"Supermoon" Alert - happens this Saturday

the_syco · 02-05-2012 4:16pm #1

Skywatchers take note: The biggest full moon of the year is due to arrive this weekend.

The moon will officially become full Saturday (May 5) at 11:35 p.m. EDT. And because this month's full moon coincides with the moon's perigee — its closest approach to Earth — it will also be the year's biggest.

Read more @ http://www.space.com/15474-supermoon-full-moon-2012.html

I assume 23:35 EDT is 03:35 GMT but I don't know if we would see it would be the same time here, or would we?

Calibos · 02-05-2012 4:50pm

16% brighter wont be noticable. 3% bigger wont be noticable. Suprised at Space.Com hype tbh. I know lets hype it even more with telephoto lens shots of the moon that would look exactly the same if taken at Apogee. Lets tell people to look at the moon when its close to the horizon to invoke the big moon illusion......that works exactly the same even if the moon is at Apogee.

Don't get too excited OP. You likely wont notice any difference at all.

jfSDAS · 02-05-2012 4:58pm

hi!

Cheers for that link.

I have more information in the sky notes for May 2012 in another thread I posted to the forum.

It's a moonrise that will catch the attention because of the effect of the Moon Illusion (see Wikipedia for a long explanation) added to this being the closest Full Moon of 2012.

That said, it's "only" about 120km closer than December's Full Moon but the closest until 2014.

In short, it's not an exceptionally special astronomical event like a total solar eclipse but people will notice the Moon loom large as it rises if they have a clear eastern horizon.

The time given is astronomically the instant of Full Moon but the Moon will be seen when rising on the evening of May 5th (and the night after ... and the night after ...)

It actually looked pretty impressive too when rising the night of Full Moon last month -- I was at Dunsink Observatory and caught it on camera coming up over the dome of the South Telescope (named for Sir James South, not the compass direction!)

June's Full Moon will also look big rising too as it is just a month after this near one.

atb,

john

coylemj · 02-05-2012 5:34pm

Calibos wrote: »

16% brighter wont be noticable. 3% bigger wont be noticable. Suprised at Space.Com hype tbh. I know lets hype it even more with telephoto lens shots of the moon that would look exactly the same if taken at Apogee. Lets tell people to look at the moon when its close to the horizon to invoke the big moon illusion......that works exactly the same even if the moon is at Apogee.

You likely wont notice any difference at all.

So stay in and watch the X-Factor instead! The 3% refers to the variation across multiple perigees, not to the difference in size between the Moon at apogee and perigee.

According to this website John (jfSDAS) linked to in his skynotes for May post..

http://www.perseus.gr/Astro-Lunar-Scenes-Apo-Perigee.htm

the variation amounts to a 15% difference in apparent diameter when comparing a Full Moon at perigee to one at apogee.

The amount of sunlight being reflected from the Moon will be the same but it will appear brighter because it is closer based on the square of the distance rule i.e. the brightness varies in proportion to the inverse of the square of the distance so using the distances on that website, I calculate the brightness would be 30% greater when the Moon is 356,790 kms distant vs. at 406,357 kms.

Calibos · 02-05-2012 8:43pm

So being aware that some astronomical events can be overhyped makes me a mindless x-factor fan?? Charming!! :rolleyes:

Look, this isn't a case of someone that got burned with a 60mm Tasco ebay scope and thinks its all underwhelming as a result or some eejit coming in to tell the geeks that they are always getting excited over nothing and boring astronomy stuff. I have a 16 inch Dob for crying out loud. I've 5000 euros worth of eyepieces. I love astronomy (though real life has prevented me getting out much in the last 3 years for one reason or another)

I'm just saying that somethings get over hyped in the Media. I expect it from the general media but not from an actual astronomy website.

I am not saying all publicised astronomical events are overhyped but this one certainly is IMHO

slade_x · 03-05-2012 1:46am

Calibos wrote: »

I'm just saying that somethings get over hyped in the Media. I expect it from the general media but not from an actual astronomy website.

I am not saying all publicised astronomical events are overhyped but this one certainly is IMHO

A respected Astronomy website that also uses a term not accepted by the scientific community. The term supermoon belongs to an astrologer not astronomers

The event is known as a syzygy perigee

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syzygy_(astronomy)

It does promote the practice of observing the sky so maybe all these sites that "hype" the event may encourage someone who wouldnt otherwise be interested or who doesnt bother observing the sky to just stop and tilt their head upwards. And who knows maybe they just might find something else that grabs their attention and gets them curious. although however unlikely

For anyone interested in the actual apparent difference between a moon at apogee and perigee the below link contains one

http://www.moonconnection.com/apogee_perigee.phtml

Apogee and perigee refer to the distance from the Earth to the moon. Apogee is the furthest point from the earth. Perigee is the closest point to the earth and it is in this stage that the moon appears larger. Looking at the moon in the sky without anything to compare it to, you wouldn't notice any size difference. But the difference in size can in fact be quite significant.
If you were to photograph a full moon at apogee and perigee (using the same lens), here's how the two sizes would compare:

Astronomers have formulas for computing the exact distance at any point in time, but the average distance from Earth is 237,700 miles (382,500 km)........................ Please follow link for the rest of the information provided at the source

Alas, unless you have a photographic memory or photograph with which to make comparison no one will notice the difference, hence why it isnt a big deal in the general publics eye and goes relatively unnoticed

Also the formulas mentioned in the above link are what enables the below website:

http://www.fourmilab.ch/earthview/pacalc.html

And from that list under perigee:

May 6 3:34 356953 km

Thats Sunday @ 3.34am when the moon will be 356,953 km /(221,800 miles) from our planet according to the formula

And finally if you are really interested:

http://www.fourmilab.ch/earthview/moon_ap_per.html

Calibos · 03-05-2012 2:58am

The problem with overhyping an event though I find is that you attract viewers this time, lots end up disappointed and the result is a boy who cried wolf effect and they don't look up for the more visually interesting future events and possibly tell others not to bother. (The irony is not wasted on me

)

I myself find it interesting and will be out with my 80mm Stellarvue F80 Finderscope mounted on my s/h Nexstar mount. It will be interesting to see how much more the Moon fills my 100º AFOV of my 3.7mm Ethos at 80x odd in the Stellarvue.

If the linked article or the OP is aimed at us amatuers than no harm no foul so to speak but its certainly not something I will be making much of an effort to inform the public about and I don't think I'll be setting up the scope outside on the footpath for some outreach like I have the last few 1st quarter moons. I'd get 100 times more wows showing them craters at first quarter closer to apogee then showing a more featureless full moon near perigee no matter how much bigger or brighter it looks.

Tenger · 04-05-2012 9:49pm

Calibos wrote: »

.......I myself find it interesting and will be out with my 80mm Stellarvue F80 Finderscope mounted on my s/h Nexstar mount. It will be interesting to see how much more the Moon fills my 100º AFOV of my 3.7mm Ethos at 80x odd in the Stellarvue........

I have no idea what that actually means but I assume you have a big one?

I do agree that the 1/2 or 1/4 Moon shows better definition, more dramatic for the average punter on the street.

GaryIrv93 · 04-05-2012 10:34pm

Heard earlier on the radio that there's going to be a so called ''super moon'' from tomorrow to Monday. Hopefully the weather will be clear on Saturday since they say the view of it will be most spectacular, however it should last until monday although I'm not sure how long exactly. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supermoon

Feel free to post some photo's of it here if you manage to get a good look at it!

Calibos · 04-05-2012 11:19pm

Tenger wrote: »

I have no idea what that actually means but I assume you have a big one?

I do agree that the 1/2 or 1/4 Moon shows better definition, more dramatic for the average punter on the street.

I've a Big One (Oo'er Missus!) but its not the one mentioned in the quoted text. Thats actually the Finderscope for the Big One. I bought an old second hand Goto mount for 30 quid from a fellow observer so that I could use the Finderscope as a little telescope in its own right when I don't want to lug out the Big One or the Big one is not suitable/needed.

Heres the Big One.

scrubber72 · 05-05-2012 8:14am

Calibos wrote: »

I've a Big One (Oo'er Missus!) but its not the one mentioned in the quoted text. Thats actually the Finderscope for the Big One. I bought an old second hand Goto mount for 30 quid from a fellow observer so that I could use the Finderscope as a little telescope in its own right when I don't want to lug out the Big One or the Big one is not suitable/needed.

Heres the Big One.

:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

zenno · 05-05-2012 8:45am

WOW, That is something else. Impressive scope. :eek:

Calibos · 05-05-2012 7:32pm

Back on Topic. This is what another Big X-Factor Fan

had to say on the subject

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/05/02/the-supermoon-stuff-again/

CO19 · 05-05-2012 10:11pm

How come the moon is rising a lot more to the south and lower down than it normally does throughout the rest of the year ?

Mr X15 · 05-05-2012 11:46pm

Was anyone able to get a good view, the cloud cover spoiled it for me

hellboy99 · 06-05-2012 4:35am

Mr X15 wrote: »

Was anyone able to get a good view, the cloud cover spoiled it for me

It was very misty and cloudy where I was, this is the best I got after some tweaking in photoshop

zenno · 06-05-2012 4:40am

I'm down in a valley and it's too low to get a video capture. Though I seen it much bigger a few years back. I might jump onto the roof and see can I record it. :eek: Too late it's way low down.

Cú Giobach · 06-05-2012 10:34am

CO19 wrote: »

How come the moon is rising a lot more to the south and lower down than it normally does throughout the rest of the year ?

Because it orbits roughly along the plane of the ecliptic and not around the equator, so where it rises and sets depends on 1. The time of year and 2. The phase.
For example a midwinter full moon rises in the NE and travels high in the sky setting in the NW, while a midwinter new moon rises in the SE and travels low setting in the SW.
On the other hand a midsummer full moon rises in the SE travels low and sets in the SW and a midsummer new moon rises in the NE goes high and sets in the NW.
The intervening phases are all moving between these extremes.

CO19 · 06-05-2012 11:14am

Cú Giobach wrote: »

Because it orbits roughly along the plane of the ecliptic and not around the equator, so where it rises and sets depends on 1. The time of year and 2. The phase.
For example a midwinter full moon rises in the NE and travels high in the sky setting in the NW, while a midwinter new moon rises in the SE and travels low setting in the SW.
On the other hand a midsummer full moon rises in the SE travels low and sets in the SW and a midsummer new moon rises in the NE goes high and sets in the NW.
The intervening phases are all moving between these extremes.

Would its postition i.e high or low be down to the Earth tilting towrds the Sun coming into Summer ?

Cú Giobach · 06-05-2012 11:40am

CO19 wrote: »

Would its postition i.e high or low be down to the Earth tilting towrds the Sun coming into Summer ?

It's all to do with the tilt yea.
Since at new moon the moon is on the same side of the Earth as the Sun and in summer the Earth is tilted in that direction the new moon travels high (same as the Sun) but at full moon it's on the other side, so it travels low, the situation is then reversed in the winter.

You can see this easiest with the full Moon, it does the opposite to the Sun by rising more northerly and travelling high in winter and rising southerly and travelling low in Summer.
On a cold dark mid-winter night I often look at the full Moon high in the night sky and think that in 6 months the Sun will be just there nicely warming the island.:D

Kersh · 06-05-2012 2:38pm

It did look nice rising though. A little cloud covering it but the family thought it looked good. I wouldnt drag a scope out for them because. . .
....they left me standing out in the garden on my own last week because it was too cold

belacqua_ · 06-05-2012 6:57pm

It was pretty misty as the moon was rising last night so didn't get a great view of it, the weather is much better this evening and looks like it should be quite clear--would it be worth getting my gear set up to take some photographs tonight, or will the effect of the super moon have waned?

rccaulfield · 06-05-2012 9:21pm

I saw no difference from Dublin, bit misty but looked the same size by the naked eye tbh!

How Soon Is Now · 07-05-2012 1:17am

Living over in Lanzarote at the moment headed out for a walk about half nine or so earlyer on.

Was walking down by the beach when i spot this really bright orange half circle which looked like it was sitting on top of the ocean.

At first i figured must of been lights on a boat or passing ship but looked so weird.

Of course i had totally forgot there was any kind of super moon coming up so i had no idea of any of this :pac:

Started to see the half circle slowly move up higher and higher in the sky moving over the sea until you could clearly see it was the moon.

I had never seen it so close and bright looked amazing and because of the weather here it was perfect orange and clear in the sky the whole time it moved up .

Tried to take few pics with me phone but was way to dark at that stage.

Me girlfriend took pic on her camara but it looks way to far away from the camaras view.

Came online there awhile ago and people where saying on facebook after i mentioned what i had seen that ya its the super moon lol.

Really glad we happened to of headed out at such a perfect time now

cocoshovel · 09-05-2012 1:26am

Was awake at 4am and decided to get some fresh air so I leaned out my window and noticed beginning to set in the west at about 30ish degrees I guess. Looked fantastic, and quite larger than usual indeed. Or at least I thought so. Was casting a lovely long shadow on all the tree's and high objects around my house, crystal clear sky.

"Supermoon" Alert - happens this Saturday

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