Snowflake teachers poisoning our children's minds

marieholmfan · 11-12-2019 1:53pm

joeguevara wrote: »

What is the 5th Green Field? According to the song, the 4th Green Field is Ulster. Is the 5th Rockall?

Uladh and the 4th is Meath -- Not sure it maps that well because there would have been no Munster or Connaught and arguably a province of Breffni (partly occupied by the Sasanach to this day).

joeguevara · 11-12-2019 2:02pm

marieholmfan wrote: »

Uladh and the 4th is Meath -- Not sure it maps that well because there would have been no Munster or Connaught and arguably a province of Breffni (partly occupied by the Sasanach to this day).

Ah, I get you. I would say that the poster was referencing the Tommy Makem song 'Four Green Fields which contained the line 'one of them is in bondage' as opposed to the maps. I did learn from your post though.

lyno9235 · 11-12-2019 2:06pm

As a secondary school teacher I am appalled by the language used to describe teachers by this poster. I am a secondary school teacher and I am required to teach Transition Year students a module about nutrition. In order to educate my student's on this topic I have done extensive research to try to teach them the best information related to this topic. I am a professionally trained teacher and undertake my duties in a professional manner, not a personal one. The fact that modern research says that people are eating too much meat in their diets is not my personal diet plan that I wish to impose on my students. I am an educator, not a snowflake. I am not poisoning students minds, I am enlightening them. Not everyone is going to agree with everything taught in schools. That is why we encourage student's to be open minded. Perhaps parents could adopt a similar approach.

joeguevara · 11-12-2019 2:13pm

lyno9235 wrote: »

As a secondary school teacher I am appalled by the language used to describe teachers by this poster. I am a secondary school teacher and I am required to teach Transition Year students a module about nutrition. In order to educate my student's on this topic I have done extensive research to try to teach them the best information related to this topic. I am a professionally trained teacher and undertake my duties in a professional manner, not a personal one. The fact that modern research says that people are eating too much meat in their diets is not my personal diet plan that I wish to impose on my students. I am an educator, not a snowflake. I am not poisoning students minds, I am enlightening them. Not everyone is going to agree with everything taught in schools. That is why we encourage student's to be open minded. Perhaps parents could adopt a similar approach.

There is a big difference to educating students on, for example, too much meat in diets, than advocating veganism as the only way. Similarly, there is a big difference to discussing the pros and cons of political ideology as opposed to saying 'Socialism is the only way'. Can you not see that? The OP was looking to see if there is evidence of the former of which you don't fall into.

Moomoomacshoe · 11-12-2019 2:14pm

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

I'm leaving this thread now as it seems to have given an opening for others with an axe to grind on their own interests.

If anyone has examples or evidence of schools pushing any food-related agenda, please send me a DM and we'll go from there.

I'll post the findings--whatever they may be--in the coming days.

What are you talking about lol. There's no agenda. Primary schools teach the curriculum. Science teaches food chains , predators etc. The food pyramid is taught. Food related agenda?? Maybe conspiracy forums?

marieholmfan · 11-12-2019 2:17pm

joeguevara wrote: »

Ah, I get you. I would say that the poster was referencing the Tommy Makem song 'Four Green Fields which contained the line 'one of them is in bondage' as opposed to the maps. I did learn from your post though.

I was referring to the song initially.

Dickie10 · 11-12-2019 3:13pm

Secondary teacher in an all girls school, I don't see too much evidence of snow flake teachers tbh. Vast majority of teachers all sem to come from similar backgrounds particularly in rural areas, many sons and daughters of farmers. I think secondary students actually are well able to make up their minds on these issues and I have seen a conservative kick back against the whole vegan/environmental issues. Remember if issues become mainstream and advocated by too many older people, teenagers usually go the opposite way. For every action theres a reaction. I believe we could actually be going towards a conservative era again

Dickie10 · 11-12-2019 3:15pm

Forgot to say the school is in a rural market town and many children from farms so my experience may be skewed. We always have a good uptake in Ag Science too

Siamsa Sessions · 11-12-2019 4:13pm

lyno9235 wrote: »

As a secondary school teacher I am appalled by the language used to describe teachers by this poster. I am a secondary school teacher and I am required to teach Transition Year students a module about nutrition. In order to educate my student's on this topic I have done extensive research to try to teach them the best information related to this topic. I am a professionally trained teacher and undertake my duties in a professional manner, not a personal one. The fact that modern research says that people are eating too much meat in their diets is not my personal diet plan that I wish to impose on my students. I am an educator, not a snowflake. I am not poisoning students minds, I am enlightening them. Not everyone is going to agree with everything taught in schools. That is why we encourage student's to be open minded. Perhaps parents could adopt a similar approach.

re language: the title of the thread is satire. It's taking the michael out of people who make such claims.

re facts on modern research: If the research was clear, then I would expect the Dept of Education to issue dietary advice to that effect.

I'll state it again since some posters are obviously not reading what I wrote on here: I'm looking for evidence to either support or dispel urban myths and conspiracies.

ganmo · 11-12-2019 4:19pm

A university in england walking back a beef ban
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/12/09/student-fightback-sees-university-beef-ban-overturned/?WT.mc_id=tmgoff_hootsuite&utm_source=tmgoff_socialteam&utm_medium=facebook&utm_content=51b7b815-e3f9-48b8-af9a-f034b791da2d&utm_campaign=the+telegraph&fbclid=IwAR3x8kHU43WWjCAr7DL-hN4z1FpTJ0E8r9qwZZHVU3GgC96EnFP5V8-aJeo

however there's this bit in the article,

It had been the third University to ban beef. Cambridge University's catering service has removed beef and lamb from the menu whilst Goldsmiths in London has banned it from campus completely

so OP's concerns are actually happening...just not in Ireland yet

ganmo · 11-12-2019 9:24pm

May scratch out that yet
https://twitter.com/CalCommons/status/1204482646232969217?s=19
Dcu su lookin to ban beef

kk.man · 11-12-2019 9:34pm

Was driving on the motorway recently and I passed a lorry full of cattle. Daughter aged 8 years enquired if the cattle were being brought to the factory for slaughter. She asked me to stop the lorry to prevent the cattle being slaughtered. Strange times I thought to myself.

Dickie10 · 11-12-2019 10:28pm

i firmly believe there will be a kick back to all this

Dickie10 · 11-12-2019 10:30pm

ireland needs to finger the blame to unsustainable beef production. thats the elephant in the room. its not ireland or western europe were feeding but Asia and Africa. those African countries will be a gold mine in 20 years time for beef consumption and very easy for ireland to supply.

Siamsa Sessions · 11-12-2019 10:33pm

ganmo wrote: »

May scratch out that yet
https://twitter.com/CalCommons/status/1204482646232969217?s=19
Dcu su lookin to ban beef

Question is will those suppliers react to such lobbying?

And related: if the claim is that removing beef will reduce the DCU carbon footprint, how will this be measured? What if students just leave the campus at lunchtime and head to the nearest McDonalds - will that beef consumption not be counted in the campus's carbon footprint?

purplecow1977 · 11-12-2019 10:33pm

I'm a primary teacher and wouldn't push a vegan diet on to the kids I teach - but I'm not a vegan anyway!

I know schools in the UK were pushing for vegetarianism as I had come across some resources when I was browsing lessons online!

Gaspode · 11-12-2019 10:38pm

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

I'm leaving this thread now as it seems to have given an opening for others with an axe to grind on their own interests.

If anyone has examples or evidence of schools pushing any food-related agenda, please send me a DM and we'll go from there.

I'll post the findings--whatever they may be--in the coming days.

Look forward to seeing which rag you publish this 'research' in!

You might want to look up what the term Snowflake means while you're at it, you might recognise yourself in there.

Say my name · 11-12-2019 10:48pm

Dickie10 wrote: »

ireland needs to finger the blame to unsustainable beef production. thats the elephant in the room.

That's been done to death at this stage by farmers trying to state their case but it hasn't stuck. Animal production has got a bad environmental, bad welfare, bad ethics, bad image, stuck firmly on it by social and terrestrial media. And the age we're in now everyone believes the worst so it's stuck, hook, line and sinker.
As a poster posted here there'll be a time in 20 years when killing an animal will be verboten in Ireland.

John_Rambo · 11-12-2019 11:08pm

A bit off topic, but the best teacher I ever had was my Ag Science teacher.

In Drumcondra.

In Inner City Dublin.

For the leaving certificate.

He even took us all to a by-products factory where we saw things that will never leave our innocent minds! We tested soil, did worm counts, learned about ragwort, sheep, pig, and cattle breeds, silage, hay, tillage, visited countless farms, carried out extensive field tests throughout the seasons.

He was WAY ahead of his time, predicted issues with feeding beef by products of beef in the eighties, was passionate about his work, farmed himself during the summer holidays. A passionate, skilled and engaged teacher.

I ended up with an A in Ag science!!

Weirdly, it's stood to me in various areas of professional life. I'm in the creative field, marketing, visuals, photography and design which means working in tourism for a few months and then someone like Coillte the next month. I'm working on a new brand at the moment that's vegan (not food) and these threads are handy to get a viewpoint on attitudes towards various new marketed products.

I'd love to hear his views on what's going on in the agriculture industry today. I reckon he'd have a pretty good handle on how farmers should advance.

I myself was immersed in the print industry when it became a dirty word and had to diverse, retrain and up-skill massivly to make myself viable in the new various media platforms.

G-Man · 12-12-2019 10:32am

This sort of trawling for information can also have a chilling effect on discussion. The idea that certain topics are monitored and reported on. Is the OP or his suggested reports some sort of experts in education or the subjects discussed in class that can determine what is bad and good to talk about.. If the OP is concerned perhaps they would look and comment on the school curriculum available at https://www.curriculumonline.ie

The idea that parents would monitor. report and collate topics is like something out of a fundamentalist school system.

Is the OP only interested in topics that promote veganism or is he also against the topic of too much meat and dairy in our diet in general. Is he against discussions on fasting. Is he agains promoting more vegetables in schools. Is he against discussions of cultures that dont eat meat,.

I really doubt any school has a discussion on veganism, but as they discuss many other topics, I am sure part of the topic comes up and its likely children and teachers and parents can be confident they are in a school system that promotes open discussion and not one subject to the ears outside the school gate and then reporting back.

whelan2 · 12-12-2019 10:42am

purplecow1977 wrote: »

I'm a primary teacher and wouldn't push a vegan diet on to the kids I teach - but I'm not a vegan anyway!

I know schools in the UK were pushing for vegetarianism as I had come across some resources when I was browsing lessons online!

I was talking to another parent during the summer her daughter and mine went to primary school together. Her daughter became vegan after something their 6th class teacher said about the slaughter of animals. Now my daughter would just have ignored the teacher's comments but kids are so impressionable at that age. Her mother said there's no way she's getting the nutrients she needs from her vegan diet and it's costing a bomb

Dickie10 · 12-12-2019 10:42am

As farmers I think we need to put our energies into finding new and expanding markets in a post Brexit Europe. We cant rely on western Europe. I thin we really need to get stuck in as beef plan has on export to china by producer groups. cut the middleman

390kid · 12-12-2019 11:46am

kk.man wrote: »

Was driving on the motorway recently and I passed a lorry full of cattle. Daughter aged 8 years enquired if the cattle were being brought to the factory for slaughter. She asked me to stop the lorry to prevent the cattle being slaughtered. Strange times I thought to myself.

Ahh wouldn’t worry about that kk man. I do be constantly reminded of the time I didn’t want any of ours sold or sent to the factory lots a tears involved very embarrassing now 20 years later when I’m ranting I didn’t get enough for them when they do go

Jb1989 · 12-12-2019 12:01pm

Balf wrote: »

The Church always had it in for the poor beef farmer.

All that "You will be fishers of men" business. Why not herders of cattle?

Probly because Jesus fed loaves and fishes to the 5000, not loaves and a plate of mince.

Siamsa Sessions · 12-12-2019 12:22pm

G-Man wrote: »

This sort of trawling for information can also have a chilling effect on discussion. The idea that certain topics are monitored and reported on. Is the OP or his suggested reports some sort of experts in education or the subjects discussed in class that can determine what is bad and good to talk about.. If the OP is concerned perhaps they would look and comment on the school curriculum available at https://www.curriculumonline.ie

The idea that parents would monitor. report and collate topics is like something out of a fundamentalist school system.

Is the OP only interested in topics that promote veganism or is he also against the topic of too much meat and dairy in our diet in general. Is he against discussions on fasting. Is he agains promoting more vegetables in schools. Is he against discussions of cultures that dont eat meat,.

I really doubt any school has a discussion on veganism, but as they discuss many other topics, I am sure part of the topic comes up and its likely children and teachers and parents can be confident they are in a school system that promotes open discussion and not one subject to the ears outside the school gate and then reporting back.

As insults go, I have to say this is the best one I've received on this thread. A few things and we can hopefully close this topic then:

* Apologies if the satire/irony of the title was lost on people. Perhaps some don't expect satire (or even literacy) on a farmers' forum.

* I have zero agenda. I expect all current affairs to be discussed in primary and secondary schools. My only concern was the gossip and rumours going around on Facebook and Twitter that some teachers were, let's say, veering too much in a particular direction.

* Kids and what they say is their business. Teachers like us farmers are adults and have more responsibility.

* @G-man: thanks for editing your initial post and taking the hard edge off it re my parenting abilities or whether I was taking enough responsibility for my own kids. I don't take it personally (how could anyone on an anonymous forum?) but removing it meant some other poster couldn't use to have a go at you or me. Thanks.

* After asking on various social media channels, on boards.ie here, and on a few WhatsApp groups, there has been not a single solid example of any teacher bringing in materials or pushing an agenda (whelan2's example above is as close as it gets)

* This means farmers can tell their fellow farmers to shut up if they start spouting about snowflake teachers poisoning our children's minds.

* It also means teachers can point to this little bit of research, from a farmer no less, if they are ever accused of pushing any agenda.

* Last word: to anyone who insulted me or accused me of god knows what for trying to find hard facts - you've won! I'm going to stick to Facebook and Twitter in future where people are much more measured and polite

robindch · 12-12-2019 12:51pm

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

No doubt we've all heard stories about vegan teachers advising children not to eat meat, encouraging meat-free Mondays, etc. Has anyone specific examples of it happening in Ireland?

I've been involved with my local Educate Together primary school for the last eight years and I've never heard once that a teacher would express an personal opinion like that - it's ludicrously unprofessional.

The only primary school area in which teachers are allowed, even required, to pass off personal opinions as fact is in religion class.

_Brian · 12-12-2019 2:49pm

Youngest is in 5th class and they had a climate change assignment.
Rural school but probably only 50% are farming families.

A number of kids got up and spoke about how animal farming is destroying the planet and needs to stop to save the world.

It’s like the “drink Guinness for iron” slogan, if enough people repeat a lie long enough then it becomes accepted as a truth and impossible to rebuff. The iron thing in Guinness was actually an error and a decimal place incorrectly recorded it as having 10x the actual iron content.

Balf · 13-12-2019 1:20pm

_Brian wrote: »

Youngest is in 5th class and they had a climate change assignment.
Rural school but probably only 50% are farming families.

Would it even be that? Only 5% of farmers are aged under 35, so I'd wonder at how many have children to send to national school.

And I don't think the Sive scenario plays out so much now.

_Brian wrote: »

A number of kids got up and spoke about how animal farming is destroying the planet and needs to stop to save the world.

Its a simplification, but probably closer to the truth than the myth that we produce enough food to feed tens of millions - which Teagasc is happy to promote with wording designed to mislead.

gozunda · 19-12-2019 9:01am

Balf wrote: »

Would it even be that? Only 5% of farmers are aged under 35, so I'd wonder at how many have children to send to national school.

And I don't think the Sive scenario plays out so much now.Its a simplification, but probably closer to the truth than the myth that we produce enough food to feed tens of millions - which Teagasc is happy to promote with wording designed to mislead.

Sure Balf. All farming bad. Yup we get ya!

_Brian · 19-12-2019 9:31am

Balf wrote: »

Would it even be that? Only 5% of farmers are aged under 35, so I'd wonder at how many have children to send to national school.

And I don't think the Sive scenario plays out so much now.Its a simplification, but probably closer to the truth than the myth that we produce enough food to feed tens of millions - which Teagasc is happy to promote with wording designed to mislead.

Burning of fossil fuels is by multiples worse than any farming. Only an idiot will continue to pedal that lie, letting your emotional weakness for farming cloud your judgement to the extent that your happy to believe and repeat a lie is scary. The same way that German citizens allowed themselves to believe Jews were an enemy. It’s a form of mass hysteria that a group of people who consider themselves intelligent will intentionally believe and repeat a total lie.

If veganism needs such a blatant lie to sustain membership and momentum it would be a pure embarrassment to be associated with it.

As for your comments on export, I can’t comment as I’m not interested, I’ve repeatedly stated my personal position in intensive farming. Beef is being over produced to the detriment of farmers and biodiversity.

The trick that is used in paid for research against agriculture is to divide out the burning of fossil fuels into different categories separating “transport” from “heating” and “electricity generation”, plus they will include the felling of trees in the calculation for agriculture even for agriculture in Ireland where we are increasing forestry coverage and are at the highest coverage in 100years.

When we group together all the broken categories for fossil fuel usage it accounts for more than 80% of co2 emissions where land use accounts for less than 10%

https://whatsyourimpact.org/greenhouse-gases/carbon-dioxide-emissions

Snowflake teachers poisoning our children's minds

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