Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Formula 1 2019 - General Discussion Thread

15455575960111

Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 508 ✭✭✭ Payton Low Corkscrew


    recyclebin wrote: »
    Empty stands at other races shows the appetite around the world. Some tracks have very poor attendance rates.

    Especially as we move more into the developing world that lacks a historical fan base and income. I can't imagine many Vietnamese can afford an f1 ticket. I struggle and I have a typical western income.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,977 ✭✭✭✭Burkie1203


    Especially as we move more into the developing world that lacks a historical fan base and income. I can't imagine many Vietnamese can afford an f1 ticket. I struggle and I have a typical western income.

    The other thing about Sundays race was it was an old school race track.


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,873 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    Especially as we move more into the developing world that lacks a historical fan base and income. I can't imagine many Vietnamese can afford an f1 ticket. I struggle and I have a typical western income.

    True but the point is to get established in an emerging market. So when incomes rise in those countries, f1 will be part of it. When I say f1 I mean the sport (race attendances) and the brands associated with it (ability to advertise Renault, Heineken or whatever brands are there in 10-15 or maybe 30 years time as the country gets richer and can afford to buy those things)

    It’s a gamble. F1 is investing in emerging markets. It might pay off. It might drop off the calendar in a couple of years like India and turkey did.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,445 ✭✭✭Anjobe


    Burkie1203 wrote: »
    The other thing about Sundays race was it was an old school race track.

    Used to be, the current layout is a Tilke design.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,553 ✭✭✭Cork Trucker


    Ah yes, Hermann tilke, the man who butchered Hockenheim, i know not everyone liked it, but the forest sections of the track were great


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 19,873 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    Anjobe wrote: »
    Used to be, the current layout is a Tilke design.

    Very few people know that level of detail. And the race at the weekend had lots of overtaking at the front. Can’t really argue with that.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    Some Tilke tracks are perfectly fine, I always liked Malaysia. Also tarmac run off areas are a safety thing. Was it after Schumacher went into the wall that philosophy changed and they started using tarmac for run off areas.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,553 ✭✭✭Cork Trucker


    meeeeh wrote: »
    Some Tilke tracks are perfectly fine, I always liked Malaysia. Also tarmac run off areas are a safety thing. Was it after Schumacher went into the wall that philosophy changed and they started using tarmac for run off areas.

    He ran off the track in practice at Australia 2001 and the car barrel rolled in the gravel, was that it?


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    I thought it was 1999 when he went into the wall in Silverstone that started the discussion. I'm not 100% that I'm correct on that but I know one of the major accidents was made worse by gravel and they started changing tracks after that.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,027 ✭✭✭H3llR4iser


    Anjobe wrote: »
    Used to be, the current layout is a Tilke design.

    Well, it what I would call a "partially Tilke" design - it follows a design philosophy in common with the old Zeltweg track, so compared to TV-eyecandy cr@p we've seen the last few years, it IS positively "old school".

    It's not by chance that the A1 ring tends to produce either upsets (Williams having a shot at winning it in 2014, Red Bull winning last two seasons) or entertaining races like this year or 2016.

    Then again, you can ruin "old school" tracks - the Paul Ricard still has its entilery old school layout in terms of corners, it was one motherfcuker of a track with fearsome Signes corner, yet they managed to make it look as ridiculous as it gets.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 1,445 ✭✭✭Anjobe


    Ah yes, Hermann tilke, the man who butchered Hockenheim, i know not everyone liked it, but the forest sections of the track were great

    Sadly claimed the life of the great Jim Clark though...


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,752 ✭✭✭✭flazio


    I think the tarmac run offs were made for motorcycles rather then cars I think I remember Charlie Whiting saying.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,445 ✭✭✭Anjobe


    H3llR4iser wrote: »
    Well, it what I would call a "partially Tilke" design - it follows a design philosophy in common with the old Zeltweg track, so compared to TV-eyecandy cr@p we've seen the last few years, it IS positively "old school".

    If you compare the old layout with the Tilke redesign, the only bits he kept were the straights.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,499 ✭✭✭the_pen_turner


    are there any good videos showing these circuits from a design perspective and how they vary from one designer to another


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 508 ✭✭✭ Payton Low Corkscrew


    are there any good videos showing these circuits from a design perspective and how they vary from one designer to another

    There's a good chain bear article here:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCpoIUkM9So

    Anything built since Malaysia in 1999 is almost certainly Tilke-designed. Tilke tracks tend to be a blank slate design. He decides what goes where. Sounds good in principle but lacks character. Think of all the features of great circuits, they either encompass the natural landscape, are historical relics of past use or are features of the locality. Very hard to build that into a race track without it looking artificial and contrived. Some good sections come about but you rarely get a challenging quick complex like maggots and becketts or an uphill sweep like eau rouge. All the tarmac runoffs spoil these aspects too and make it look sterile.


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,526 Mod ✭✭✭✭Darkglasses


    flazio wrote: »
    I think the tarmac run offs were made for motorcycles rather then cars I think I remember Charlie Whiting saying.

    Not really - again Chainbear has a great video on runoffs as a safety feature https://youtu.be/5N06z6VHXGA


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,027 ✭✭✭H3llR4iser


    Anjobe wrote: »
    If you compare the old layout with the Tilke redesign, the only bits he kept were the straights.


    Yes, what I mean is that it's a track that in its philosophy still harks back to the old days - the track follows the terrain and not vice-versa, there's an annoying but challenging bump in the middle of turn 3, turns 4-5 are off camber and it's not an endless collection of hairpins and constant radius corners. The last sector, specifically, is clearly designed to try and replicate the old Zeltweg course - although, IIRC, the original track had these corners banked!



    Compared to some utter horror fest like Sochi or Abu Dhabi, it's a world apart.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    Abu Dhabi follows the terrain. There is just nothing there. Anyway it's actually great track to watch live, in a nice spot you can see quite a bit of action.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,095 ✭✭✭✭Frank Bullitt


    Didn't Tilke do Malaysia? I loved that track so much, its a shame F1 doesn't go there anymore.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 508 ✭✭✭ Payton Low Corkscrew


    Gintonious wrote: »
    Didn't Tilke do Malaysia? I loved that track so much, its a shame F1 doesn't go there anymore.

    Yeah, he did. I liked it too. I don't think Tilke is terrible but a bit of variety would be nice.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 4,654 ✭✭✭kksaints


    Did Tilke do Istanbul also? That was a very interesting track particularly turn 8.


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,526 Mod ✭✭✭✭Darkglasses


    kksaints wrote: »
    Did Tilke do Istanbul also? That was a very interesting track particularly turn 8.

    Yes, one of his best I thought.

    I thought India was a great design as well.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,618 ✭✭✭Infoanon


    Burkie1203 wrote: »
    The other thing about Sundays race was it was an old school race track.

    In name only....


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,372 ✭✭✭Gamb!t


    I wonder does Daniel Ricciardo regret moving from Red Bull ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,395 ✭✭✭Harika


    flazio wrote: »
    I think the tarmac run offs were made for motorcycles rather then cars I think I remember Charlie Whiting saying.

    They were made for spectators as everyone prefers 20 cars on track compared to 6. A car beached in the sand was out while on tarmac they could continue. The advertisers also prefer their cars running compared to out and not shown.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,618 ✭✭✭Infoanon


    Harika wrote: »
    flazio wrote: »
    I think the tarmac run offs were made for motorcycles rather then cars I think I remember Charlie Whiting saying.

    They were made for spectators as everyone prefers 20 cars on track compared to 6. A car beached in the sand was out while on tarmac they could continue. The advertisers also prefer their cars running compared to out and not shown.
    Made for moto gp - think it was Seb at the weekend that referenced it.

    Reality is the circuits make more from Moto GP so are willing to cater to their needs.
    Silverstone / Barcelona are among the most recent circuits to make changes for moto gp


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,395 ✭✭✭Harika


    Infoanon wrote: »
    Made for moto gp - think it was Seb at the weekend that referenced it.

    Reality is the circuits make more from Moto GP so are willing to cater to their needs.
    Silverstone / Barcelona are among the most recent circuits to make changes for moto gp

    Also true. The future of race track design is going to incorporate a lot more tarmac because off-line the tarmac gets dusty. So when you push the front in third gear, you end up in the gravel trap. If you just slide on tarmac that's better, so long as the leathers hold up..." Kenny Roberts 2007


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,418 ✭✭✭✭AMKC
    Ms


    I agree some of the Tilke tracks are very boring and without character but have to say I loved Malaysia and think its terrible that its not on the calendar anymore. I thought India, Istanbul and the Korea track was good too although the way Turkey is gone now probably better that F1 does not go there now. I really like the COTA at Austin track and think Sochi is decent too just don't like the Country it is in or the leader of that country.

    Would love to know what has become of the tracks that are no longer on the calendar.

    Live long and Prosper

    Peace and long life.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,618 ✭✭✭Infoanon


    AMKC wrote: »
    I agree some of the Tilke tracks are very boring and without character but have to say I loved Malaysia and think its terrible that its not on the calendar anymore. I thought India, Istanbul and the Korea track was good too although the way Turkey is gone now probably better that F1 does not go there now. I really like the COTA at Austin track and think Sochi is decent too just don't like the Country it is in or the leader of that country.

    Would love to know what has become of the tracks that are no longer on the calendar.
    There's lots of videos up on you tube of old circuits.
    The Indian circuit is still in situ and well maintained - along with the motor ways build especially for the event - alas India tax laws got in the way.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    I've been to Turkey and while good on tv it was terrible track to get to. Istanbul is great city but the traffic there is insane. If you expect people to go to the track also on Saturday and Friday you have to make it more attractive than staying in the city.


This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement