Minor Tournaments Discussion 2018/19.

Arthur Daley · 15-12-2018 8:04am

Semi final line up here looks tasty enough

Joe_ Public · 15-12-2018 6:06pm

Some solid cohones from Allen to force a decider here. Was absolutely horrid first four frames it has to be said, didn’t see any way back for him. Wells starting to tie up has definitely helped.

Inviere · 15-12-2018 8:19pm

Does the main camera angle look all wrong to anyone else? It’s making the table look far too flat

Joe_ Public · 16-12-2018 12:17am

Was wondering why Allen was looking so shredded in the early part of his match today. Turns out he was simply hungover after a session last night. Been on the lash in Glasgow all week, he says. Didn’t say if he was heading off for another skinful straight after his interview, but sure why interrupt a winning formula at this stage?

El_Duderino 09 · 16-12-2018 12:21pm

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Was wondering why Allen was looking so shredded in the early part of his match today. Turns out he was simply hungover after a session last night. Been on the lash in Glasgow all week, he says. Didn’t say if he was heading off for another skinful straight after his interview, but sure why interrupt a winning formula at this stage?

He said he had a couple of drinks during the interval in the match he was losing. Came out and won 5/6 frames to win the match.

Probably not a great precede though

walshb · 16-12-2018 5:58pm

Allen comes across like an asshole with his hungover drinking crap talk...

Like Ronnie, he seems to crave any type of attention...

Inviere · 16-12-2018 6:22pm

walshb wrote: »

Allen comes across like an asshole with his hungover drinking crap talk...

Like Ronnie, he seems to crave any type of attention...

I seriously can’t warm to the guy. Really hoping Shaun turns turns things around later in, can’t bear to watch Allen winning. In saying that, I think short of Ronnie, Shelby and co...he’s prob tog dog these days.

Joe_ Public · 16-12-2018 6:34pm

walshb wrote: »

Allen comes across like an asshole with his hungover drinking crap talk...

Like Ronnie, he seems to crave any type of attention...

Couldn’t disagree more. You could say it’s a bit unprofessional to be on a drinking spree the week of a tournament but I think he’s truly shocked he’s made it as far as he did. Doesn’t say much for the standard of a lot of the players on tour imo.

You can criticise both Allen - whom I like a lot as a person- and Ronnie but to simply dismiss them as attention seekers or assholes is way off base as far as I’m concerned.

Inviere · 16-12-2018 8:27pm

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Couldn’t disagree more. You could say it’s a bit unprofessional to be on a drinking spree the week of a tournament but I think he’s truly shocked he’s made it as far as he did. Doesn’t say much for the standard of a lot of the players on tour imo.

You can criticise both Allen - whom I like a lot as a person- and Ronnie but to simply dismiss them as attention seekers or assholes is way off base as far as I’m concerned.

He could be sound in person, but I can’t warm to him because of the whole “angry man” persona...he tends to whige and moan a fair bit too, so I’m content enough knowing he’s not my cuppa tea. Of course, I could meet him and think the complete opposite, but we can only go on what we see.

Murphy needs to get his act together here big time, he’s not at the races at all.

Joe_ Public · 16-12-2018 8:54pm

Inviere wrote: »

He could be sound in person, but I can’t warm to him because of the whole “angry man” persona...he tends to whige and moan a fair bit too, so I’m content enough knowing he’s not my cuppa tea. Of course, I could meet him and think the complete opposite, but we can only go on what we see.

Murphy needs to get his act together here big time, he’s not at the races at all.

No worries, we all have different ideas about sports players and performers we merely watch from afar. Personally I think Allen has matured a lot over the years and is finally knuckling down to be the player he often promised to be, but he’s not the full package and has some way to go yet. Murphy is a guy I can’t warm to at all, but that’s just me. I’m sure he could care less one way or the other!!

The bit I was taking exception to was the attention seeking, it isn’t warranted whatever else you can say about Allen. And Ronnie too for that matter.

Joe_ Public · 16-12-2018 8:57pm

It’s looking 5-6 now, would just about fancy murphy from this point. Needs the win more than allen, should be enough motivation for him.

walshb · 16-12-2018 9:32pm

Joe, it’s all an act with Allen and Ronnie...an insecurity and an ego..

And, really...I expect more from these guys. They are looked up to, and the whole nonchalant on the piss (weird or BS story) come across as lacking any standards..

You kind of come across as accepting anything...not really caring for any kind of class and standards in sport...

Betting if Allen had have come outcsaying he was on a coke bender for the week you’d see nothing wrong with that either...

walshb · 16-12-2018 9:33pm

And seriously, if you cannot see that Ronnie is a serious narcissistic attention seeker, then what have you been watching with the lad the past 20 years..?

AllForIt · 16-12-2018 10:02pm

That miss to the left middle must be the worst miss I've ever seen a professional make in all my decades of watching snooker. I don't think it was one of those 'it looks easier on screen than it actually is' type of shots. Allen didn't even look too annoyed with himself for missing it!

Joe_ Public · 16-12-2018 10:14pm

walshb wrote: »

Joe, it’s all an act with Allen and Ronnie...an insecurity and an ego..

And, really...I expect more from these guys. They are looked up to, and the whole nonchalant on the piss (weird or BS story) come across as lacking any standards..

You kind of come across as accepting anything...not really caring for any kind of class and standards in sport...

Betting if Allen had have come outcsaying he was on a coke bender for the week you’d see nothing wrong with that either...

Ha ha, jaysus I'm not the moral police. As long as he’s not starting forest fires or mugging old ladies I couldn’t really give a feck what he does with his time off the table. And presumably if he was snorting lines of coke, he’d fail a test at some stage so for that reason I wouldn’t approve of that.

As for ronnie I’m well aware of his particular foibles, but I also believe he can be articulate and talk a lot of sense about the sport which tends to get lost as people just dismiss him as a crank as you are doing here.

zuutroy · 16-12-2018 10:35pm

Some fluke.

Joe_ Public · 16-12-2018 10:39pm

Two horrendous slices of bad luck for murphy there, way it goes in this game sometimes. Overall had his chances though so can’t really complain, neither performed any way near their best.

El_Duderino 09 · 17-12-2018 8:46am

I've never got the impression Allen is trying to forge an 'angry man' persona. I've watched a good bit of him over the last 2 tournaments and I don't see it. He was cra king jokes with the crowd, the opponent and even the ref at different times.

Hrloojs quite serious the rest of the time but that's fair enough when's player is concentrating.

Where does the idea of the angry man come from?

Joe_ Public · 17-12-2018 10:51am

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I've never got the impression Allen is trying to forge an 'angry man' persona. I've watched a good bit of him over the last 2 tournaments and I don't see it. He was cra king jokes with the crowd, the opponent and even the ref at different times.

Hrloojs quite serious the rest of the time but that's fair enough when's player is concentrating.

Where does the idea of the angry man come from?

It’s based on his behavior 10 years ago but fails to take into account how much he’s changed and developed. He did tend to be his own worst enemy a bit, sounding off about various stuff, getting involved in spats with other players as well as a long running feud with Barry Hearn. I think he’s mellowed since, realised he needed to concentrate more on his game, dealt with his depression issues and he’s a better player and person for it.

That’s how I’d see it anyway. He’s not perfect by any stretch but to suggest he’s putting on some sort of act is frankly just wrong and quite ludicrous.

Frank O. Pinion · 17-12-2018 12:14pm

If someone is drinking every night and wins a tournament, who cares? It's Snooker, not Boxing. I've never been a huge fan of Allen, but he has changed as a player and a person, and has had a great 2018, especially his 2018/19 Snooker season, so far. #1 player this season.

Top 16 ranked players for the season, as the year ends:

1. Mark Allen - £353,000
2. Ronnie O'Sullivan - £220,000
3. Mark Selby - £213,000
4. Mark Williams - £191,000
5. Neil Robertson - £170,500
6. Judd Trump - £ 164,500
7. David Gilbert - £124,000
8. Jack Lisowski - £123,000
9. Stuart Bingham - £122,500
10. Jimmy Robertson - £96,225
11. Joe Perry - £96,000
12. John Higgins - £92,000
13. Barry Hawkins - £84,000
14. Kyren Wilson - £81,500
15. Stephen Maguire - £78,000
16. Martin O'Donnell - £76,500

Ding Junhui (#30) and Shaun Murphy (#31) are hanging on to being in the Top 32 for the season in time for the World Grand Prix in February, and the start of ITV's trio of Top 32, Top 16, and Top 8 events.

January is "Masters" month, Senior Irish Masters (5th-6th), then The Masters (13th-20th), and at the end of the month, the next ranking event, the German Masters (30th Jan - 3rd Feb).

Inviere · 17-12-2018 4:32pm

Joe_ Public wrote: »

It’s based on his behavior 10 years ago

Type "Mark Allen Angry" into Google and you'll get hits going from this year, back as far as 2012 on the first page alone. I agree he has mellowed somewhat, he seems to just get on with it these days, but that old firey Mark is still in there.

He's a cracking player, I love his short/controlled cue action...and he has that killer instinct that all the new kids seem to lack in the sport these days (Kyren, Trump, Robinson, etc). You know when you see him playing, he'll fight until the bitter end.

Joe_ Public · 18-12-2018 12:16am

Yeah sure, no argument there. Point is really that there’s nothing forced or false about Mark Allen, the facade he presents is an accurate reflection of what lies underneath, good and bad. That’s all I was saying really.

He’s taken a big step forward this year for sure, I’d have been as critical of him as of others because he just hadn’t been doing it. Whatever he does at the masters, what I’d be asking of him next year is a serious run at the worlds. He folded tamely last year and his record at the crucible is frankly quite ordinary for someone of his talent.

El_Duderino 09 · 18-12-2018 9:34am

I'd love to see him have a good run at the world championship. The only thing I'd say is that the world championship is a seriously long and tough tournament which rewards skills apart from just on the table. Stamina would come into play and I think physical fitness is probably inordinately important at the world's.

He doesn't seem into physical fitness so I think he's always at a disadvantage in the world's.

Joe_ Public · 18-12-2018 11:29am

Personally I wouldn’t get fixated on the physical fitness issue. After all, on the physical scale last years world final was contested by two 40 year olds who would come well down the list. My abiding memory of the sf was Higgins getting stronger while Wilson simply started to wilt. Afterwards Wilson spoke of how tired he felt and how gruelling it had been. It was the same with Williams and Hawkins. It is a test of endurance alright but a mental as opposed to physical one and that’s where the older competitors held sway I think.

For all his focus on running and healthy eating, ronnie still struggles with the mental demands of the worlds. I think with a kind draw he can win it, otherwise it will likely get the better of him again.

That’s not to say that Allen wouldn’t benefit from the loss of a few pounds or even a stone or two. He has said as much himself on more than one occasion.

El_Duderino 09 · 18-12-2018 11:58am

That's a fair point about the older players but that's more to the point that fatigue is a big factor in the world championship. The older players mental strength helped them. There are so many small tournament with first to 4 games. Those games reward getting in quickly and don't really reward 'match play'. The WC is much more reliant on matchplay.

Fair play, mental fitness is probably more important but I think any player would benefit from taking care of their body. Not running marathons fit, but normal fitness.

Joe_ Public · 18-12-2018 12:56pm

Absolutely agree on that 100%. The older players have the advantage because they are more battle hardened and seasoned match play performers. I remember Ken talking about this, how even the practice sessions in his day sometimes turned into marathon sessions that left them exhausted by the end. I don’t think younger players now are properly conditioned for a test like the world championship which is why it comes a shock to them. Not having the UK as a proper long form tournament anymore hasn’t helped.

I’d also accept that being in good physical shape could have a positive effect on mental health so definitely no hindrance at a bare minimum.

Inviere · 18-12-2018 5:17pm

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Yeah sure, no argument there. Point is really that there’s nothing forced or false about Mark Allen, the facade he presents is an accurate reflection of what lies underneath, good and bad. That’s all I was saying really.

I'd agree with that, I never got the impression he wasn't being anything other than himself.

zuutroy · 22-01-2019 6:42pm

The honour of making the 147th 147 goes to.....Dave Gilbert! Pretty annoyed that I narrowly missed out on this being post 147 in this thread.

Joe_ Public · 22-01-2019 7:07pm

zuutroy wrote: »

The honour of making the 147th 147 goes to.....Dave Gilbert! Pretty annoyed that I narrowly missed out on this being post 147 in this thread.

Well done dave gilbert, nice stat to have. Bit of a pity it had to happen in a tournament with no spectators! If only ding hadn’t butchered that chance at the palace the other day...

Frank O. Pinion · 30-01-2019 10:57pm

After just The Masters and the start of the German Masters in January, the second half of the season really kicks off in February. Out of 28 days, matches for ranking tournaments will be played on 26 of them.

1st-3rd: Last three days of the German Masters (Eurosport)
4th-10th: World Grand Prix (ITV4)
11th-17th: Welsh Open (BBC Wales, Eurosport, Quest)
18th-21st: China Open Qualifiers (Eurosport Player)
21st-24th: Shoot-Out (Eurosport, Quest)
27th-28th: First two days of the Indian Open (TBC)

Minor Tournaments Discussion 2018/19.

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