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Woman Loses Job for Holding Gender Critical Opinions.

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  • Options
    #92
    Zorya
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,194 ✭✭✭Zorya


    strandroad wrote: »
    Where is this whole sex thing coming from? If someone unwanted pesters you it's harassment or assault and should be dealt with as such.

    Material reality as she is referring to it would bar trans people from accessing spaces or services. She counts a trans woman panellist as a man etc.

    No material reality refers to the fact that a person does not change sex by thinking it.

    And it relates to sex thusly - if YOU personally agree that self identification actually changes sex and thus allows people to enter their chosen sex spaces then it also allows them to engage sexually as that sex and be wholly accepted as thus. So, are you open to female bodied men sexually? Or do you have limits and preferences? If straight are you open to male bodied women as sexual partners? Not as pests, not as stalkers, but do you have sexual attractiondifferentiation that you make based on genotype/phenotype?


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    #93
    strandroad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,676 ✭✭✭strandroad


    STB. wrote: »
    A "Manifesto" ? That is not what medium.com is about. Its an opinion piece on an online journalism website.



    There will always be debate as long as we have those recklessly hand picking what they disagreed with and quoting in isolation without reading (or refusing to) the whole piece.


    That's what you did. You obviously have an agenda and are not open to reasoned argument. Your fake summarisation of the article coupled with your description of an opinion piece as a manifesto, wont fly here.

    Relax, call it something else then. "A summary of her opinion" is fine.


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    #94
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    strandroad wrote:
    Then imagine that you are her coworker who transitioned but she still counts you under your past gender like she does this panellist, campaigns against you using spaces or services etc because you are a threat to their regular users. Do you think that she would be kept as an employee?

    Yes.


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    #95
    strandroad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,676 ✭✭✭strandroad


    Zorya wrote: »
    No material reality refers to the fact that a person does not change sex by thinking it.

    And it relates to sex thusly - if YOU personally agree that self identification actually changes sex and thus allows people to enter their chosen sex spaces then it also allows them to engage sexually as that sex and be wholly accepted as thus. So, are you open to female bodied men sexually? Or do you have limits and preferences? If straight are you open to male bodied women as sexual partners? Not as pests, not as stalkers, but do you have sexual attractiondifferentiation that you make based on genotype/phenotype?

    Of course everyone has sexual preferences and they will continue to do so. Where is this topic even coming from?
    You can always have someone throwing a strop that a girl picked his mate over him so they call her names. Now with more combos in the mix, and Twitter.


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    #96
    STB.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    strandroad wrote: »
    Relax, call it something else then. "A summary of her opinion" is fine.


    I am relaxed. Just don't try and tell me and others what she did and didn't say. I am well able to read.


    Be careful what you post. You may be called on it. You can advance your arguements a lot better by not resorting to labelling opinion pieces as "manifestos" and certainly not mis-reporting them.


    The issue is not how much accomodation should be given to people who want to be identified as a woman, man or banana, but the manner in which a Tink Tank organisation has completely over reached in sacking an employee for having a reasoned opinion.


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    #97
    Gimme A Pound
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,482 ✭✭✭Gimme A Pound


    Joeytheparrot wrote: »
    Nah. Irish women reject this exclusionary nonsense https://feministire.com/2018/01/22/an-open-letter-to-the-organisers-of-the-we-need-to-talk-tour-from-a-group-of-feminists-in-ireland/
    Really Joey, your posts give the impression that you are such a slave to a particular ideology/to appearing a certain way. You don't even try to understand the point she's making and you think you can speak for all Irish women. Even I can't do that - and I'm an Irish woman.


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    #98
    Jimbob1977
    Registered Users Posts: 2,239 ✭✭✭Jimbob1977


    How many genders, Winston?' 

    'Two! Stop it, stop it! How can you go on? Two! Two!'

    'How many genders, Winston?' 

    'Three! Three! Three!' 

    'No, Winston, that is no use. You are lying. You still think there are two. How many genders, please?' 

    'Three! Three! Three! Anything you like. Only stop it, stop the pain!' 


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    #99
    strandroad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,676 ✭✭✭strandroad


    STB. wrote: »
    Be careful what you post. You may be called on it.

    What a strange tone to take, what are you trying to say?

    It's just a discussion forum, feel free to simply disagree with me.


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    #100
    STB.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    strandroad wrote: »
    What a strange tone to take, what are you trying to say?

    It's just a discussion forum, feel free to simply disagree with me.

    That you misreported what she said.

    That you have your own agenda.

    I have said it several times at this stage.

    Perhaps you genuinely have a problem understanding words. However, that's no excuse, so drop the victim complex.


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    #101
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Brendan Delaney wrote: »
    'People should aspire to be submissive bootlickers who never question anything'.

    Question everything, but be prepared for the consequences.
    Just don't be a whingebag, "waah, I wanna say whatever I want and have no repurcussions".

    The world does not and never has worked like that.


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    #102
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Deleted User wrote:
    Question everything, but be prepared for the consequences. Just don't be a whingebag, "waah, I wanna say whatever I want and have no repurcussions".

    "I feel like I was born a woman"
    "Oh really. That's unfortunate. You weren't"
    "Waaaah. Treat me as if I was or you are a bigot"


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    #103
    Gimme A Pound
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,482 ✭✭✭Gimme A Pound


    Jimbob1977 wrote: »
    How many genders, Winston?' 

    'Two! Stop it, stop it! How can you go on? Two! Two!'

    'How many genders, Winston?' 

    'Three! Three! Three!' 

    'No, Winston, that is no use. You are lying. You still think there are two. How many genders, please?' 

    'Three! Three! Three! Anything you like. Only stop it, stop the pain!' 
    There was a time not long ago I thought comparing this world to 1984 was hysteria (I still do mostly - North Korea is much more comparable) but Orwell was talking about a lot of things - and one of those was distortion of reality and language. You're spot-on.


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    #104
    Gimme A Pound
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,482 ✭✭✭Gimme A Pound


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Question everything, but be prepared for the consequences.
    Just don't be a whingebag, "waah, I wanna say whatever I want and have no repurcussions".

    The world does not and never has worked like that.
    Terminating this woman's employment is disgraceful. Anyone who isn't a slave to being seen to occupy a particular political position at all times will acknowledge that.


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    #105
    Zorya
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,194 ✭✭✭Zorya


    Breanna Slimy Variable wrote: »
    Terminating this woman's employment is disgraceful. Anyone who isn't a slave to being seen to occupy a particular political position at all times will acknowledge that.


    That's just it, Gimme.

    I'm in big trouble. :pac: I'm on the lookout for the black helicopters. ;)


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    #106
    ogsjw
    Site Banned Posts: 328 ✭✭ogsjw


    I wonder if firing someone could be considered an expression of free speech.


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    #107
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    I just never get why non trans people get so up in arms about it anyway.

    It's literally none of your business. If Bob wants to be called Shirley and be referred to as her, why is that so hard to get? What difference would it make to your life? You've learned many things, how to walk, a language, drive etc. Far harder things than remembering Bob is now Shirley and would prefer you to call her, "her".


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    #108
    YFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 9,717 ✭✭✭YFlyer


    JohnnyFlash wrote: »
    It’s starting to look like women are the losers in this. They are further down the hierarchy of victimhood than they once were.

    Becoming a more equal society?


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    #109
    strandroad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,676 ✭✭✭strandroad


    STB. wrote: »
    That you misreported what she said.

    That you have your own agenda.

    I have said it several times at this stage.

    Perhaps you genuinely have a problem understanding words. However, that's no excuse, so drop the victim complex.

    I even provided links; again feel free to disagree with my reading, that's the point of us being here after all, but there is no need to give me any warnings or to insult my intelligence. Block me if my agenda (?) is unbearable.


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    #110
    YFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 9,717 ✭✭✭YFlyer


    Zorya wrote: »
    I sincerely doubt any woman who is a lesbian is going to have sex with a person with a penis just because said penis haver has said they are a woman[/url]

    Well those that claim to not be socially intimidated.


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    #111
    ogsjw
    Site Banned Posts: 328 ✭✭ogsjw


    YFlyer wrote: »
    equal society


    Excuse me but hate speech like this is not welcome on boards. What a truly disgusting thing to say!



    Keep it to transphobia, homophobia, islamophobia, sexism or racism please!


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    #112
    StinkyMunkey
    Registered Users Posts: 1,398 ✭✭✭StinkyMunkey


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I just never get why non trans people get so up in arms about it anyway.

    It's literally none of your business. If Bob wants to be called Shirley and be referred to as her, why is that so hard to get? What difference would it make to your life? You've learned many things, how to walk, a language, drive etc. Far harder things than remembering Bob is now Shirley and would prefer you to call her, "her".

    Yes and no, I don't know any trans people and their choices have 0% impact on my life. But some people do and the trans persons choices can have a practical impact on their lives. Such as working with a trans person, which loo do they use. For a limited number of practical reasons, compromises on both side have to be made.

    At the end of the day, I'll personally accommodate anyone, but only within reason.

    I think everyone has a right to be who they want to be, but the world should never be forced to bend just for an individuals choice.


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    #113
    Gimme A Pound
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,482 ✭✭✭Gimme A Pound


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I just never get why non trans people get so up in arms about it anyway.

    It's literally none of your business. If Bob wants to be called Shirley and be referred to as her, why is that so hard to get? What difference would it make to your life? You've learned many things, how to walk, a language, drive etc. Far harder things than remembering Bob is now Shirley and would prefer you to call her, "her".
    You and Joey appear not to have read the article - just see questions about how "female" is defined, and think "must be anti trans bigots - next". Being that way will get boring - I find my mind more enriched by considering various outlooks. Not hatred of course - that's not something I'd bother engaging with, but there is a spectrum of opinions. It's not simply a case that people whose opinions differ to yours are wrong and that's the end of it.

    This woman didn't say anything about having an issue with Bob becoming Shirley and she. I would fully get behind Bob becoming Shirley and she. I'd hope Shirley would be similarly considerate if people who knew her as Bob/he for years accidentally said Bob/he and did not mean any hurt, just made a mistake.

    This woman is talking about the wider ramifications of deeming gender and sex to be the same thing, of pretending biology is wrong, and of the readiness to consider someone female because they just say they "feel" female.

    She is concerned about this redefining of language and reality and there isn't a thing wrong with that.


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    #114
    YFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 9,717 ✭✭✭YFlyer


    Candamir wrote: »
    Go and have a look at some of the lesbian bashing on twitter. Apparently lesbians need to learn to like dick, and if they don’t, they’re transphobes.

    I’m no expert, but I always thought the reason they were lesbian was because they don’t like dick. Totally confused now. That must make me a TERF too.

    I'm no expert either., I thought they were lesbian due to what they prefer and is comfortable with.


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    #115
    YFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 9,717 ✭✭✭YFlyer


    Squatter wrote: »
    Kindly define "women" for me.

    I'd hate to post an opinion that might get me into trouble with Terry the Budgie.

    I should have said 'do people have a mind of their own?'


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    #116
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Deleted User wrote:
    It's literally none of your business. If Bob wants to be called Shirley and be referred to as her, why is that so hard to get? What difference would it make to your life? You've learned many things, how to walk, a language, drive etc. Far harder things than remembering Bob is now Shirley and would prefer you to call her, "her".

    It is none of my business. So Bob should stop imposing his preference onto me.

    If he wants to treted be a woman then sure, I more than likely will be accommodating. But the idea that I could be fired for not complying to Bob's world view, then it becomes my business.


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    #117
    YFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 9,717 ✭✭✭YFlyer


    Augme wrote: »
    Ive never seen or heard of a situation where a lesbian has had to have sex with someone who has a penis because "society" told her to.

    Me neither. And I hope nobody is forced to have sex against their will.


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    #118
    Candamir
    Registered Users Posts: 531 ✭✭✭Candamir


    YFlyer wrote: »
    Me neither. And I hope nobody is forced to have sex against their will.


    Same question to you so:

    Candamir wrote: »
    So it’s ok so long as nobody is actually forced to have sex against their will.

    Do you think the bullying that these lesbians get is ok?
    Would it be ok if it were young heterosexual women who were being bullied on twitter for not ‘putting out’ ?


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    #119
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    it comes back to the nature of "truth"

    back in the bad old days, people who said that the evidence from the observable physical world was at odds with notion of a god were dealt with harshly.

    nowadays saying that the evidence from the observable physical world is at odds with someone's gender identity is also frowned upon.

    there will always be sacred cows and heresy. make no mistake - thats what this stuff is about.


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    #120
    YFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 9,717 ✭✭✭YFlyer


    Candamir wrote: »
    Same question to you so:

    Just say no.


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    #121
    How Soon Is Now
    Registered Users Posts: 13,083 ✭✭✭✭How Soon Is Now


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    I just never get why non trans people get so up in arms about it anyway.

    It's literally none of your business. If Bob wants to be called Shirley and be referred to as her, why is that so hard to get? What difference would it make to your life? You've learned many things, how to walk, a language, drive etc. Far harder things than remembering Bob is now Shirley and would prefer you to call her, "her".

    It's none of our business grand. Remember that boys and girls if the day ever comes and the country is asked to vote on any trans related issues.


This discussion has been closed.
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