
-lost final to Trump in the Masters
-lost early to Fu
-won the Players Champ
-won the tour Champ
-that mess of a match in Sheffield
-won in Shanghai

Would be tough to find as good a run as that in his history I'd have thought.

I'd say you'd just have to check back on Hendry. Maybe the season he won 9 titles, including 5 out of the 8 ranking tournaments (four in a row) in 1990/91 in which, perhaps remarkably, he "only" got to the world qf. You could probably look at Davis too, there was one season around early 80s when he reached 8 finals and won them all. But we're talking indisputably about the 3 greatest players of all time, remarkable careers all three of them.

2019 Shanghai Masters, 9th-15th September - Eurosport

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